4 ms·

> I mean, by default, it wants to send every keystroke back to Microsoft servers do you have any proof to substantiate this statement? I don’t believe for a se

by pilif 7y ago

> I mean, by default, it wants to send every keystroke back to Microsoft servers do you have any proof to substantiate this statement? I don’t believe for a second that Microsoft is getting away with an OS-wide keylogger

tallanvor 7y ago
Of course he doesn't, because it's obviously untrue. Newer versions of Windows 10 gives you the option to save all diagnostic data and view it, so that you can actually see what they send back.
- eps 7y ago
  Got a link for the instructions on how to do this?
  - tallanvor 7y ago
    Here: https://www.thewindowsclub.com/diagnostic-data-viewer-windows-10 https://www.thewindowsclub.com/diagnostic-data-viewer-window... Or here: https://www.onmsft.com/how-to/how-to-see-the-diagnostic-data-windows-10-is-sending-to-microsoft https://www.onmsft.com/how-to/how-to-see-the-diagnostic-data... Quite a few sites have listed how to do this.
- mirimir 7y ago
  It's true that I can't, because that was years ago. But I do remember what I read. And some searching will find others who say the same. All of the angst about Windows 10 spying did force Microsoft to be more transparent. At one point, they were facing legal action from France and Brazil, and very likely other countries.
  - belltaco 7y ago
    >But I do remember what I read There was actual fake news going around about it. Actual as in sponsored by Russia. So finding others saying the same isn't close to saying it happened, especially given many people have an axe to grind.
    - mirimir 7y ago
      So was this Russian propaganda? https://betanews.com/2017/06/30/france-drops-windows-10-privacy-case/ https://betanews.com/2017/06/30/france-drops-windows-10-priv... Or this? https://www.techrepublic.com/article/windows-10-illegally-collects-data-at-install-says-brazil-prosecutor/ https://www.techrepublic.com/article/windows-10-illegally-co... Or this? https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-office-365-banned-in-german-schools-over-privacy-fears/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-office-365-banned-in...
    - krageon 7y ago
      > fake news > sponsored by Russia I appreciate that this is a prevailing and popular narrative pushed by popular people, but that doesn't mean it needs to penetrate into a discussion between two civilised human beings capable of critical thinking. It would be best to keep at least this website as propaganda-free as we can.
- chopin 7y ago
  There's no way of verifying that the data shown is identical to the data being sent back. For me Microsoft has become untrustworthy as an OS vendor, enough for me to even scrap my Windows7 installations.
- JeffDClark 7y ago
  I just setup Windows on a machine for the first time in a decade, it was a very gross experience indeed. I do recall it asking a series of questions about sending data to MSFT that were all by default, opt-in. One of those options sounded a lot like a key logger. The entire install process was so full of dark patterns it was really quite unbelievable to me.
mirimir 7y ago
As I recall, this is what you saw when customizing privacy settings, back when Windows 10 first came out: > 1. Go to Start, then select Settings > Privacy > General. > 2. Turn off Send Microsoft info about how I write to help us improve typing and writing in the future. I didn't verify what it actually sent, but that's what I remember seeing. I got that here: https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft-windows-10-keylogger-enabled-default-heres-disable/ https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft... For current Windows 10 versions, it's become a local database: > As part of inking and typing on your device, Windows collects unique words—like names you write—in a personal dictionary stored locally on your device, which helps you type and ink more accurately. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4468250/windows-10-speech-voice-activation-inking-typing-privacy https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4468250/windows-10-...
blub 7y ago
I helped a friend turn off the worst of telemetry and there was definitely a pre-checked checkbox that would send data to MS to improve "typing" or some other nonsense. Given that MS can connect to your computer at higher telemetry levels and run programs and download documents, I have zero trust in this company and turned everything I could find off.
- posix_me_less 7y ago
  If you have zero trust why do you expect turning off everything achieves anything? Microsoft is known to turn their malfeatures back on.
  - magduf 7y ago
    Furthermore, if you have zero trust in your OS vendor, then why are you continuing to use their product?
    - mirimir 7y ago
      I need to use Windows sometimes to check out VPN client apps. Also to use Excel, when Calc chokes on too much data and/or too many calculations. So I'm just very careful. I have old Windows 7 and Office DVDs that I bought for cash at a yard sale. I created a VirtualBox VM, and updated it through a nested VPN chain. When I need to use Windows, I just clone that VM. If I'm putting data on it, I don't give it an Internet uplink. Occasionally, I update a clone. And if everything goes well, I use that as the source for future working clones. If I need to retain old clones, I put them on an external LUKS SSD.
    - krageon 7y ago
      Perhaps you work on windows (and are required to), or you like playing AAA videogames. Two use-cases where not using windows is not an option, but a requirement.
      - magduf 7y ago
        Playing AAA videogames is not a requirement for anything unless your job is game testing.

