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A “bike platform” that temporarily swaps one car parking space for ten bicycles
- mynegation 7y agoIt would be useful for cities with colder and snowy seasons like Toronto, where between summer and winter bicycle traffic varies greatly.
- dhritzkiv 7y agoThese already happen to be implemented in Toronto as bike corrals which take up the length of just under two car parking spots. They are removed for snowy seasons and reinstalled in the spring. Picture: https://www.toronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/903d-Parking-Stall-Design-Bike-Corral-350x263.jpg https://www.toronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/903d-Parki... More details: https://www.toronto.ca/services-payments/streets-parking-transportation/cycling-in-toronto/bicycle-parking/ https://www.toronto.ca/services-payments/streets-parking-tra... FWIW, I feel more confident in parking my bicycle in these corrals than I probably would if parking on the platform featured in the link, as the bike corral is protected on the three sides facing the road.
- acomjean 7y agoWe have those “corrals” in Cambridge and Somerville ma (USA) as well
- whalesalad 7y ago> A light, quick, cheap solution so good, it should be copied the world over. It is. This can be seen all over... SF, LA, DC, Austin, Ann Arbor ... I have seen this everywhere (in the US)
- wycy 7y agoWhere in DC? I've never seen it.
- whalesalad 7y agoCan't remember where, but I've seen it. Chances are it was somewhere near Adams Morgan or Georgetown.
- futureastronaut 7y agoTemporary/incremental bike racks are common? I've never seen this before in any US city. Pretty cool idea.
- Scoundreller 7y agoAnd makes a lot of sense when demand is seasonal (e.g.: summer surges of bicyclists)
- Finnucane 7y agoIn the winter it would be hard to plow around them.
- Finnucane 7y agoParking-space racks come out in the summer in the more bike-friendly cities near Boston, for several years now. So, yeah, it's definitely a thing here.
- saddestcatever 7y agoReally? I don't believe I've ever seen one in Boston/Cambridge/Somerville. What are the nearby bike friendly cities?
- Finnucane 7y agoSrsly? Cambridge and Somerville usually have a few deployed around. I have actually used them. Union sq usually has one or two, but maybe not right now with all the construction.
- jlarocco 7y agoYeah, we have a few of these in downtown Boulder, too. Most are permanent, but I think they put up temporaries during popular summer events.
- greenshackle2 7y agoHopefully not so light that a thief can load up the whole thing and steal all the bikes.
- futureastronaut 7y agoTen years or so ago I recall a story about some guys in Eugene unbolting an entire rack full of bikes from the asphalt and loading it into a truck. Can't find the story now.
- z2 7y agoThe bigger, the easier to get away with it from a social perspective--they could look more like people on official construction business.
- dsfyu404ed 7y agoYou can steal anything as long as you steal it with a service truck or a rollback and wear a reflective vest while you do it.
- 4gotmypw 7y agoSolution: a device that takes a closeup hi-res photo of the remover.
- futureastronaut 7y agoIf I recall correctly, they were dressed like ODOT workers to appear official.
- pacaro 7y agoThis was also a persistent urban legend in Cambridge, England in the early 90s. I'm not sure how much I believe it, bikes were/are easy enough to steal as it is
- _ph_ 7y agoIt happened to me once that I chained my bike to a stairway railing, certainly not moveable. When I returned, my bike was gone... actually the railing was gone. It was about to be replaced, so the construction workers had cut away the railing. They had placed my bike carefully a few meters away, though it wasn't tied to anything any more, as the railing was removed :).
- bryanlarsen 7y agoThe innovation is that these are temporary, and are an experiment. If the temporary one attracts significant usage, it's replaced with a permanent one. If not, it reverts to car usage.
- preinheimer 7y agoI love these sorts of tests. The cost to try this for a week/month/whatever is super low, and if it fails you move on. Ideally these sorts of things are run by a non-political portion of a city government, nothing riles business associations more than the risk of losing parking.
