4 ms·

> I’m just too scared to talk to them. No reason to be! They’re just another human being trying to do their best for your company and team. Assume best intenti

> I’m just too scared to talk to them. No reason to be! They’re just another human being trying to do their best for your company and team. Assume best intentions! If you’re nervous because you have no idea what to say to broach the topic, here’s something you could try. “Hi, I’m Charlie. I work for Susan over on the infrastructure team. As part of my own professional development, I’m trying to build out an understanding of how all of the people at our company move towards our common goal, as it’s not always obvious to me at my level. Do you have time for a quick one on one where you can share with me your roles and responsibilities, and what some of your challenges are here at our company?” Basically, you don’t need to say something as blunt as “What exactly is it that you do here?” Instead, just come at it from a position of positive inquiry where you’re just genuinely trying to learn and grow. I say all this because no answer here is going to really tell you what that person does. Everyone’s roles and responsibilities vary, regardless of their title. You won’t learn unless you learn how to ask!

solarkraft 7y ago
At my company I feel pretty comfortable just asking "Yo, what's your job?". Why not? Would you be offended by someone else's curiosity?
- wjossey 7y ago
  > Would you be offended by someone else's curiosity? Me personally? No. Do I know others who would be? Yes. Always a tricky line trying to be thoughtful about how someone might react to a particular question, especially when you're just genuinely trying to learn something about them. But, given this person is likely a relatively unknown party, not having any trust built up means that there can be misunderstandings even from simple questions like, "Yo, what's your job?" That being said, if your company culture is such that everyone you hire responds well to that style of question, great! Certainly no problem on my end with that type of questioning. I merely was being a bit more elaborate in my earlier response to account for someone not necessarily taking something that brief, well.
  - swagasaurus-rex 7y ago
    Do you and they not have a baselevel implicit trust simply due to being coworkers? Do people some people think it's appropriate to guffaw at simple questions like, "What do you work on here?" If somebody were offended by that question, I would imagine it is not due to any overreach on my part. It would take an especially megalomanical (or highly confidential) work environment where superiors would dismiss work related inquiries outright. I can imagine in other countries with clear hierarchies, this might be different. But I imagine even in such places it can be advantageous to be social and informed in the work place.
    - wjossey 7y ago
      > Do you and they not have a baselevel implicit trust simply due to being coworkers? In some cases yes, in other cases, no. As an example, say you're a product manager in Department A. You, previously, had to work with Software Team B on a deliverable, and it was a really rough experience. The team was curt, challenging, and often spoke down to you because of your role. There's some turn-over on Team B over the year, and there are a few new hires. You know of them, but don't really know them at all, as you no longer interact with that team. One of the new hires walks up to you at lunch one day and says, "Yo, what is it that you do here?" Now, a rational approach is to just take that person as just being curious. Assume best intentions, assume they're just curious, assume it's very genuine. In that brief moment though, your frustrations with Team B surface up, and you react, rather than act rationally. You assume that someone on the team was bad-mouthing you, as you had heard the team lead previously say "I don't know why we even have product managers here anyway." Now this new hire is coming over, asking what it is that you even do, and now you've got to deal with this stuff all over again... Or, perhaps someone who is from my generation, hearing "What is it that you do here", would just immediately think of Office Space, and immediately enter into a "defend your role" sort of mentality, rather than just taking it as some honest inquiry. Just to reiterate. I'm not saying one should react the way I'm describing above. But, I will personally say, I don't always react to questions in a way that's healthy. How a question is worded to me can make or break my response. So, whenever possible, especially when giving generic advice on HN, I try to give suggested phrases that will hopefully avoid any unnecessary reactions, within reason. Obviously, one can't be possibly remotely aware of the challenges each and every one of us have had in our lives, and so misunderstandings are inevitable- But, thoughtful phrasing can go a long way and help to establish great relationships over the long term.
- dfee 7y ago
  I know you’re downvoted, but I agree with this 100%. Technical folk usually are fascinating people but more often than not (in my experience) are introverted. It’s a shame, because as an extroverted passionate engineer, it’s amazing to see, build and play with abstractions above software. Stepping outside your bubble in a not-timid way provides access to this.
  - wjossey 7y ago
    I can't speak for the downvoters, but I don't think people are implying "Don't step outside your bubble in a not-timid way", but rather, "There's probably a better way to phrase this question in a way that's less likely to be misinterpreted." So, I 100% also agree with the sentiment! Ask people what they do. Be curious. Learn from others (that's why we're all on HN right?)! Try to step outside your comfort zone when you can. Good things will happen more often than not. Just, be mindful of how you phrase questions. That's my primary point.
- EliRivers 7y ago
  I must admit that when a complete stranger's first interaction with me is a breezy "Yo" followed with a blunt request for me to do something for them, I am not as predisposed in their favour as I might be if they had chosen other wording.
- xtiansimon 7y ago
  “It’s not what you said, it’s how you said it.” At least that HR gobbly-gook is less prone to misinterpretation. (Works for sexual harassment too)
zug_zug 7y ago
Maybe it's just me, but it's always been my experience that it's a better career move to A) always avoid using fancy business-isms outside of meetings, and really whenever possible and to B) try to get information from people first by making them like you as a person and comfortable around you, then asking. It's been my experience that most people find "HR speak" to be scary, pretentious big words, kool-aidey, or just hard to decipher. But I don't work in FAANG so I just wanted to put this out there to see how everybody else feels.
- warp_factor 7y ago
  Fully agree. And this is actually a well known fact. People following the rules perfectly as seen as losers in business. You are expected to break the ice with a more personal non textbook approach and therefore showing you are "street smart".
- wjossey 7y ago
  Fair enough. My language when I’m doing writing tends to sound a bit over the top because I’m trying to use super generic language (given I have no context about someone’s role). How’s this: “Hey! I’m John on the infrastructure team. I’m still fairly new here, and I’m trying to gain a lot of context around the different teams and team members. Any chance you’re free for a quick 1:1?” Then, in the 1:1, probe them a bit more about how they fit into the team. “Oh. That’s cool! I didn’t realize your team took care of that. How does your role fit into that work?”
staticautomatic 7y ago
Based on what I know and have heard about middle managers, I don't have a sound basis for assuming best intentions.

