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How's that different then a standard definition of survive? Everything listed there is needed to survive.

LUmBULtERA 7y ago
If that's the case, you're literally saying that families of 4 in King County earning less than $85,000 are dying. I don't think this is the case.
- Miner49er 7y ago
  Seems right to me. If you don't have housing, food, or healthcare, you're gonna die a lot quicker then someone that does. Sure, you can survive for a while homeless, or without healthcare, or even without food, but your definitely dying faster then people with.
  - LUmBULtERA 7y ago
    Median household income in 2015 in King County was $75,302.[0] A conclusion that half of King County's households have died off by 2017 or 2019 (or about to) seems nonsensical to me. [0] https://www.kingcounty.gov/independent/forecasting/King%20County%20Economic%20Indicators/Household%20Income.aspx https://www.kingcounty.gov/independent/forecasting/King%20Co...
    - LUmBULtERA 7y ago
      Can't reply to the reply, but Miner -- that's a good point, median household size is lower than 4... though what we don't know is whether median household income for families of 4 is higher than the overall median, which it easily could be if that statistic includes more two-income households... so this looks unresolvable with the presented data unless you delve more deeply.
    - Miner49er 7y ago
      Well no, half aren't. The average household isn't a family of four. For the United States the average household consists of 2.53 people. Additionally, this isn't just a family of four in the study. It's a family of four with two kids below public school age. Meaning that they need childcare. That's included. As they get older that $75k number would go down, probably. Edit: looking at the study only 28% of people aren't "surviving" in King county. Keep in mind, they might have some stuff subsidized by the government or others.
Brendinooo 7y ago
"Technology" is a cell phone budget. Could you survive without a cell phone? Plenty of families have a child care budget of zero dollars, and survive. If the alternative was death, could you cut your housing budget in half by sharing a place with someone, or by renting out a spare room?
- Miner49er 7y ago
  I don't think you can survive without a cell phone, no. I recently broke my phone when applying for jobs, and had to rush to get it repaired, or I would've missed emails/phone calls that I needed to respond to in order to get hired. Once working, don't basically all companies now a days use email or text or calls to communicate with employees? How do you work a job without childcare? This isn't just a family of four, it's a family of four with kids not old enough for public school. Someone has to cover that cost. This is just the cost to survive. Maybe some people are fortunate enough to have extended family that can provide child care, but if you don't you have something like that you have to pay that cost. This article doesn't say that these people aren't subsidized by the government or others. It's just the actual cost of survival. You can survive living in terrible conditions, sure. But is it actually surviving? At a certain point death becomes a better option for many people then just "surviving". If you'd rather be dead then "surviving" are you truly surviving?
  - Brendinooo 7y ago
    >I don't think you can survive without a cell phone, no. Landlines are an option, as are cheap, no-data plans. I saw a plan for unlimited talk and text for $15/month. Spend double that on a monthly plan for a phone, and you've still cut the technology monthly cost in half. There might be a library nearby you can use for free Internet. >How do you work a job without childcare? 7% of dads stay home, 28% of moms stay home. I don't now for sure but I'm guessing that those numbers climb if the stay-at-home-ish parent has a part-time job. This is not an insignificant figure. >Someone has to cover that cost. Others can and do cover that cost and thus survive with less income. I don't share the base assumption that every family should be independent on their own and thus would not be expected to survive if they aren't. Some people don't have family (or friends, I guess?) to help with childcare. This is unfortunate, and can be helped via various means of social welfare, but I don't think it needs to be the standard for everyone. >You can survive living in terrible conditions, sure. But is it actually surviving? Based on the definition of the word? Yes. [0]: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/09/24/stay-at-home-moms-and-dads-account-for-about-one-in-five-u-s-parents/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/09/24/stay-at-hom...

If that's the case, you're literally saying that families of 4 in King County earning less than $85,000 are dying. I don't think this is the case.

Miner49er 7y ago
Seems right to me. If you don't have housing, food, or healthcare, you're gonna die a lot quicker then someone that does. Sure, you can survive for a while homeless, or without healthcare, or even without food, but your definitely dying faster then people with.
- LUmBULtERA 7y ago
  Median household income in 2015 in King County was $75,302.[0] A conclusion that half of King County's households have died off by 2017 or 2019 (or about to) seems nonsensical to me. [0] https://www.kingcounty.gov/independent/forecasting/King%20County%20Economic%20Indicators/Household%20Income.aspx https://www.kingcounty.gov/independent/forecasting/King%20Co...
  - LUmBULtERA 7y ago
    Can't reply to the reply, but Miner -- that's a good point, median household size is lower than 4... though what we don't know is whether median household income for families of 4 is higher than the overall median, which it easily could be if that statistic includes more two-income households... so this looks unresolvable with the presented data unless you delve more deeply.
  - Miner49er 7y ago
    Well no, half aren't. The average household isn't a family of four. For the United States the average household consists of 2.53 people. Additionally, this isn't just a family of four in the study. It's a family of four with two kids below public school age. Meaning that they need childcare. That's included. As they get older that $75k number would go down, probably. Edit: looking at the study only 28% of people aren't "surviving" in King county. Keep in mind, they might have some stuff subsidized by the government or others.

Brendinooo 7y ago

"Technology" is a cell phone budget. Could you survive without a cell phone? Plenty of families have a child care budget of zero dollars, and survive. If the alternative was death, could you cut your housing budget in half by sharing a place with someone, or by renting out a spare room?

Miner49er 7y ago
I don't think you can survive without a cell phone, no. I recently broke my phone when applying for jobs, and had to rush to get it repaired, or I would've missed emails/phone calls that I needed to respond to in order to get hired. Once working, don't basically all companies now a days use email or text or calls to communicate with employees? How do you work a job without childcare? This isn't just a family of four, it's a family of four with kids not old enough for public school. Someone has to cover that cost. This is just the cost to survive. Maybe some people are fortunate enough to have extended family that can provide child care, but if you don't you have something like that you have to pay that cost. This article doesn't say that these people aren't subsidized by the government or others. It's just the actual cost of survival. You can survive living in terrible conditions, sure. But is it actually surviving? At a certain point death becomes a better option for many people then just "surviving". If you'd rather be dead then "surviving" are you truly surviving?
- Brendinooo 7y ago
  >I don't think you can survive without a cell phone, no. Landlines are an option, as are cheap, no-data plans. I saw a plan for unlimited talk and text for $15/month. Spend double that on a monthly plan for a phone, and you've still cut the technology monthly cost in half. There might be a library nearby you can use for free Internet. >How do you work a job without childcare? 7% of dads stay home, 28% of moms stay home. I don't now for sure but I'm guessing that those numbers climb if the stay-at-home-ish parent has a part-time job. This is not an insignificant figure. >Someone has to cover that cost. Others can and do cover that cost and thus survive with less income. I don't share the base assumption that every family should be independent on their own and thus would not be expected to survive if they aren't. Some people don't have family (or friends, I guess?) to help with childcare. This is unfortunate, and can be helped via various means of social welfare, but I don't think it needs to be the standard for everyone. >You can survive living in terrible conditions, sure. But is it actually surviving? Based on the definition of the word? Yes. [0]: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/09/24/stay-at-home-moms-and-dads-account-for-about-one-in-five-u-s-parents/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/09/24/stay-at-hom...