- addicted 7y agoYup. These are basically reusable PoCs. You move it somewhere. See if there is demand. And if there is, you look at more permanent solutions.
- lolsal 7y agoSincerely asking, but what is the innovation? These have existed for a very long time: https://www.theparkcatalog.com/9-bike-single-sided-grid-bike-rack https://www.theparkcatalog.com/9-bike-single-sided-grid-bike...
- supergauntlet 7y agoWhere in Ann Arbor? I live in it and have never seen a structure like this.
- rhinoceraptor 7y agoThey have similar things downtown, I believe there's one across the street from the Fleetwood Diner.
- betterworldb 7y agothis years map of them from the DDA https://www.a2dda.org/wp-content/uploads/ddabikeparkingFB_042819.png https://www.a2dda.org/wp-content/uploads/ddabikeparkingFB_04...
- whalesalad 7y agoIn front of the gay bar in Kerrytown. It's not a platform, but it's the same concept. There is a steel barrier/structure placed there to block cars from parking and the structure also serves as a bike rack.
- betterworldb 7y agomap of the rest of them - they move year to year https://www.a2dda.org/wp-content/uploads/ddabikeparkingFB_042819.png https://www.a2dda.org/wp-content/uploads/ddabikeparkingFB_04...
- georgehotelling 7y agoI'm looking at one right now on Main St. between Huron and Washington. It even has a library Summer Game code on it.
- whalesalad 7y agoOh yeah I think there is usually one out in front of Mighty Good too?
- elif 7y agoSeems like a good way to regulate escooters. Better for cities than sidewalks, better for companies than permitting the construction of infrastructure. Flexible enough to adjust to demand.
- kyshoc 7y agoSanta Monica is doing something similar for escooters, and calling them "drop zones"[0]. [0]: https://la.streetsblog.org/2018/11/08/santa-monica-installs-in-street-e-scooter-parking-corrals/ https://la.streetsblog.org/2018/11/08/santa-monica-installs-...
- dole 7y agoIt's regulation, but it's kind of forcing infrastructure and government to deal with a problem when maybe the model should be that these companies are forced to rent small areas of corners, parking lots, etc. for corrals and charging, kinda like the Fotomat drive-thru camera film development, or snow cone stands. Seeing dead scooters laying in the streets here for days sucks, and while remarking the street makes sense in denser cities, it's a now semi-permanent eyesore too.
- JadeNB 7y agoI wasn't familiar with rental e-scooters before my latest visit to Ann Arbor, but now I am, because people leave them in the middle of the sidewalk. Fuck you if you're handicapped, I guess.
- Notorious_BLT 7y agoI would argue that the city should solve for this, because bikes and other small personal transport devices SHOULD have more designated secure parking. One person could park their car, or 15 people could park their scooters and bikes. In cities with good public transit, we shouldn't be allocating so much public space to people parking private vehicles.
- bobthepanda 7y agoWe don't require the same of cars. Why should we burden other modes of transportation? It's worth noting that overnight street parking was illegal in New York until 1950: https://www.nytimes.com/1996/03/17/realestate/streetscapes-cars-when-streets-were-vehicles-for-traffic-not-parking.html https://www.nytimes.com/1996/03/17/realestate/streetscapes-c...
- jascii 7y agoMy first thought? Bring a flat-bed and you have 10 bicycles.. Are there any security features in this concept?
- MichaelApproved 7y ago> Are there any security features in this concept? The fact that you'd need a flat-bed to steal the bicycles is a security feature. People steal bikes because the penalty isn't serious. Who is going to risk a felony and their tow truck license for just a few bikes?
- jascii 7y agoThe avarage bike around here retails for about $1500, so $15000 in a single swipe isn't bad. I have seen an entire bike rack being pulled out of the ground using a truck and winch, so yes it does happen. Research has shown over and over again that penalty is seldom a factor in decision making, gain vs perceived risk of getting caught is, and stealing a single bike is still a felony. You don't need a tow truck license to own a flat-bed, craigslist is full of them.
