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The article concludes, as far as I can tell, it isn't fragmented, it just has a bunch of recent enough versions on similar enough devices to run most apps. App

The article concludes, as far as I can tell, it isn't fragmented, it just has a bunch of recent enough versions on similar enough devices to run most apps. Apps don't care what version of Android you run, they care what API support you have, and apps can detect API support at runtime and adapt. OTOH, the article fails to mention that Apple refuses to let you support devices after EOL, and even some of the oldest Android devices in existence can run even the newest Android, as long as you're willing to upgrade the ROM yourself. Phone hardware typically is literally falling apart after 3-5 years, any truly old phones are ones that users have chose to keep on life support but not upgrade their ROMs (or made the mistake of buying a phone from a consumer-hostile brand, which is, ultimately, the only valid argument for Android fragmentation). The only company that is truly consumer hostile is Samsung. And, frankly, I don't know why anyone would buy Samsung or Apple or even Google's own Pixel series... OnePlus charged me $550 for a phone (the 6T) that has the same size screen (and its an AMOLED too), literally same parts, but with more RAM and storage, and a bigger battery, that is otherwise identical to a Pixel 3XL or a Samsung S9+ or whatever top tier extra large phone that costs $800-1300; and that new 7 Pro? Still an amazing deal, and OnePlus supports Android on their phones ridiculously long times.

pekalicious 7y ago
What makes Samsung phones consumer hostile? Their ridiculous prices? Because I wouldn't call that hostile, rather simply overpriced. And I would agree that they are. However, I still have every galaxy note I have ever owned, working, and in great condition (Note 2, 5, and now 8). My dad is actually using the 5. All of them got upgraded at least once to a newer Android OS and they are still solid devices. Granted, other than Note, I've only owned a Startosphere for the hw keyboard, so I can't compare it to others, but even after I realized that the Note 8 was crazy expensive and made me double think what my next phone will be, I worry if the longevity can be matched.
- DiabloD3 7y ago
  Samsung phones ship with ROMs that try to remove as much of the native Android experience as possible, and tend to eat battery life for no good reason. Swapping ROMs to AOSP-like experiences vastly improves battery life and performance on many Samsung phones. Several Galaxy and Note devices also cannot ROM swap at all due to locked bootloaders, which makes that the most consumer hostile thing of all. I'm not sure which models this effects, but it is enough to put Samsung on my forever shitlist.
  - pekalicious 7y ago
    Well, in that case, I agree. I've only unlocked my Note 2 for a specific reason, and never had to do it again in any device since. Battery life on Notes are nothing to rave about, but neither a huge issue. But yeah, it does have many issue with bloatware, locking, non-native UI, etc. Even if they don't personally bother me, I will acknowledge that.
  - saagarjha 7y ago
    Under your definition, Samsung is by far not the only "consumer hostile" company–your definition is par for the course for most large OEMs.
  - diffeomorphism 7y ago
    Does the whole Huawei story not show that it is an extremely smart decision to "remove as much of the native Android experience as possible"? The bootloader, knox, e-fuse thing I agree is consumer hostile. They are free to ship them locked but should include an override option for supposed owner of the device.
- marcosdumay 7y ago
  > What makes Samsung phones consumer hostile? The upgrades that make the phone slower and slower and remove pre-existing functionality. The removal of Android native features, with replacements that stop working after some time. The severe locking of the phone. But then, Samsung is far from the only ones doing this. I've personally stopped buying their phones because it's better to buy cheaper stuff and just switch after the manufacturer starts with the shenanigans.
