3 ms·

Some context: LoRa is a new, private and spread-spectrum modulation technique which allows sending data at extremely low data-rates to extremely long ranges. Th

Some context: LoRa is a new, private and spread-spectrum modulation technique which allows sending data at extremely low data-rates to extremely long ranges. The low data-rate (down to few bytes per second) and LoRa modulation lead to very low receiver sensitivity (down to -134 dBm), which combined to an output power of +14 dBm means extremely large link budgets: up to 148 dB., what means more than 22km (13.6 miles) in LOS links and up to 2km (1.2miles) in NLOS links in urban environment (going through buildings). From https://www.cooking-hacks.com/documentation/tutorials/extreme-range-lora-sx1272-module-shield-arduino-raspberry-pi-intel-galileo https://www.cooking-hacks.com/documentation/tutorials/extrem...

chuckledog 7y ago
OP observed up to 20x that range https://www.distancefromto.net/distance-from-sheffield-gb-to-amsterdam-nl https://www.distancefromto.net/distance-from-sheffield-gb-to...
- superkuh 7y ago
  And all of these range examples are completely irrelevant to the distances you'll achieve using lora in practice. But while we're on the subject there's been lora from/to geosynchronous orbit. So I think that's the distance record: https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-this-lora-record/ https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-th... At VHF and up the only thing that really matters is line of sight. Everything else modulation wise is just frosting. Unless you're in a plane/balloon/etc or paying for power and location on a very tall building Lora isn't going to go any further than your 2.4 GHz wifi router. These contrived setups for distant records (and using transient tropo ducting) are just for fun.
  - Moggie100 7y ago
    While I agree the sentiment that the silly range ones are just for fun, I have in practice seen good links over ranges with no line of sight. I've personally observed links through many buildings, over hills, and so forth that easily dwarf the range of the average 2.4Ghz link.
    - ausjke 7y ago
      950Mhz/860Mhz is fine, 315/433Mhz is even better for longer distance but it seems Europe/USA are mostly 950/860Mhz only.
  - orbital-decay 7y ago
    I see your 71572km and raise you a 3.5W radio signal received on Earth from the distance of 1.2 billion km: http://www.planetary.org/blogs/emily-lakdawalla/2005/20050207-they-were-the-first-and-the-last-to-hear-from-huygens.html http://www.planetary.org/blogs/emily-lakdawalla/2005/2005020...
    - sathackr 7y ago
      Impressive, but the linked article didn't uses a high gain antenna array like was used to communicate with deep space probes. They specifically wanted something with a low barrier to entry. Take a look at the antenna they used. Pretty impressive imo.
      - orbital-decay 7y ago
        If I read that right, they used a GEO satellite as a relay, which is nothing like a low-power device, and GP's point was the asymmetrical distance record. Similarly, Hyugens experiment used a simple patch antenna at Titan (that's why it's notable), and a high-gain antenna on Earth.
        sathackr 7y ago
        Guess I should have read further in.
    - superkuh 7y ago
      That's not lora modulated. My example was.
lscotte 7y ago
To me, this is not extremely long range, in comparison to a Pactor modem over HF, which can reach over 1000 miles, as I've seen on a sailboat passage from Hawaii to California. It requires more power - 150 watts or so, if I recall correctly, and bit rates can be low as a few bits (not bytes) per second with poor propagation. Being able to stay in contact with family in the middle of the Pacific Ocean is pretty awesome.
- ivanhoe 7y ago
  It's extremely long range for low-power devices. LORA is mostly used for sensors, trackers and other miniature, usually battery/solar powered devices that need to run for months or sometimes years unmaintained.
  - tlrobinson 7y ago
    Also, very small antennas, especially compared to typical HF antennas (sometimes the entire 60+ ft backstay on a sailboat, for example)
  - windexh8er 7y ago
    For those interested in playing around PyCom (MicroPython devices) are great. As an example the LoPy 4 supports LoRa, Sigfox, Bluetooth and Wifi. https://pycom.io/product/lopy4/ https://pycom.io/product/lopy4/
    - therein 7y ago
      I got one of those but only having one. I can think of some uses for it if I had two but with only one, couldn't do much with it.
      - windexh8er 7y ago
        Keep in mind that's not exactly true. There are gateways that can be used such as "The Things Network": https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/ https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/