- zulln 7y ago> The avarage bike around here retails for about $1500 Average bike on the street? Do you have any source of similar claim?
- jascii 7y agoIts mostly an informed guestimate from spending time in bike stores and seeing what other commuters ride. But here goes: In 2014 the average retail price was $714 nation-wide (https://www.statista.com/statistics/276088/average-retail-price-bicycle/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/276088/average-retail-pr...) around here in Portland, OR people tend to prefer fancier bikes, the shop I worked for in 2006 had an average retail about $1700 back in the day but that was a higher end speciality store. In recent years e-bikes have gotten extremely popular here, their retail prices range from $2500 and up, skewing the average price point up further.
- major505 7y agoYeah... but in the end, you still have to ride a bike.
- cfieber 7y agothe real question is what colour it should be
- chance_state 7y ago>The fietsvlonder is a “bike platform” that temporarily swaps one car parking space for 10 bicycles. If deemed a success, the curb is permanently adjusted, and the structure is moved to the next location. What makes it a success or failure?
- dual_basis 7y agoPresumably if the expected number of bikes it contains is greater than N, where N is some number between 0 and 10 decided on by someone in control of such infrastructure.
- crisnoble 7y agoDo the racks get used or stay empty? Does it result in more visitors than a single parking spot would have generated? Does it encourage more people to choose less polluting ways of navigating their neighborhood? The whole point is it helps a business owner / district / neighborhood planning association test a change before making it permanent. It is a great way to counteract the "no one ride bikes, removing a single parking spot will ruin my business" argument we see in the US.
- Yetanfou 7y agoSuccess equals no serious complaints: https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-vervoer/fietsen/fietsvlonders-een-plank-met-fietsbeugels.htm https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-vervoer/fiet... "Als er na 3 maanden geen ernstige bezwaren zijn van bewoners, dan wordt de vlonder weggehaald en vervangen door fietsbeugels die blijven staan" which translates to "Should there not be any serious complaints within 3 months the platform will be removed and replaced with permanent cycle parking"
- chance_state 7y agoOh, interesting! Thank you.
- frankus 7y agoLocal governments (at least in the US) seem to systematically underinvest in experiments like this. Things like traffic congestion have a ton of weird, largely unpredictable positive and negative feedback loops. Seattle removed its waterfront viaduct from service for a couple of weeks before changing over to the new $3.3B tunnel and traffic was mostly fine, despite apocalyptic predictions of gridlock. It's not entirely unfair to claim that they could have saved literally billions of dollars by just closing the viaduct for a month or two and observing what happens to traffic patterns. Or businesses that predict their imminent bankruptcy when a few parking spots are removed to create a bike lane. Why not put down a few traffic cones to delineate a temporary bike lane and observe what happens to traffic in and out of the businesses?
- dsfyu404ed 7y agoLocal governments are generally paralyzed by a fear of being liable if it somehow goes sideways. Of course they cling to the status quo for dear life.
- adrianpike 7y agoExactly! In my day job, a lot of our customers are small to medium governments, and their primary decision points are around risk exposure. We've managed to set up our government to optimize for avoiding possible downsides instead of innovating and making the status quo better.
- Steltek 7y agoDefaulting to caution and conservatism in local government doesn't sound entirely bad. It's too easy to bring the power and authority of government down with unintended consequences on disadvantaged people. Think abuse of eminent domain or similar. However, I don't think this argument applies to cars, which are not people.
- dsfyu404ed 7y ago>It's too easy to bring the power and authority of government down with unintended consequences on disadvantaged people. Think abuse of eminent domain or similar. True, but for the past century so much power has been centralized at the state and federal level I think the abuse potential at the local level is very low. The "actually affect change" potential of your average citizen is highest at the local level. If experimentation and competition is going to happen I think the local level is best. Of course from time to time you get dumb crap like Sac country's working on your car ban but the number of people effected is kept minimal while everyone else gets to point and laugh and learn what not to do. It's a much bigger pain when that kind of stuff happens at the state or federal level.
