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Sounds like desperation is setting in for the prosecution, doesn't it? Secret proceedings, torturing witnesses... At least they're competent, right? Except the

by harry8 7y ago

Sounds like desperation is setting in for the prosecution, doesn't it? Secret proceedings, torturing witnesses... At least they're competent, right? Except the part where they accidentally leaked secret information with cut and paste errors of court documents, that was pretty Mr Bean.

raducu 7y ago
Coming from a totally different justice system -- this seems nuts to me. It's impossible to fine someone someone per DAY while they are refusing to testify where I live; you can probably do it ONCE, you probably give them a jail sentence, but you cannot perform this arm-wrestling torture thing.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
Shivetya 7y ago
just remember, many of the same people here would be cheering on the Justice Department for using similar tactics against people they don't like. You can see it in the comments all the time. That is why Justice can get away with it. They should be prevented completely from being able to use these tactics. The outrageous fines, the outrageous costs to defend against them which even some well off cannot afford, and the use of the press to twist the message to their liking. Until we realize that everyone deserves the same treatment we will never change the system.
- influx 7y ago
  Thank you for saying this. If it was Alex Jones in jail for the same reasons, you can bet folks would be cheering.
  - harry8 7y ago
    Glenn Greenwald would not. My politics and Glenn's are very different but one of the reasons I respect him is his steadfast commitment to principle especially when it applies to people you loathe. Read Glenn, disagree, sure, I do often. But read Glenn.
- yardie 7y ago
  The have the current president dead to rights on multiple obstruction charges, yet the Justice Department does nothing.
AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago
Those are normal day-to-day exercises for the US justice system, not a sign of desperation.
maxlybbert 7y ago
> Secret proceedings, Grand jury proceedings are kept secret, but they aren’t limited to state secrets cases. They are actually a Constitutional right for everybody charged with a serious crime in the US. > torturing witnesses I assume you mean that holding Manning in jail qualifies as “torture,” which I consider a strange definition of “torture.” Are all federal prisoners being tortured? If so, does that violate the Constitutional protection against cruel and unusual punishment? Should they all be freed? They certainly are pressuring this witness, but it’s actually not out of the ordinary for the US criminal justice system. The prosecutors handling Operation Varsity Blues have the same tools, and will use them this way if they think it will help. Valerie Plame’s time in jail was for contempt for refusing to appear in front of a grand jury because by doing so she wouldn’t be able to keep a journalism source secret.

by harry8 7y ago

raducu 7y ago

Coming from a totally different justice system -- this seems nuts to me. It's impossible to fine someone someone per DAY while they are refusing to testify where I live; you can probably do it ONCE, you probably give them a jail sentence, but you cannot perform this arm-wrestling torture thing.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

Shivetya 7y ago

just remember, many of the same people here would be cheering on the Justice Department for using similar tactics against people they don't like. You can see it in the comments all the time. That is why Justice can get away with it. They should be prevented completely from being able to use these tactics. The outrageous fines, the outrageous costs to defend against them which even some well off cannot afford, and the use of the press to twist the message to their liking. Until we realize that everyone deserves the same treatment we will never change the system.

influx 7y ago
Thank you for saying this. If it was Alex Jones in jail for the same reasons, you can bet folks would be cheering.
- harry8 7y ago
  Glenn Greenwald would not. My politics and Glenn's are very different but one of the reasons I respect him is his steadfast commitment to principle especially when it applies to people you loathe. Read Glenn, disagree, sure, I do often. But read Glenn.
yardie 7y ago
The have the current president dead to rights on multiple obstruction charges, yet the Justice Department does nothing.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 7y ago

Those are normal day-to-day exercises for the US justice system, not a sign of desperation.

maxlybbert 7y ago

> Secret proceedings, Grand jury proceedings are kept secret, but they aren’t limited to state secrets cases. They are actually a Constitutional right for everybody charged with a serious crime in the US. > torturing witnesses I assume you mean that holding Manning in jail qualifies as “torture,” which I consider a strange definition of “torture.” Are all federal prisoners being tortured? If so, does that violate the Constitutional protection against cruel and unusual punishment? Should they all be freed? They certainly are pressuring this witness, but it’s actually not out of the ordinary for the US criminal justice system. The prosecutors handling Operation Varsity Blues have the same tools, and will use them this way if they think it will help. Valerie Plame’s time in jail was for contempt for refusing to appear in front of a grand jury because by doing so she wouldn’t be able to keep a journalism source secret.