chuckledog 7y ago

OP observed up to 20x that range https://www.distancefromto.net/distance-from-sheffield-gb-to-amsterdam-nl https://www.distancefromto.net/distance-from-sheffield-gb-to...

superkuh 7y ago
And all of these range examples are completely irrelevant to the distances you'll achieve using lora in practice. But while we're on the subject there's been lora from/to geosynchronous orbit. So I think that's the distance record: https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-this-lora-record/ https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-th... At VHF and up the only thing that really matters is line of sight. Everything else modulation wise is just frosting. Unless you're in a plane/balloon/etc or paying for power and location on a very tall building Lora isn't going to go any further than your 2.4 GHz wifi router. These contrived setups for distant records (and using transient tropo ducting) are just for fun.
- Moggie100 7y ago
  While I agree the sentiment that the silly range ones are just for fun, I have in practice seen good links over ranges with no line of sight. I've personally observed links through many buildings, over hills, and so forth that easily dwarf the range of the average 2.4Ghz link.
  - ausjke 7y ago
    950Mhz/860Mhz is fine, 315/433Mhz is even better for longer distance but it seems Europe/USA are mostly 950/860Mhz only.
- orbital-decay 7y ago
  I see your 71572km and raise you a 3.5W radio signal received on Earth from the distance of 1.2 billion km: http://www.planetary.org/blogs/emily-lakdawalla/2005/20050207-they-were-the-first-and-the-last-to-hear-from-huygens.html http://www.planetary.org/blogs/emily-lakdawalla/2005/2005020...
  - sathackr 7y ago
    Impressive, but the linked article didn't uses a high gain antenna array like was used to communicate with deep space probes. They specifically wanted something with a low barrier to entry. Take a look at the antenna they used. Pretty impressive imo.
    - orbital-decay 7y ago
      If I read that right, they used a GEO satellite as a relay, which is nothing like a low-power device, and GP's point was the asymmetrical distance record. Similarly, Hyugens experiment used a simple patch antenna at Titan (that's why it's notable), and a high-gain antenna on Earth.
      - sathackr 7y ago
        Guess I should have read further in.
  - superkuh 7y ago
    That's not lora modulated. My example was.

lscotte 7y ago

To me, this is not extremely long range, in comparison to a Pactor modem over HF, which can reach over 1000 miles, as I've seen on a sailboat passage from Hawaii to California. It requires more power - 150 watts or so, if I recall correctly, and bit rates can be low as a few bits (not bytes) per second with poor propagation. Being able to stay in contact with family in the middle of the Pacific Ocean is pretty awesome.

ivanhoe 7y ago
It's extremely long range for low-power devices. LORA is mostly used for sensors, trackers and other miniature, usually battery/solar powered devices that need to run for months or sometimes years unmaintained.
- tlrobinson 7y ago
  Also, very small antennas, especially compared to typical HF antennas (sometimes the entire 60+ ft backstay on a sailboat, for example)
- windexh8er 7y ago
  For those interested in playing around PyCom (MicroPython devices) are great. As an example the LoPy 4 supports LoRa, Sigfox, Bluetooth and Wifi. https://pycom.io/product/lopy4/ https://pycom.io/product/lopy4/
  - therein 7y ago
    I got one of those but only having one. I can think of some uses for it if I had two but with only one, couldn't do much with it.
    - windexh8er 7y ago
      Keep in mind that's not exactly true. There are gateways that can be used such as "The Things Network": https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/ https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/