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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_... Arguabl

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_... Arguably worse

el_benhameen 7y ago
I'm not sure that it helps anyone's cause to try to rank the awfulness of various fundamentally awful things. Both of these things are unspeakably horrific.
- komali2 7y ago
  Not unspeakably so - the more we speak about it, the more people aware that China is harvesting the organs of religious groups.
sdegutis 7y ago
It just occurred to me. We're in a very similar situation as Americans were 90-100 years ago when hearing about the extreme atrocities of the Nazis. Many didn't believe it, many believed it but didn't know what we could do about it. I wonder what we can do about these abominable practices we keep hearing about in China. I mean, what can we, individuals, do to help put an end to the constant stream of injustices there? The obvious solution is to boycott Chinese merchandise and vote with our wallets. But will we be able to overcome the inconveniences it would cause us? Could enough of us actually go through with it collectively to make a dent?
- komali2 7y ago
  North Korea has been mass incarcerating and torturing its people in concentration camps for many decades now and America has done practically nothing about it. I've always wondered the same thing. Why Germany didn't get away with it, but North Korea does? My only guess is because Germany started invading all of Europe and posed a legitimate threat to American interests, whereas North Korea doesn't. Added bonus of defeating the Nazis is we freed everyone in concentration camps, but I guess that wasn't why we mobilized the American war machine. It'll take more than crimes against humanity.
  - ceejayoz 7y ago
    Having nukes, and a nearby country's capital in shelling range helps a bit.
  - umvi 7y ago
    > North Korea has been mass incarcerating and torturing its people in concentration camps for many decades now and America has done practically nothing about it. North Korea is holding a gun to South Korea's head. America already fought the Korean War, what else can America do?
    - komali2 7y ago
      > what else can America do? Go to war with North Korea. Germany was bombing London.
      - umvi 7y ago
        Is going to war with North Korea worth losing South Korea (or at the very least Seoul)?
        komali2 7y ago
        If South Korea is at actual threat of being lost in war, I believe North Korea would have already invaded. South Korea is an incredibly militarily powerful nation. What we are saying is "the loss of life in a war is not worth the freeing of people imprisoned and tortured in North Korea," which is fine to say, and pretty much my point.
        umvi 7y ago
        I'm just saying that in this particular case, starting a war with North Korea means (at the very least) an artillery bombardment of Seoul which has a population of 9M+. This is a virtually unblockable attack that would (optimistically) kill hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians. Worst case scenario, Seoul gets nuked and millions die. There are other ways to collapse a regime without that kind of collateral damage. The US is not in the best position to do it, however; China is.
- b_tterc_p 7y ago
  Voting with your wallet doesn’t actually push these practices to stop. If anything a more desperate China is going to be more willing to do things we consider immoral.
daodedickinson 7y ago
Why is it worse to harvest the organs from one group instead of another? https://nypost.com/2019/06/01/chinese-dissidents-are-being-executed-for-their-organs-former-hospital-worker-says/ https://nypost.com/2019/06/01/chinese-dissidents-are-being-e...
- b_tterc_p 7y ago
  I’m not sure I understand what you’re trying to convey here as your link seems to be describing the same behavior. If you’re asserting that it’s equally bad to harvest organs from Falun Gong practitioners vs. political dissidents... yes, somewhat obviously, involuntary organ harvesting is about as maximally evil as a government can get. My comparison was saying that it’s arguably worse than just killing people, but the rank order doesn’t really matter.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_... Arguably worse

el_benhameen 7y ago

I'm not sure that it helps anyone's cause to try to rank the awfulness of various fundamentally awful things. Both of these things are unspeakably horrific.

komali2 7y ago
Not unspeakably so - the more we speak about it, the more people aware that China is harvesting the organs of religious groups.

sdegutis 7y ago

It just occurred to me. We're in a very similar situation as Americans were 90-100 years ago when hearing about the extreme atrocities of the Nazis. Many didn't believe it, many believed it but didn't know what we could do about it. I wonder what we can do about these abominable practices we keep hearing about in China. I mean, what can we, individuals, do to help put an end to the constant stream of injustices there? The obvious solution is to boycott Chinese merchandise and vote with our wallets. But will we be able to overcome the inconveniences it would cause us? Could enough of us actually go through with it collectively to make a dent?

komali2 7y ago
North Korea has been mass incarcerating and torturing its people in concentration camps for many decades now and America has done practically nothing about it. I've always wondered the same thing. Why Germany didn't get away with it, but North Korea does? My only guess is because Germany started invading all of Europe and posed a legitimate threat to American interests, whereas North Korea doesn't. Added bonus of defeating the Nazis is we freed everyone in concentration camps, but I guess that wasn't why we mobilized the American war machine. It'll take more than crimes against humanity.
- ceejayoz 7y ago
  Having nukes, and a nearby country's capital in shelling range helps a bit.
- umvi 7y ago
  > North Korea has been mass incarcerating and torturing its people in concentration camps for many decades now and America has done practically nothing about it. North Korea is holding a gun to South Korea's head. America already fought the Korean War, what else can America do?
  - komali2 7y ago
    > what else can America do? Go to war with North Korea. Germany was bombing London.
    - umvi 7y ago
      Is going to war with North Korea worth losing South Korea (or at the very least Seoul)?
      - komali2 7y ago
        If South Korea is at actual threat of being lost in war, I believe North Korea would have already invaded. South Korea is an incredibly militarily powerful nation. What we are saying is "the loss of life in a war is not worth the freeing of people imprisoned and tortured in North Korea," which is fine to say, and pretty much my point.
        umvi 7y ago
        I'm just saying that in this particular case, starting a war with North Korea means (at the very least) an artillery bombardment of Seoul which has a population of 9M+. This is a virtually unblockable attack that would (optimistically) kill hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians. Worst case scenario, Seoul gets nuked and millions die. There are other ways to collapse a regime without that kind of collateral damage. The US is not in the best position to do it, however; China is.
b_tterc_p 7y ago
Voting with your wallet doesn’t actually push these practices to stop. If anything a more desperate China is going to be more willing to do things we consider immoral.

daodedickinson 7y ago

Why is it worse to harvest the organs from one group instead of another? https://nypost.com/2019/06/01/chinese-dissidents-are-being-executed-for-their-organs-former-hospital-worker-says/ https://nypost.com/2019/06/01/chinese-dissidents-are-being-e...

b_tterc_p 7y ago
I’m not sure I understand what you’re trying to convey here as your link seems to be describing the same behavior. If you’re asserting that it’s equally bad to harvest organs from Falun Gong practitioners vs. political dissidents... yes, somewhat obviously, involuntary organ harvesting is about as maximally evil as a government can get. My comparison was saying that it’s arguably worse than just killing people, but the rank order doesn’t really matter.