by pilif 7y ago

tallanvor 7y ago

Of course he doesn't, because it's obviously untrue. Newer versions of Windows 10 gives you the option to save all diagnostic data and view it, so that you can actually see what they send back.

eps 7y ago
Got a link for the instructions on how to do this?
- tallanvor 7y ago
  Here: https://www.thewindowsclub.com/diagnostic-data-viewer-windows-10 https://www.thewindowsclub.com/diagnostic-data-viewer-window... Or here: https://www.onmsft.com/how-to/how-to-see-the-diagnostic-data-windows-10-is-sending-to-microsoft https://www.onmsft.com/how-to/how-to-see-the-diagnostic-data... Quite a few sites have listed how to do this.
mirimir 7y ago
It's true that I can't, because that was years ago. But I do remember what I read. And some searching will find others who say the same. All of the angst about Windows 10 spying did force Microsoft to be more transparent. At one point, they were facing legal action from France and Brazil, and very likely other countries.
- belltaco 7y ago
  >But I do remember what I read There was actual fake news going around about it. Actual as in sponsored by Russia. So finding others saying the same isn't close to saying it happened, especially given many people have an axe to grind.
  - mirimir 7y ago
    So was this Russian propaganda? https://betanews.com/2017/06/30/france-drops-windows-10-privacy-case/ https://betanews.com/2017/06/30/france-drops-windows-10-priv... Or this? https://www.techrepublic.com/article/windows-10-illegally-collects-data-at-install-says-brazil-prosecutor/ https://www.techrepublic.com/article/windows-10-illegally-co... Or this? https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-office-365-banned-in-german-schools-over-privacy-fears/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-office-365-banned-in...
  - krageon 7y ago
    > fake news > sponsored by Russia I appreciate that this is a prevailing and popular narrative pushed by popular people, but that doesn't mean it needs to penetrate into a discussion between two civilised human beings capable of critical thinking. It would be best to keep at least this website as propaganda-free as we can.
chopin 7y ago
There's no way of verifying that the data shown is identical to the data being sent back. For me Microsoft has become untrustworthy as an OS vendor, enough for me to even scrap my Windows7 installations.
JeffDClark 7y ago
I just setup Windows on a machine for the first time in a decade, it was a very gross experience indeed. I do recall it asking a series of questions about sending data to MSFT that were all by default, opt-in. One of those options sounded a lot like a key logger. The entire install process was so full of dark patterns it was really quite unbelievable to me.

mirimir 7y ago

As I recall, this is what you saw when customizing privacy settings, back when Windows 10 first came out: > 1. Go to Start, then select Settings > Privacy > General. > 2. Turn off Send Microsoft info about how I write to help us improve typing and writing in the future. I didn't verify what it actually sent, but that's what I remember seeing. I got that here: https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft-windows-10-keylogger-enabled-default-heres-disable/ https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft... For current Windows 10 versions, it's become a local database: > As part of inking and typing on your device, Windows collects unique words—like names you write—in a personal dictionary stored locally on your device, which helps you type and ink more accurately. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4468250/windows-10-speech-voice-activation-inking-typing-privacy https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4468250/windows-10-...

blub 7y ago

I helped a friend turn off the worst of telemetry and there was definitely a pre-checked checkbox that would send data to MS to improve "typing" or some other nonsense. Given that MS can connect to your computer at higher telemetry levels and run programs and download documents, I have zero trust in this company and turned everything I could find off.

posix_me_less 7y ago
If you have zero trust why do you expect turning off everything achieves anything? Microsoft is known to turn their malfeatures back on.
- magduf 7y ago
  Furthermore, if you have zero trust in your OS vendor, then why are you continuing to use their product?
  - mirimir 7y ago
    I need to use Windows sometimes to check out VPN client apps. Also to use Excel, when Calc chokes on too much data and/or too many calculations. So I'm just very careful. I have old Windows 7 and Office DVDs that I bought for cash at a yard sale. I created a VirtualBox VM, and updated it through a nested VPN chain. When I need to use Windows, I just clone that VM. If I'm putting data on it, I don't give it an Internet uplink. Occasionally, I update a clone. And if everything goes well, I use that as the source for future working clones. If I need to retain old clones, I put them on an external LUKS SSD.
  - krageon 7y ago
    Perhaps you work on windows (and are required to), or you like playing AAA videogames. Two use-cases where not using windows is not an option, but a requirement.
    - magduf 7y ago
      Playing AAA videogames is not a requirement for anything unless your job is game testing.