- Yetanfou 7y agohttps://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-vervoer/fietsen/fietsvlonders-een-plank-met-fietsbeugels.htm https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-vervoer/fiet... Here's a bit more information on the things, in Dutch. They have 10 of them in Den Haag (The Hague), they are placed on a parking spot and left there for 3 months. Should there not be any complaints the thing will be removed and replaced with permanent cycle parking within another 3 months. The device seems to be free-standing and to rely on weight alone to keep it in place so those of you who commented on the possibility of harvesting 10 bikes at a time using a flat bed truck may be on to something. Then again, in the Netherlands there are so many bikes around which are easier to steal that I do not deem this to be a real problem, let alone the fact that those who attempt to load it on a truck will probably not get very far.
- tobylane 7y agoSimilar thing here that Londoners can request from their borough. https://www.cyclehoop.com/product/shelters-canopies/bikehangar/ https://www.cyclehoop.com/product/shelters-canopies/bikehang...
- Tepix 7y agoThere's a similar project in Dortmund, Germany, but you can lock your bike inside it: https://www.adfc-nrw.de/kreisverbaende/kv-dortmund/fahrradhaeuser.html https://www.adfc-nrw.de/kreisverbaende/kv-dortmund/fahrradha...
- psychometry 7y agoI've long said that we need something like this for dockless bikes/scooters. Just converting 1% of parking spaces in the city would drastically reduce the "littering" problem.
- tonymet 7y agoquick survey : how many readers actually ride to work?
- jandrese 7y agoI do, when the weather is acceptable. Not too cold (20F/-7C to 100F/38C) nor excessive precipitation (something of a problem this year) nor a day where I need to go on site (which is sadly in the middle of nowhere). Works out to two or three days per week typically. I did lose an entire month once--February a few years ago, when the snow never melted for the entire month, and I had low ridership last summer when I had to drop the kids off at camp every day in August and it just didn't make sense to drive back home to hop on the bike. I probably lose just as many days to stupid stuff like that as I do to the weather. Still, I'm happier on days when I get to bike. I only occasionally get stuck in traffic on the bike--when pedestrians decide to fill up the bike lane and walk very slowly in a huge clump.
- saddestcatever 7y agoBoston. Every day. Rain, Shine, Snow, Winds, etc. 3.5 miles each way. Gets prettttttyy bad in the snow, but better than the subway.
- CalRobert 7y agoI did for ~8 years until about a year ago, when I went 100% remote.
- jascii 7y agoI did most of my life (grew up in the Netherlands and never owned a car till I moved to the US). I started car commuting a while ago when I had a 15 Mile commute (one way) with a minor mountain range in between. Now I discovered the joy of e-biking and am riding again.
- glaurung_ 7y agoUnfortunately there's an unavoidable stretch of two lane highway with no sidewalk or bike lane between me any my workplace. If I lived somewhere where I could make the trip reasonably safely I absolutely would!
- amichal 7y agoWe have one of these in my small, snowy Vermont town. I think it’s brilliant since it’s easily removed in winter when the bike rack would hinder plowing/sidewalk clearing.
- jandrese 7y agoI like the ones pictured lower in that Twitter feed where there is a big chunk of car shaped metal between the bikes and the road. I had a concern with the original that some asshole not paying attention to the road is going to sideswipe the spot and ruin 10 bike tires at once.
