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Bitcoin has not failed. I know several people personally that are paid in it. They can also use it to buy things.

by hanniabu 7y ago

cycrutchfield 7y ago
And when they buy things, are those things denominated in fiat currency or in bitcoin?
- hanniabu 7y ago
  Both
- VRay 7y ago
  I guess Bitcoin is turning out to be the Esperanto of money
  - CaptainZapp 7y ago
    Somehow I don't think that you mean that as a compliment.
- Lordarminius 7y ago
  > are those things denominated in fiat currency or in bitcoin By your logic if I exchange dollars for euros to spend on a vacation somewhere that means the dollar has failed ?
  - thefounder 7y ago
    Bitcoin is volatile. That's the main issue. You can't say that about the dollar or euro. Now imagine you get paid in bitcoin, save every month for a holiday or a high value purchase. When the time comes to make the purchase you find out that your savings are worth less than 10%. How does it feel using bitcoin? I tried to use bitcoin(as a merchant) but due its volatility it makes no sense to use it(as merchant or buyer).
    - Lordarminius 7y ago
      Its volatile because it is relatively new and not backed by a government. Market forces are having their way.It will stabilize
- 411mrc 7y ago
  At this point, it's a feature to have things denominated in $. I'm likely going to buy a Purism laptop with bitcoin, but of course denominated in $. I spent a couple hundred on BTC years ago, which has generated a nice return. This will be my first purchase, and I'll have plenty of BTC left over. Holding a deflationary currency while the world operates on an inflationary one is fine by me.
hanniabu 7y ago
Would love to know why I was downvoted
- ivalm 7y ago
  Because to claim that bitcoin succeeded as a payment/salary method is ridiculous. Vast majority of bitcoin volume is just speculation on exchanges. The massive price volatility is a testament to why it cannot be used as a currency -- who would want to make a services/job contract that in a matter of a year could change its value by an order of magnitude. The whole point of these contracts is to hedge against future volatility. Remember, if bitcoin goes up then the employer gets screwed, if bitcoin goes down then the employee gets screwed; there is no direction that is good for everyone, only stability is good. Furthermore, good currency should encourage investment (into things) which means it needs to be (slightly) deflationary (to introduce a cost to not investing into production). Otherwise you get into a paradoxical/toxic situation where NOT producing useful things becomes financially advantageous.
  - 411mrc 7y ago
    You're arguing for a demurrage currency, not a fiat, debt- leveraged fractional reserve one.
    - ivalm 7y ago
      I am arguing against bitcoin, not for something. I definitely am not arguing for fiat.
nutjob2 7y ago
The bar for success in your mind is suspiciously low.
- hanniabu 7y ago
  What would your bar for success be? I was merely responding in a way that met the parents comments.
thefounder 7y ago
I guess they have the shopping list ready by the time they get paid otherwise chances are they end-up with less(or more, it becomes a gable) value by the next day. Not to mention the exchange rate(i.e the employer uses a rate, the merchant a different one...). In the real life people don't like to gamble their wages every single day. They want and need a stable currency and low fees. Bitcoin failed to offer any.

Bitcoin has not failed. I know several people personally that are paid in it. They can also use it to buy things.

cycrutchfield 7y ago

And when they buy things, are those things denominated in fiat currency or in bitcoin?

hanniabu 7y ago
Both
VRay 7y ago
I guess Bitcoin is turning out to be the Esperanto of money
- CaptainZapp 7y ago
  Somehow I don't think that you mean that as a compliment.
Lordarminius 7y ago
> are those things denominated in fiat currency or in bitcoin By your logic if I exchange dollars for euros to spend on a vacation somewhere that means the dollar has failed ?
- thefounder 7y ago
  Bitcoin is volatile. That's the main issue. You can't say that about the dollar or euro. Now imagine you get paid in bitcoin, save every month for a holiday or a high value purchase. When the time comes to make the purchase you find out that your savings are worth less than 10%. How does it feel using bitcoin? I tried to use bitcoin(as a merchant) but due its volatility it makes no sense to use it(as merchant or buyer).
  - Lordarminius 7y ago
    Its volatile because it is relatively new and not backed by a government. Market forces are having their way.It will stabilize
411mrc 7y ago
At this point, it's a feature to have things denominated in $. I'm likely going to buy a Purism laptop with bitcoin, but of course denominated in $. I spent a couple hundred on BTC years ago, which has generated a nice return. This will be my first purchase, and I'll have plenty of BTC left over. Holding a deflationary currency while the world operates on an inflationary one is fine by me.

hanniabu 7y ago

Would love to know why I was downvoted

ivalm 7y ago
Because to claim that bitcoin succeeded as a payment/salary method is ridiculous. Vast majority of bitcoin volume is just speculation on exchanges. The massive price volatility is a testament to why it cannot be used as a currency -- who would want to make a services/job contract that in a matter of a year could change its value by an order of magnitude. The whole point of these contracts is to hedge against future volatility. Remember, if bitcoin goes up then the employer gets screwed, if bitcoin goes down then the employee gets screwed; there is no direction that is good for everyone, only stability is good. Furthermore, good currency should encourage investment (into things) which means it needs to be (slightly) deflationary (to introduce a cost to not investing into production). Otherwise you get into a paradoxical/toxic situation where NOT producing useful things becomes financially advantageous.
- 411mrc 7y ago
  You're arguing for a demurrage currency, not a fiat, debt- leveraged fractional reserve one.
  - ivalm 7y ago
    I am arguing against bitcoin, not for something. I definitely am not arguing for fiat.

nutjob2 7y ago

The bar for success in your mind is suspiciously low.

hanniabu 7y ago
What would your bar for success be? I was merely responding in a way that met the parents comments.

thefounder 7y ago

I guess they have the shopping list ready by the time they get paid otherwise chances are they end-up with less(or more, it becomes a gable) value by the next day. Not to mention the exchange rate(i.e the employer uses a rate, the merchant a different one...). In the real life people don't like to gamble their wages every single day. They want and need a stable currency and low fees. Bitcoin failed to offer any.