- multibit 7y ago
  How about physical buttons that can't be remapped to anything other than their proprietary Bixby service? If you don't like it you can turn it off and have a useless button.
dmitrygr 7y ago
Your one plus has a terrible camera in low light. That is why people pay for pixel. Don't know why they do for Samsung or apple though.
- DiabloD3 7y ago
  Nope. 6T's low light performance is on par with the Pixel 3's, and Apple's gen equivalent of the Xs doesn't seem to perform as well, and the S9 also had slightly worse night performance. The only way people can beat the 6T and Pixel 3's camera is with the newer phones: the 7 Pro, S10, Honor 20, Mi 9, the Pixel 4 (when it finally comes out) all use the same sensor: the Sony IMX586. You may be just simply stating you don't like the 6T's camera app... it does low light differently. Not worse, but different, and in my opinion, more accurately. People have put a copy of Google Camera on their 6Ts and enabled the Pixel 3 low light mode (it's entirely in software and not a function of the hardware; change a prop, and any phone gets the Pixel 3 enhancements), and the 6T either performed essentially identically, or slightly better.
scarface74 7y ago
OTOH, the article fails to mention that Apple refuses to let you support devices after EOL, and even some of the oldest Android devices in existence can run even the newest Android, as long as you're willing to upgrade the ROM yourself. The 2012 iPhone 5 is the newest unsupported iPhone. Would you really want to support a phone that old and have to support both a 32 bit and a 64 bit version of your app?
- pjmlp 7y ago
  May 2019 Windows 10 version runs just fine on this 2009 laptop.
  - scarface74 7y ago
    The smart phone market and the related chipset is seeing the same jump in performance that personal computers saw in their first decade. Could Windows 95 run on a computer from 1985? My 2009 era Core 2 Duo Dell E6500 - that I still own (https://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Dell-Latitude-E6500-Notebook.11958.0.html https://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Dell-Latitude-E6500-Not...) had 8 GB of RAM, gigabit Ethernet, a 1920x1200 display, 160GB hard drive, etc. Besides the processor, those are still decent specs for today and even the processor is good enough The iPhone of 2009 was a 3GS - 320x480 display, 256MB of RAM,802.11G, with a single core 400Mhz processor and slow video graphics by today’s standards. Compare that to the specs of even the low end $475 iPhone 7. The Core 2 Duo was already a 64 bit processor. The iPhone didn’t ship with a 64 bit processor until four years later.
- megy 7y ago
  > and have to support both a 32 bit and a 64 bit version of your app? For a developer, there is no difference between a 32-bit and 64-bit.
  - saagarjha 7y ago
    This depends on what you app does.
- deleted 7y ago
ineedasername 7y ago
I buy Samsung, and now a Pixel, because I like their design better. (Much prefer the experience of the Pixel now) The price difference is a non-issue for me because I don't feel the need for the latest model, so I get last year's model at > 50% off the premium price. I'm with you: I'm astounded that so many people pay such a premium for the absolute bleeding edge. It would be like if enormous segments of PC buyers purchased massively high end gaming rigs just because. Marketing, I guess?
Liquid_Fire 7y ago
> OnePlus supports Android on their phones ridiculously long times. I would challenge that. I'm still waiting for Android Pie (August 2018) on my OnePlus 3T (November 2016). That's not even two years, and while OnePlus have promised to eventually bring Pie to this phone, it's already almost 9 months late. By the time the 3T is updated to Pie, Android Q will be out.

