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Basically Total Cost of Ownership (TCO). This is something people forget about. OS and app licenses are likely a drop in the ocean compared to the operating cos

Basically Total Cost of Ownership (TCO). This is something people forget about. OS and app licenses are likely a drop in the ocean compared to the operating costs of supporting your infrastructure (regardless of whether it runs on Windows or Linux). [edit: TOC -> TCO]

ethbro 7y ago
TOC seems to conveniently leave out risk as a factor too. At least at the sales level. And yet the amount of failed systems migrations I've seen... If I have a 50% chance to cut my IT budget by 15%, if I remake my org, is it worth it?
- teh_klev 7y ago
  I've seen some spectacular cockups over the years and eye watering sums of money burned because no-one factored in risk properly. And they more often than not happen on government projects, and usually some big name consultancy is heavily involved - Capita, PwC et-al.
  - ethbro 7y ago
    Having worked the consultant gig for a bit, we never talked about risk. Honestly, because most customers sponsoring projects were morons. If you told them there was a 25% chance of failure, they'd go with someone else who claimed a 0% chance of failure. I finally decided most of this was just sponsors covering their ass. If they initiated a project with risk and it failed, that reflected on them. If they initiated a project and the consultants claimed (winkwinknudgenudge) there's no risk, then if it failed those lying consultants were the only ones to blame.
    - supercanuck 7y ago
      This is pretty much the reason consultants exist. They are the employee's risk insurance.
    - pergadad 7y ago
      Or just not the right expertise to launch and manage such a contract. Sadly really difficult for government to hire the right expertise - either hiring procedures are too complicated (equitable!) or slow (thorough!) or not interested (salaries not competitive as citizens would be outraged about gov paying high salaries for high expertise).
danieldk 7y ago
TCO was also a big part of the marketing campaign of Microsoft against Linux in the late 90ies, early 00s. A big difference compared to one or two decades ago is that a lot of domain-specific services have moved to web applications. So, there are probably a lot of machines out there that are just glorified web browsing machines. Also, the popularity of iOS and Android have made more applications cross-platform. Of course, once Office documents or legacy Win32 applications are part of the equation, you can't really beat Windows. It is a common misconception that LibreOffice could replace Office. I use a Linux desktop and a MacBook and most of the Word/Excel paperwork that I have to do (luckily irregularly) does not open correctly in LibreOffice. Of course, it is an uphill battle for the LO folks.
- mycall 7y ago
  Linux workstations, Office 365 -- skip LibreOffice.
  - wowtip 7y ago
    In my experience O365 office web applications are no competition even for Libre/OpenOffice. Has that changed lately?
- DataWorker 7y ago
  I’ve switched to libreoffice from excel and find it totally viable as an excel replacement except for lack of vba support, but it has its own scripting language so even that isn’t a deal breaker. It’s just so much faster and less bloated than today’s excel.
  - zepearl 7y ago
    Unluckily in my case Libreoffice Calc (using it privately) is a lot slower when using formulas than MS Excel (using it for work).
  - loup-vaillant 7y ago
    For most users, "replacement" mean it can open and edit Microsoft's documents perfectly. For some users, it even means the GUI is just about the same so they don't feel lost. By that criteria (which are real criteria from real people), the only viable replacement for Microsoft Office, is the next version of Microsoft Office. The only way to break out of this, I think, is for governments to forbid themselves to use proprietary software that was not developed on their own soil. Because let's face it, it's not really about money (especially not about short term money). It's more about national security, sovereignty, and freedom.

ethbro 7y ago

TOC seems to conveniently leave out risk as a factor too. At least at the sales level. And yet the amount of failed systems migrations I've seen... If I have a 50% chance to cut my IT budget by 15%, if I remake my org, is it worth it?

teh_klev 7y ago
I've seen some spectacular cockups over the years and eye watering sums of money burned because no-one factored in risk properly. And they more often than not happen on government projects, and usually some big name consultancy is heavily involved - Capita, PwC et-al.
- ethbro 7y ago
  Having worked the consultant gig for a bit, we never talked about risk. Honestly, because most customers sponsoring projects were morons. If you told them there was a 25% chance of failure, they'd go with someone else who claimed a 0% chance of failure. I finally decided most of this was just sponsors covering their ass. If they initiated a project with risk and it failed, that reflected on them. If they initiated a project and the consultants claimed (winkwinknudgenudge) there's no risk, then if it failed those lying consultants were the only ones to blame.
  - supercanuck 7y ago
    This is pretty much the reason consultants exist. They are the employee's risk insurance.
  - pergadad 7y ago
    Or just not the right expertise to launch and manage such a contract. Sadly really difficult for government to hire the right expertise - either hiring procedures are too complicated (equitable!) or slow (thorough!) or not interested (salaries not competitive as citizens would be outraged about gov paying high salaries for high expertise).

danieldk 7y ago

TCO was also a big part of the marketing campaign of Microsoft against Linux in the late 90ies, early 00s. A big difference compared to one or two decades ago is that a lot of domain-specific services have moved to web applications. So, there are probably a lot of machines out there that are just glorified web browsing machines. Also, the popularity of iOS and Android have made more applications cross-platform. Of course, once Office documents or legacy Win32 applications are part of the equation, you can't really beat Windows. It is a common misconception that LibreOffice could replace Office. I use a Linux desktop and a MacBook and most of the Word/Excel paperwork that I have to do (luckily irregularly) does not open correctly in LibreOffice. Of course, it is an uphill battle for the LO folks.

mycall 7y ago
Linux workstations, Office 365 -- skip LibreOffice.
- wowtip 7y ago
  In my experience O365 office web applications are no competition even for Libre/OpenOffice. Has that changed lately?
DataWorker 7y ago
I’ve switched to libreoffice from excel and find it totally viable as an excel replacement except for lack of vba support, but it has its own scripting language so even that isn’t a deal breaker. It’s just so much faster and less bloated than today’s excel.
- zepearl 7y ago
  Unluckily in my case Libreoffice Calc (using it privately) is a lot slower when using formulas than MS Excel (using it for work).
- loup-vaillant 7y ago
  For most users, "replacement" mean it can open and edit Microsoft's documents perfectly. For some users, it even means the GUI is just about the same so they don't feel lost. By that criteria (which are real criteria from real people), the only viable replacement for Microsoft Office, is the next version of Microsoft Office. The only way to break out of this, I think, is for governments to forbid themselves to use proprietary software that was not developed on their own soil. Because let's face it, it's not really about money (especially not about short term money). It's more about national security, sovereignty, and freedom.