5 ms·

> I work in a wealthy, mostly-white college town consistently ranked one of the best places to live in the country. I wonder to what extent the setting in whic

by apo 7y ago

> I work in a wealthy, mostly-white college town consistently ranked one of the best places to live in the country. I wonder to what extent the setting in which the author works selects for people who will feel isolated/regretful and therefore develop the kinds of problems s/he encounters. > The town where I practice psychiatry is mostly white and mostly wealthy. That doesn’t save it. The underlying assumption is that white and wealthy must not be worse off than the alternative. But what if the environment itself creates problems that less affluent environments don't? - Children can afford to move out of the house and so they do - Couples can afford to get divorced, and so they do - Individuals can afford to experiment with behaviors that lead to addiction, and so they do - Families don't need their children economically, so they spend their time in the care of others or alone There can be no regret without choice. The more money you have, the more real choices you get to make. And the more ways you can come to regret those choices.

dack 7y ago
It seemed like the author was just refuting the idea that particular groups "have it good", and using the classic "has it best" group as an example. So I think they'd agree that wealth sometimes creates new unique problems that make them unhappy, but that certainly doesn't mean that it counteracts all the positives. I mean, which is worse - you get divorced and then are alone (but have money), or you can't afford to get divorced, so you live in an abusive relationship your whole adult life?
TeMPOraL 7y ago
> The underlying assumption is that white and wealthy must not be worse off than the alternative. It's less an assumption and more a nod towards the meme of white male privilege - the most popular case of “You’re a Group X member, so stop pretending like you have real problems.” on Tumblr, and on the Internet in general. > But what if the environment itself creates problems that less affluent environments don't? It probably does. Scott touches this in the paragraph that starts with: "This is also why I am wary whenever people start boasting about how much better we’re doing than back in the bad old days.", but he doesn't expand on it. However, it reminds me of another of his articles, "Burdens"[0], which expands on this more in context of people suffering from depression. > There can be no regret without choice. The more money you have, the more real choices you get to make. And the more ways you can come to regret those choices. Caveat: not all (or even most) misery comes from regret; moreover, this line of thinking applies more to society at large than individuals. For instance, if you're born in a developed world, into a family that embraced urbanization, it's quite likely that through no fault of your own, you won't get much care from the family in your old age and end up in care of strangers or alone. -- [0] - https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/08/16/burdens/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/08/16/burdens/
nradov 7y ago
Divorce is less common among affluent couples.
- arethuza 7y ago
  Given the stress that money problems can cause in relationships this doesn't seem surprising to me.
- apo 7y ago
  Seems plausible - got a reference?
  - positivejam 7y ago
    I had also heard that. This was the first source I found, which paints a slightly more complicated picture, but does seem to indicate that divorce is less common among the affluent. https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2013/article/marriage-and-divorce-patterns-by-gender-race-and-educational-attainment.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2013/article/marriage-and-divor...
    - apo 7y ago
      That's a good study, but I'm not sure it disentangles income from education: > Moreover, the “divorce gap” between college graduates and those with less education was larger in the NLSY79 cohort than it was for the 1950–1955 birth cohort. In the NLSY79 cohort, the divorce rate for first marriages is nearly 20 percentage points lower for those who have completed their bachelor’s degree compared with those who have completed high school, regardless of whether they have some college or not. The gap is even greater, approaching 30 percentage points, when comparing those with a college degree to those with less than a high school diploma. Just as with first marriages, college graduates were more likely to stay in a second marriage when compared with groups that have less education. Couples that get married after degrees have waited longer to get married than couples that either drop out of high school or marry after high school. College grads tend to earn more. So it seems any income difference must account for bachelor's degrees and the extra time before getting married that requires.

by apo 7y ago

dack 7y ago

It seemed like the author was just refuting the idea that particular groups "have it good", and using the classic "has it best" group as an example. So I think they'd agree that wealth sometimes creates new unique problems that make them unhappy, but that certainly doesn't mean that it counteracts all the positives. I mean, which is worse - you get divorced and then are alone (but have money), or you can't afford to get divorced, so you live in an abusive relationship your whole adult life?

TeMPOraL 7y ago

> The underlying assumption is that white and wealthy must not be worse off than the alternative. It's less an assumption and more a nod towards the meme of white male privilege - the most popular case of “You’re a Group X member, so stop pretending like you have real problems.” on Tumblr, and on the Internet in general. > But what if the environment itself creates problems that less affluent environments don't? It probably does. Scott touches this in the paragraph that starts with: "This is also why I am wary whenever people start boasting about how much better we’re doing than back in the bad old days.", but he doesn't expand on it. However, it reminds me of another of his articles, "Burdens"[0], which expands on this more in context of people suffering from depression. > There can be no regret without choice. The more money you have, the more real choices you get to make. And the more ways you can come to regret those choices. Caveat: not all (or even most) misery comes from regret; moreover, this line of thinking applies more to society at large than individuals. For instance, if you're born in a developed world, into a family that embraced urbanization, it's quite likely that through no fault of your own, you won't get much care from the family in your old age and end up in care of strangers or alone. -- [0] - https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/08/16/burdens/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/08/16/burdens/

nradov 7y ago

Divorce is less common among affluent couples.

arethuza 7y ago
Given the stress that money problems can cause in relationships this doesn't seem surprising to me.
apo 7y ago
Seems plausible - got a reference?
- positivejam 7y ago
  I had also heard that. This was the first source I found, which paints a slightly more complicated picture, but does seem to indicate that divorce is less common among the affluent. https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2013/article/marriage-and-divorce-patterns-by-gender-race-and-educational-attainment.htm https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2013/article/marriage-and-divor...
  - apo 7y ago
    That's a good study, but I'm not sure it disentangles income from education: > Moreover, the “divorce gap” between college graduates and those with less education was larger in the NLSY79 cohort than it was for the 1950–1955 birth cohort. In the NLSY79 cohort, the divorce rate for first marriages is nearly 20 percentage points lower for those who have completed their bachelor’s degree compared with those who have completed high school, regardless of whether they have some college or not. The gap is even greater, approaching 30 percentage points, when comparing those with a college degree to those with less than a high school diploma. Just as with first marriages, college graduates were more likely to stay in a second marriage when compared with groups that have less education. Couples that get married after degrees have waited longer to get married than couples that either drop out of high school or marry after high school. College grads tend to earn more. So it seems any income difference must account for bachelor's degrees and the extra time before getting married that requires.