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The Greeks are a fascinating case of the utter break down of social trust. Greeks no longer trust each other, and the level of corruption and tax evasion is min

The Greeks are a fascinating case of the utter break down of social trust. Greeks no longer trust each other, and the level of corruption and tax evasion is mind boggling. I think it’s a false equivalence to compare the belief that a country needs something fixed and saying that it needs to be “liberated” with the force of arms.

dsfyu404ed 7y ago
>Greeks no longer trust each other, and the level of corruption and tax evasion is mind boggling. So? They have their culture and it works well enough for them. They might not be the richest country in Europe and they're still digging themselves out of an economic hole but there's not much else about them that's worth complaining about. It sure beats living your life under the thumb of the government.
- village-idiot 7y ago
  I don’t know if I’d call the Greek system working. And living a life distrusting everyone (9/10 Greeks think people can’t be trusted) seems exhausting and bad for your mental health. Is it better than tyranny? Sure. But that’s a false choice, tyranny or corruption.
raxxorrax 7y ago
That probably has other reasons beyond their culture and probably more to do with what was imposed on them. The bribing I was talking about is a phenomenon like giving tips. But that isn't the topic and not the core of the statement. Increasing social trust through surveillance is like traversing space on a bicycle. Not even that because surveillance probably has a direct massive negative effect on social trust.
- village-idiot 7y ago
  What was imposed on them and when?
StavrosK 7y ago
> Greeks no longer trust each other Citation super needed here. Nobody trusts the state because it's corrupt, but that hasn't changed in centuries. The main problem Greece has is that everyone puts their own interests above the common good, from littering and double-parking to appropriating state funds.
- village-idiot 7y ago
  http://www.ekathimerini.com/232870/article/ekathimerini/news/survey-finds-low-levels-of-social-trust-in-greece http://www.ekathimerini.com/232870/article/ekathimerini/news... The highlight is that more than 9/10 Greeks disagreed with the statement that people could be trusted.
  - StavrosK 7y ago
    I can't find any numbers on this, or the article source, but I'd be surprised if this were new. Cyprus went from 13% trust to 10% trust since 1994 and I bet Greece is along those lines. It's just how Greeks are, so the "no longer" part isn't accurate.

dsfyu404ed 7y ago

>Greeks no longer trust each other, and the level of corruption and tax evasion is mind boggling. So? They have their culture and it works well enough for them. They might not be the richest country in Europe and they're still digging themselves out of an economic hole but there's not much else about them that's worth complaining about. It sure beats living your life under the thumb of the government.

village-idiot 7y ago
I don’t know if I’d call the Greek system working. And living a life distrusting everyone (9/10 Greeks think people can’t be trusted) seems exhausting and bad for your mental health. Is it better than tyranny? Sure. But that’s a false choice, tyranny or corruption.

raxxorrax 7y ago

That probably has other reasons beyond their culture and probably more to do with what was imposed on them. The bribing I was talking about is a phenomenon like giving tips. But that isn't the topic and not the core of the statement. Increasing social trust through surveillance is like traversing space on a bicycle. Not even that because surveillance probably has a direct massive negative effect on social trust.

village-idiot 7y ago
What was imposed on them and when?

StavrosK 7y ago

> Greeks no longer trust each other Citation super needed here. Nobody trusts the state because it's corrupt, but that hasn't changed in centuries. The main problem Greece has is that everyone puts their own interests above the common good, from littering and double-parking to appropriating state funds.

village-idiot 7y ago
http://www.ekathimerini.com/232870/article/ekathimerini/news/survey-finds-low-levels-of-social-trust-in-greece http://www.ekathimerini.com/232870/article/ekathimerini/news... The highlight is that more than 9/10 Greeks disagreed with the statement that people could be trusted.
- StavrosK 7y ago
  I can't find any numbers on this, or the article source, but I'd be surprised if this were new. Cyprus went from 13% trust to 10% trust since 1994 and I bet Greece is along those lines. It's just how Greeks are, so the "no longer" part isn't accurate.