7 ms·

I know in my country, the police would probably knock on the door and verify that something's wrong, especially if the caller can't spin a convincing scenario t

by nothis 7y ago

I know in my country, the police would probably knock on the door and verify that something's wrong, especially if the caller can't spin a convincing scenario that fits the location. Maybe pistols drawn, but pointed down. If someone answers and says "huh? I didn't call anyone? what's going on?" in a somewhat convincing way, ask them to step outside, hands up, and if he complies the situation is probably solved, right there. You can still have a look inside, confirm. There's like so many steps along the way where you can make an assessment of the situation before going FULL SWAT-raid. Mother in a night gown opening the door, yawning? Probably not a threat. I'm not saying I want the job handling these situations or that it's easy, but "well, someone called, let's send in the Wet Ops team!" can't be the only answer, either! There's even videos of cops handling this super calm and professionally, basically how I described it above. So it's not impossible.

aphextron 7y ago
> I know in my country, the police would probably knock on the door and verify that something's wrong, especially if the caller can't spin a convincing scenario that fits the location. This is because in your country it is exceedingly unlikely the cops will receive a barrage of high powered assault rifle fire after knocking. The militarization of police in the US is a complicated problem that ultimately stems from our proliferation of guns which turn every interaction cops have into a potentially deadly one.
- donw 7y ago
  The United States has had a high level of gun ownership for several hundred years. SWATting and police militarization seems to have started after the September 11, 2001 attack in New York. Regardless of your opinion on the issue, it's pretty clear that "gun ownership" and "police kicking down doors" don't correlate.
  - mirimir 7y ago
    As I recall, it was the War on Drugs that drove it, long before 9/11.
- joe_the_user 7y ago
  But that is ... wrong. The US cops have talked about escalating risks for years but US cops haven't faced actual escalating dangers. One can track the actual danger faced by police and it has been declining. The problem is the average citizen gets their information from TV dramas where cops indeed constantly face dangers. headline: "Once again: police work is NOT getting more dangerous" https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/10/02/once-again-police-work-is-not-getting-more-dangerous/?utm_term=.7855e1b0389b https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/10/02/...
  - ajxs 7y ago
    It's disingenuous to ask us to accept this data alone as a reason to disregard the risks that American police face in the course of their work. Whether their job is safer today than at the height of the so-called 'crack epidemic' is irrelevant to the reality of the day to day risks that they face. For starters, this data doesn't include the numbers of police non-fatally harmed in the course of their work. Even still, their risk of being fatally shot is 5x higher on average than the general citizen.
    - donw 7y ago
      True, but I think the general idea is not that police work isn't dangerous -- it is! -- but rather, that it has become less dangerous over the decades. I don't have an opinion on that, having not looked at the data, but it is entirely plausible.
      - weaksauce 7y ago
        i mean cops do have a fairly dangerous job but they also by no means the most or even comparatively that dangerous a job. if you look at the stats being a roofer is 1.5x more dangerous. being a delivery driver is about the same danger as a cop. industrial machine installer/repair/maintenance workers have a slightly higher fatality rate per 100k compared to cops. stoking the fears of the average citizen to be fearful of cops likely increases their risk of death on the job which is all this does.
- RickJWagner 7y ago
  I disagree. I own guns, as my father did before me and his father before him. All my brothers own guns. We're sportsmen, hunting is a popular recreation where we live. Of all the guns in my family, not one has ever hurt a human being. Not a single incident, over many decades and who knows how many shots fired. I have many friends with the same situation-- I don't know of anyone who has ever shot another human being. Not a single one. The problem is the dramatic drop in respect for other people and their lives. Some people have lost respect, they are dangerous. It's not the gun's fault.
  - Tepix 7y ago
    Guns are so dangerous, is it really worth it just to have "a popular recreation"?
    - blaser-waffle 7y ago
      Cars are so dangerous. Is it really worth it just to have a popular recreation like racing? Why don't we just ban cars? In 2010, there were an estimated 5,419,000 crashes, 30,296 deadly, killing 32,999, and injuring 2,239,000. There are a roughly similar amount of fatalities related to guns, though more than 50% of those are suicides.

by nothis 7y ago

aphextron 7y ago

> I know in my country, the police would probably knock on the door and verify that something's wrong, especially if the caller can't spin a convincing scenario that fits the location. This is because in your country it is exceedingly unlikely the cops will receive a barrage of high powered assault rifle fire after knocking. The militarization of police in the US is a complicated problem that ultimately stems from our proliferation of guns which turn every interaction cops have into a potentially deadly one.

donw 7y ago
The United States has had a high level of gun ownership for several hundred years. SWATting and police militarization seems to have started after the September 11, 2001 attack in New York. Regardless of your opinion on the issue, it's pretty clear that "gun ownership" and "police kicking down doors" don't correlate.
- mirimir 7y ago
  As I recall, it was the War on Drugs that drove it, long before 9/11.
joe_the_user 7y ago
But that is ... wrong. The US cops have talked about escalating risks for years but US cops haven't faced actual escalating dangers. One can track the actual danger faced by police and it has been declining. The problem is the average citizen gets their information from TV dramas where cops indeed constantly face dangers. headline: "Once again: police work is NOT getting more dangerous" https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/10/02/once-again-police-work-is-not-getting-more-dangerous/?utm_term=.7855e1b0389b https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/10/02/...
- ajxs 7y ago
  It's disingenuous to ask us to accept this data alone as a reason to disregard the risks that American police face in the course of their work. Whether their job is safer today than at the height of the so-called 'crack epidemic' is irrelevant to the reality of the day to day risks that they face. For starters, this data doesn't include the numbers of police non-fatally harmed in the course of their work. Even still, their risk of being fatally shot is 5x higher on average than the general citizen.
  - donw 7y ago
    True, but I think the general idea is not that police work isn't dangerous -- it is! -- but rather, that it has become less dangerous over the decades. I don't have an opinion on that, having not looked at the data, but it is entirely plausible.
    - weaksauce 7y ago
      i mean cops do have a fairly dangerous job but they also by no means the most or even comparatively that dangerous a job. if you look at the stats being a roofer is 1.5x more dangerous. being a delivery driver is about the same danger as a cop. industrial machine installer/repair/maintenance workers have a slightly higher fatality rate per 100k compared to cops. stoking the fears of the average citizen to be fearful of cops likely increases their risk of death on the job which is all this does.
RickJWagner 7y ago
I disagree. I own guns, as my father did before me and his father before him. All my brothers own guns. We're sportsmen, hunting is a popular recreation where we live. Of all the guns in my family, not one has ever hurt a human being. Not a single incident, over many decades and who knows how many shots fired. I have many friends with the same situation-- I don't know of anyone who has ever shot another human being. Not a single one. The problem is the dramatic drop in respect for other people and their lives. Some people have lost respect, they are dangerous. It's not the gun's fault.
- Tepix 7y ago
  Guns are so dangerous, is it really worth it just to have "a popular recreation"?
  - blaser-waffle 7y ago
    Cars are so dangerous. Is it really worth it just to have a popular recreation like racing? Why don't we just ban cars? In 2010, there were an estimated 5,419,000 crashes, 30,296 deadly, killing 32,999, and injuring 2,239,000. There are a roughly similar amount of fatalities related to guns, though more than 50% of those are suicides.