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> which is why it is sensible practice to download the youtube video in question this practice is quickly becoming a legal nightmare. Sites that let you downlo

> which is why it is sensible practice to download the youtube video in question this practice is quickly becoming a legal nightmare. Sites that let you download youtube videos are being taken down left and right these days with RIAA lawyers going after many of them for cash settlements. How soon before they go after projects like youtube-dl and other similar programs?

chii 7y ago
how could they go after youtube-dl? It's like going after my browser for downloading the video! I understand if it's a third-party site, because they'd have to make a copy of the video for you to have downloaded it (and only if it's one of those copying types - if all the site did was to compute the download-link, then it doesn't fall foul of any copyright at all).
- autoexec 7y ago
  The easiest way would be to shutdown youtube-dl.org and ytdl-org.github.io by abusing the DMCA or applying pressure on their webhosts and registrars and then pressure youtube to remove or restrict the APIs the tool depends on so that current versions stop working. Maybe follow up by spending a little time playing Whac-A-Mole to shut down new sites as they pop-up while you launch massive legal attacks against every one of the devs (who are nearly all listed on the site's homepage by first and last name). Youtube is the weakest link here though. If the scumbags working for the media industry put enough pressure on youtube to get into an arms race against the program (and others like it) things could get ugly fast. Especially as DRM worms it's way deeper into the most fundamental parts of both the internet and our devices. In the end, we'll always have the analog hole but software like youtube-dl is still vulnerable. (I really hope you're asking out of intellectual curiosity and not because you're affiliated with the RIAA/BVMI/IFPI/ETC)
  - chii 7y ago
    i am asking out of curiosity! but i think the attacks on the devs will be fruitless, unless they can somehow intimidate them without actually suing them (in which case, it's a baseless suit). Youtube disallowing the app is a possibility - after all, the T&C of youtube may be changed to exclude anyone they want. But the youtube website will need to somehow allow the browser, but restrict non-browsers (or non-compliant browsers). DRM is the only thing i can think of which could achieve this goal - and that is one reason why i hate that google managed to put in DRM into the web standard.
    - autoexec 7y ago
      Attacks on the devs would certainly be overkill and hard to pull off unless they are in a friendly jurisdiction. In the US at least, media companies wouldn't need a case they could win. They could bankrupt the devs in legal fees and billable hours before it ever reached a court room. Excessive way to make an example, but the RIAA has a history of being cool with using the court system to extort money from people and the justice department is stacked with ex-RIAA lawyers (thanks Obama). identifying a website vs a command line tool can be difficult. youtube-dl already supports custom user agent strings and cookies. youtube might check for things like installed fonts, look for randomly named web bugs in cache, or even try checking page load/render times. Once folks figure out what youtube is looking for they can try to correct for it but youtube can counter with something else and certainly make things complicated.
deogeo 7y ago
So in a very real sense, record-keeping is being made illegal. You could write your own transcript of a video, but that won't convince anyone if it comes to trying to spread any kind of message, as transcripts are trivial to forge.

chii 7y ago

how could they go after youtube-dl? It's like going after my browser for downloading the video! I understand if it's a third-party site, because they'd have to make a copy of the video for you to have downloaded it (and only if it's one of those copying types - if all the site did was to compute the download-link, then it doesn't fall foul of any copyright at all).

autoexec 7y ago
The easiest way would be to shutdown youtube-dl.org and ytdl-org.github.io by abusing the DMCA or applying pressure on their webhosts and registrars and then pressure youtube to remove or restrict the APIs the tool depends on so that current versions stop working. Maybe follow up by spending a little time playing Whac-A-Mole to shut down new sites as they pop-up while you launch massive legal attacks against every one of the devs (who are nearly all listed on the site's homepage by first and last name). Youtube is the weakest link here though. If the scumbags working for the media industry put enough pressure on youtube to get into an arms race against the program (and others like it) things could get ugly fast. Especially as DRM worms it's way deeper into the most fundamental parts of both the internet and our devices. In the end, we'll always have the analog hole but software like youtube-dl is still vulnerable. (I really hope you're asking out of intellectual curiosity and not because you're affiliated with the RIAA/BVMI/IFPI/ETC)
- chii 7y ago
  i am asking out of curiosity! but i think the attacks on the devs will be fruitless, unless they can somehow intimidate them without actually suing them (in which case, it's a baseless suit). Youtube disallowing the app is a possibility - after all, the T&C of youtube may be changed to exclude anyone they want. But the youtube website will need to somehow allow the browser, but restrict non-browsers (or non-compliant browsers). DRM is the only thing i can think of which could achieve this goal - and that is one reason why i hate that google managed to put in DRM into the web standard.
  - autoexec 7y ago
    Attacks on the devs would certainly be overkill and hard to pull off unless they are in a friendly jurisdiction. In the US at least, media companies wouldn't need a case they could win. They could bankrupt the devs in legal fees and billable hours before it ever reached a court room. Excessive way to make an example, but the RIAA has a history of being cool with using the court system to extort money from people and the justice department is stacked with ex-RIAA lawyers (thanks Obama). identifying a website vs a command line tool can be difficult. youtube-dl already supports custom user agent strings and cookies. youtube might check for things like installed fonts, look for randomly named web bugs in cache, or even try checking page load/render times. Once folks figure out what youtube is looking for they can try to correct for it but youtube can counter with something else and certainly make things complicated.

deogeo 7y ago

So in a very real sense, record-keeping is being made illegal. You could write your own transcript of a video, but that won't convince anyone if it comes to trying to spread any kind of message, as transcripts are trivial to forge.