solarkraft 7y ago

At my company I feel pretty comfortable just asking "Yo, what's your job?". Why not? Would you be offended by someone else's curiosity?

wjossey 7y ago
> Would you be offended by someone else's curiosity? Me personally? No. Do I know others who would be? Yes. Always a tricky line trying to be thoughtful about how someone might react to a particular question, especially when you're just genuinely trying to learn something about them. But, given this person is likely a relatively unknown party, not having any trust built up means that there can be misunderstandings even from simple questions like, "Yo, what's your job?" That being said, if your company culture is such that everyone you hire responds well to that style of question, great! Certainly no problem on my end with that type of questioning. I merely was being a bit more elaborate in my earlier response to account for someone not necessarily taking something that brief, well.
- swagasaurus-rex 7y ago
  Do you and they not have a baselevel implicit trust simply due to being coworkers? Do people some people think it's appropriate to guffaw at simple questions like, "What do you work on here?" If somebody were offended by that question, I would imagine it is not due to any overreach on my part. It would take an especially megalomanical (or highly confidential) work environment where superiors would dismiss work related inquiries outright. I can imagine in other countries with clear hierarchies, this might be different. But I imagine even in such places it can be advantageous to be social and informed in the work place.
  - wjossey 7y ago
    > Do you and they not have a baselevel implicit trust simply due to being coworkers? In some cases yes, in other cases, no. As an example, say you're a product manager in Department A. You, previously, had to work with Software Team B on a deliverable, and it was a really rough experience. The team was curt, challenging, and often spoke down to you because of your role. There's some turn-over on Team B over the year, and there are a few new hires. You know of them, but don't really know them at all, as you no longer interact with that team. One of the new hires walks up to you at lunch one day and says, "Yo, what is it that you do here?" Now, a rational approach is to just take that person as just being curious. Assume best intentions, assume they're just curious, assume it's very genuine. In that brief moment though, your frustrations with Team B surface up, and you react, rather than act rationally. You assume that someone on the team was bad-mouthing you, as you had heard the team lead previously say "I don't know why we even have product managers here anyway." Now this new hire is coming over, asking what it is that you even do, and now you've got to deal with this stuff all over again... Or, perhaps someone who is from my generation, hearing "What is it that you do here", would just immediately think of Office Space, and immediately enter into a "defend your role" sort of mentality, rather than just taking it as some honest inquiry. Just to reiterate. I'm not saying one should react the way I'm describing above. But, I will personally say, I don't always react to questions in a way that's healthy. How a question is worded to me can make or break my response. So, whenever possible, especially when giving generic advice on HN, I try to give suggested phrases that will hopefully avoid any unnecessary reactions, within reason. Obviously, one can't be possibly remotely aware of the challenges each and every one of us have had in our lives, and so misunderstandings are inevitable- But, thoughtful phrasing can go a long way and help to establish great relationships over the long term.
dfee 7y ago
I know you’re downvoted, but I agree with this 100%. Technical folk usually are fascinating people but more often than not (in my experience) are introverted. It’s a shame, because as an extroverted passionate engineer, it’s amazing to see, build and play with abstractions above software. Stepping outside your bubble in a not-timid way provides access to this.
- wjossey 7y ago
  I can't speak for the downvoters, but I don't think people are implying "Don't step outside your bubble in a not-timid way", but rather, "There's probably a better way to phrase this question in a way that's less likely to be misinterpreted." So, I 100% also agree with the sentiment! Ask people what they do. Be curious. Learn from others (that's why we're all on HN right?)! Try to step outside your comfort zone when you can. Good things will happen more often than not. Just, be mindful of how you phrase questions. That's my primary point.
EliRivers 7y ago
I must admit that when a complete stranger's first interaction with me is a breezy "Yo" followed with a blunt request for me to do something for them, I am not as predisposed in their favour as I might be if they had chosen other wording.
xtiansimon 7y ago
“It’s not what you said, it’s how you said it.” At least that HR gobbly-gook is less prone to misinterpretation. (Works for sexual harassment too)

zug_zug 7y ago

Maybe it's just me, but it's always been my experience that it's a better career move to A) always avoid using fancy business-isms outside of meetings, and really whenever possible and to B) try to get information from people first by making them like you as a person and comfortable around you, then asking. It's been my experience that most people find "HR speak" to be scary, pretentious big words, kool-aidey, or just hard to decipher. But I don't work in FAANG so I just wanted to put this out there to see how everybody else feels.

warp_factor 7y ago
Fully agree. And this is actually a well known fact. People following the rules perfectly as seen as losers in business. You are expected to break the ice with a more personal non textbook approach and therefore showing you are "street smart".
wjossey 7y ago
Fair enough. My language when I’m doing writing tends to sound a bit over the top because I’m trying to use super generic language (given I have no context about someone’s role). How’s this: “Hey! I’m John on the infrastructure team. I’m still fairly new here, and I’m trying to gain a lot of context around the different teams and team members. Any chance you’re free for a quick 1:1?” Then, in the 1:1, probe them a bit more about how they fit into the team. “Oh. That’s cool! I didn’t realize your team took care of that. How does your role fit into that work?”

staticautomatic 7y ago

Based on what I know and have heard about middle managers, I don't have a sound basis for assuming best intentions.