pekalicious 7y ago

What makes Samsung phones consumer hostile? Their ridiculous prices? Because I wouldn't call that hostile, rather simply overpriced. And I would agree that they are. However, I still have every galaxy note I have ever owned, working, and in great condition (Note 2, 5, and now 8). My dad is actually using the 5. All of them got upgraded at least once to a newer Android OS and they are still solid devices. Granted, other than Note, I've only owned a Startosphere for the hw keyboard, so I can't compare it to others, but even after I realized that the Note 8 was crazy expensive and made me double think what my next phone will be, I worry if the longevity can be matched.

DiabloD3 7y ago
Samsung phones ship with ROMs that try to remove as much of the native Android experience as possible, and tend to eat battery life for no good reason. Swapping ROMs to AOSP-like experiences vastly improves battery life and performance on many Samsung phones. Several Galaxy and Note devices also cannot ROM swap at all due to locked bootloaders, which makes that the most consumer hostile thing of all. I'm not sure which models this effects, but it is enough to put Samsung on my forever shitlist.
- pekalicious 7y ago
  Well, in that case, I agree. I've only unlocked my Note 2 for a specific reason, and never had to do it again in any device since. Battery life on Notes are nothing to rave about, but neither a huge issue. But yeah, it does have many issue with bloatware, locking, non-native UI, etc. Even if they don't personally bother me, I will acknowledge that.
- saagarjha 7y ago
  Under your definition, Samsung is by far not the only "consumer hostile" company–your definition is par for the course for most large OEMs.
- diffeomorphism 7y ago
  Does the whole Huawei story not show that it is an extremely smart decision to "remove as much of the native Android experience as possible"? The bootloader, knox, e-fuse thing I agree is consumer hostile. They are free to ship them locked but should include an override option for supposed owner of the device.
marcosdumay 7y ago
> What makes Samsung phones consumer hostile? The upgrades that make the phone slower and slower and remove pre-existing functionality. The removal of Android native features, with replacements that stop working after some time. The severe locking of the phone. But then, Samsung is far from the only ones doing this. I've personally stopped buying their phones because it's better to buy cheaper stuff and just switch after the manufacturer starts with the shenanigans.
multibit 7y ago
How about physical buttons that can't be remapped to anything other than their proprietary Bixby service? If you don't like it you can turn it off and have a useless button.

dmitrygr 7y ago

Your one plus has a terrible camera in low light. That is why people pay for pixel. Don't know why they do for Samsung or apple though.

DiabloD3 7y ago
Nope. 6T's low light performance is on par with the Pixel 3's, and Apple's gen equivalent of the Xs doesn't seem to perform as well, and the S9 also had slightly worse night performance. The only way people can beat the 6T and Pixel 3's camera is with the newer phones: the 7 Pro, S10, Honor 20, Mi 9, the Pixel 4 (when it finally comes out) all use the same sensor: the Sony IMX586. You may be just simply stating you don't like the 6T's camera app... it does low light differently. Not worse, but different, and in my opinion, more accurately. People have put a copy of Google Camera on their 6Ts and enabled the Pixel 3 low light mode (it's entirely in software and not a function of the hardware; change a prop, and any phone gets the Pixel 3 enhancements), and the 6T either performed essentially identically, or slightly better.

scarface74 7y ago

OTOH, the article fails to mention that Apple refuses to let you support devices after EOL, and even some of the oldest Android devices in existence can run even the newest Android, as long as you're willing to upgrade the ROM yourself. The 2012 iPhone 5 is the newest unsupported iPhone. Would you really want to support a phone that old and have to support both a 32 bit and a 64 bit version of your app?

pjmlp 7y ago
May 2019 Windows 10 version runs just fine on this 2009 laptop.
- scarface74 7y ago
  The smart phone market and the related chipset is seeing the same jump in performance that personal computers saw in their first decade. Could Windows 95 run on a computer from 1985? My 2009 era Core 2 Duo Dell E6500 - that I still own (https://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Dell-Latitude-E6500-Notebook.11958.0.html https://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Dell-Latitude-E6500-Not...) had 8 GB of RAM, gigabit Ethernet, a 1920x1200 display, 160GB hard drive, etc. Besides the processor, those are still decent specs for today and even the processor is good enough The iPhone of 2009 was a 3GS - 320x480 display, 256MB of RAM,802.11G, with a single core 400Mhz processor and slow video graphics by today’s standards. Compare that to the specs of even the low end $475 iPhone 7. The Core 2 Duo was already a 64 bit processor. The iPhone didn’t ship with a 64 bit processor until four years later.
megy 7y ago
> and have to support both a 32 bit and a 64 bit version of your app? For a developer, there is no difference between a 32-bit and 64-bit.
- saagarjha 7y ago
  This depends on what you app does.
deleted 7y ago

ineedasername 7y ago

I buy Samsung, and now a Pixel, because I like their design better. (Much prefer the experience of the Pixel now) The price difference is a non-issue for me because I don't feel the need for the latest model, so I get last year's model at > 50% off the premium price. I'm with you: I'm astounded that so many people pay such a premium for the absolute bleeding edge. It would be like if enormous segments of PC buyers purchased massively high end gaming rigs just because. Marketing, I guess?

Liquid_Fire 7y ago

> OnePlus supports Android on their phones ridiculously long times. I would challenge that. I'm still waiting for Android Pie (August 2018) on my OnePlus 3T (November 2016). That's not even two years, and while OnePlus have promised to eventually bring Pie to this phone, it's already almost 9 months late. By the time the 3T is updated to Pie, Android Q will be out.