- soheil 7y agoThis introduces an element of temporariness into the fight between cars vs bikes parking. I think the issue needs to be dealt with at a fundamental level, do we as a country/city decide to use more bikes or cars? As far as I'm aware there has been a decisive victory by the cars in the US over the past 50 years mainly due to oil companies pushing for it and lobbying against public transportation. Using cars also pushes the boundaries of technological progress, anything that requires more technology (ie. cars more than bikes) will make the society more technological and will create more jobs in the technology sector. Even if the solution to transportation can be solved without as much tech, sometimes it may be desirable to create more tech for the sake of creating more tech and not because of necessity because there will be times when the same tech or expertise in tech can help solve an orthogonal, but existential problem. (eg. we don't need to have a space station but we do, ISS has allowed the creation of technological advances that have provided benefits to society on Earth in areas including health and medicine, transportation, public safety, consumer goods, energy and environment, information technology, and industrial productivity [0]) [0] https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/files/Benefits-Stemming-from-Space-Exploration-2013-TAGGED.pdf https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/files/Benefits-Stem...
- rkangel 7y agoThere is a chicken and egg situation with cycling and cycling infrastructure (as there is with any mode of transport). Any method that allows for incremental advances has got to be an improvement to the chances of increasing cycle usage.
- halbritt 7y agoI read a study a while back that suggested that there is a maximum of approximately 6% of any given population will use cycling as a means of transportation without cycling infrastructure isolated from automobile traffic similar to Copenhagen. I'm hoping that the growth of things like electric scooters will drive more demand for such things.
- davemabe 7y ago
- g_sch 7y agoThis concept would make a fun (thought) experiment for a street in the US. Imagine a car parked curbside in a city street somewhere in the US. No one complains, because this is how everyone expects street space to be used - as storage for private cars. Maybe there's a flatbed trailer attached to this car. Now add bike racks to the flatbed trailer. Next, add a stairway or a ramp. Then, gradually lower the trailer a little bit each day until it becomes a platform on the ground. Finally, take away the car. Measure at which point homeowners start complaining.
- nybble41 7y agoIn my area you'd be in violation of local parking ordinances after the second step. Trailers, or vehicles with trailers, are only allowed to park alongside the road for a few hours at a time.
- gpm 7y agoWhat about a pickup truck though (admittedly, harder to lower to the ground...)
- jschwartzi 7y agoJust get one of these and build a custom chassis for it: https://shop.ford.com/build/chassis-cab/#/chooseyourpath/ https://shop.ford.com/build/chassis-cab/#/chooseyourpath/
- Steltek 7y agoI would hesitate to lock up my bike on a mobile object that could disappear without warning. It would need a ton of messaging, failsafes, and perhaps other things before I'd trust it.
- randlet 7y agoYou missed the point of his post. It's a thought experiment to demonstrate the intolerance of bikes in the US.
- punnerud 7y agoA lot of similar “bike platforms” in Oslo/Norway. Guide from the municipality: https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=no&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://www.tiltak.no/b-endre-transportmiddelfordeling/b-3-tilrettelegging-sykkel/b-3-3/&xid=17259,15700023,15700186,15700190,15700256,15700259,15700262&usg=ALkJrhj7tkTPS9CqXI45eqd3xRT-_5snlA https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&... Google Maps of all the bike routes, parking and “bike-self-service-points”: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1oO7FZepl8zXxKmx22yV91LUd1KZgYkU_&ll=59.92348788725151%2C10.730553549999968&z=11%20 https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1oO7FZepl8zXxKmx22y...
- remyp 7y agoA few years ago my neighborhood did one better and replaced two parking spaces with a parklet: http://moss-design.com/chicagos-first-parklet-in-andersonville/ http://moss-design.com/chicagos-first-parklet-in-andersonvil... People > cars, always.
- bluetwo 7y agoSeems like it would minimize the number of things you needed to steal to make it worth your effort. One!
- _ph_ 7y agoA great idea. Bike parking spaces can be set up without going through any construction work so there is no big planning or paperwork required. If it is deciced to make that a permanent installation, construction can be done then.
- wvh 7y agoI've seen a couple of these in Helsinki with the cut-out shape of a car, so they take the space of a parked car but fit a number of bikes inside. I think it sort of hammers the point home in the city centre...
- neilv 7y agoI like how this doesn't have a frame around it, and is just an extension of the curb, including for safety reasons. My city (walking distance to Boston, Mass., proper) seems relatively pro-bikes by US standards, and was experimenting with placing a pipe frame bike rack in parking spots, on at least one major street. But given the Boston-area prevalence of texting drivers, drunk drivers, aggression over parking spot scarcity (see "Boston space savers"), and high degree of animosity between some drivers and bikers... that frame looked to me like a deathtrap cage, for getting you mangled by a bunch of bicycles, if a car ever hit the frame at-speed while you were inside.
- dingo_bat 7y agoI don't understand why anyone would want to bike instead of driving a car. Why would you want to regress? Would you be cool with it if I took your laptop and replaced it with a calculator?
- Rapzid 7y agoI'm not sure I understand. From a safety point of view I'd be concerned locking my bike to something that is literally designed to be moved on a flat bed.. From a space optimization point of view, why would you put a bike rack in one of the only places you can park a motor vehicle while there is almost endless amounts of space around for bicycle parking/storage(relatively at least)?
- ripvanwinkle 7y agoI expect that among many of the bike friendly policies mentioned in this thread one technological advancement specifically the cyclist / pedestrian avoidance systems that new cars have started coming with will greatly improve the safety for cyclists and ultimately increase the number of cyclists that feel safe sharing the road with cars. I dream that it might actually lead to a tipping point in areas where cycling make more sense than cars
- 75dvtwin 7y agoWhile bicycles are popular, it is hard to imagine that human-pedaled versions will become a norm. It is impossible to imagine them used in a heat of Miami, or Atlanta (Georgia), or in Moscow. There well populated and mild-weathered megalopolis (London, most southern CA, north east China) -- but the speed, distance and volume of participants -- just do not make bicycles practical. I think the long solution is really de-urbanization of these megacities that act like a country-within-a-country. On a separate note, I find the use of word 'platform' (even in quotes) is unfortunate. Platforms, I though, mean something that provides composeable building blocks + principles for a variety of yet-to-be-anticipated needs.
- DocTomoe 7y agoSomething that often is neglected: Destroying Car parking for bike corals in inner cities tends to affect out-of-towners, people who cannot bike into cities because of distance, disproportionally. Noone drives their car low distances within cities because that would mean losing their spot.
- aeharding 7y agoThere are so many alternatives other than commuting by car and parking on the street... 1. Bus 2. Bike 3. Walk 4. Carpool 5. Move 6. Parking ramps ^ And combinations of these, such as park-and-rides, parking outside the core downtown area and bus/biking in, etc. Not to mention, at least in my City (Madison, WI) there's thousands of off-street car parking spots in public ramps, and removing 5 spots for 5 corrals in high demand areas negatively affects nobody. Unless you happen to be the 0.00001% of downtown car traffic affected by this and needing to walking a block or two from the nearest ramp to park your private vehicle is such a big deal... There's zero argument here.
- DocTomoe 7y agoNot every city is Madison, Wi, which you yourself considered to be a special case when it came to parking just seven little months ago. And not everyone can bus - especially in America, where public transport is essentially a sad joke. Not everyone can walk - distances are actually a thing. Not everyone has the ability to find someone to carpool with (which might either be related to different schedules or different locations). Not everyone can move, especially not for rare city business (city living is expensive, not everyone is a VC-funded startup engineer). And parking ramps are a thing, but still limited - the issue is not with "parking options exist", but with "parking options in sufficient availabilities exist". That being said, I would love to see you haul a fridge three miles on foot to your next parking ramp.
- aeharding 7y agoWhat city do you live in? EDIT Also I am a little confused by > That being said, I would love to see you haul a fridge three miles on foot to your next parking ramp. I thought we were talking about commuting? I am not saying get rid of your car, I am saying perhaps don't commute with one every single day and then expect to park on-street, because there might be better options...