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Dallas Has Now Lost 82 Cases Against Robert Groden (2016)
- inflatableDodo 7y agoSomeone should go to jail for this. And it isn't the guy with the sign.
- CriticalCathed 7y agoWhen can we say that the City is committing a criminal offense?
- LanceH 7y agoWhen the city decides to allow you.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- onli 7y agoNow. Putting a guy in jail to withheld him from his medication, which is on record, could be attempted murder. At the very least its criminal police misconduct.
- mattnewport 7y agoIt sounds like deprivation of rights under color of law when the officer knew he had committed no crime which is a serious offense.
- vkou 7y ago> Now. Putting a guy in jail to withheld him from his medication, which is on record, could be attempted murder. This comes off sounding incredibly naive. This happens every single day, thousands of times over, and there's narly a peep about it. When you're picked up, and sitting in jail, nobody gives a shit about your medication. When you end up getting a part-time sentence (Come to jail on Friday night, leave on Monday morning for X weeks) for a misdemeanor, nobody gives a shit that you're taking prescription medication for a chronic issue, either.
- onli 7y agoAnd every single time this is a crime committed by officers of the law, sometimes - like possibly here - attempted murder, ranging from various forms of manslaughter to torture etc, in general unlawfully causing bodily harm. That you think it's normal in your system does not make it any better.
- birdman3131 7y agoAny updates on this? It is from 2016.
- tastroder 7y agoLooks like two strokes wore him down enough to settle in 2017. https://www.dallasobserver.com/news/robert-groden-kennedy-assassination-expert-settles-with-dallas-over-dealey-plaza-arrests-9260827 https://www.dallasobserver.com/news/robert-groden-kennedy-as...
- olivermarks 7y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_J._Groden https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_J._Groden
- chrischen 7y agoThe article says it's actually the city that settled to pay him $25,000.
- dorfsmay 7y agoThat seems very low for 82 wrongful court case, and crass to wait until he is 79 yo and had 2 strokes before they settle. It also raises question about abuse of power and justice for people who are not rich.
- HillRat 7y agoA new city attorney settled with him a year later as part of an effort to get the city free of a whole raft of §1983 violations, the sort of incessant petty but systemic abuses of authority that can lead to municipal bankruptcy.
- dang 7y agoGood catch; year added above.
- rjbwork 7y agoHe settled and is able to do it free and clear as of a couple of years ago. I visited dallas last summer and went to talk to him for a few minutes. Had no cash on me so I couldn't buy one of his DVD's he's selling. He needs to get square or something. Seemed like an alright guy. I thanked him for fighting the good fight against government overreach and went on my way.
- evilsoc 7y agoThis is what institutionalized evil looks like.
- tempter51010101 7y agoKeep in mind that he's been ticketed 82 times, not sued by the city or charged by the city district attorney. That is why the lower court ruled that his civil case against the city didn't stand, since he couldn't name a specific person he was suing. While continuously suing a person can be considered harassment, a city can ticket a individual indefinately. As long as it's not based on any class-protected issues such as race, religion, ethnicity, etc, the ticket can be for anything.
- ARandomerDude 7y ago> not...charged by the city district attorney > a city can ticket a individual indefinately For breaking the law. That's the point. A ticket, no matter how small, is punishment for a criminal offense. Knowingly ticketing and arresting the guy is wrong. The fact that it is the judge who repeatedly throws it out means the prosecutors are moving forward with charges.
- jhayward 7y ago> A ticket, no matter how small, is punishment for a criminal offense No, very often citations are given citing part of the civil code, not the criminal code. Just because a court is involved doesn't mean it's a crime.
- tssva 7y agoA ticket is not punishment for a crime. A ticket is a summons charging you of commiting a crime. When you pay a ticket you are pleading guilty to the offense and paying the predetermined fine which is the punishment for commiting the crime. You can also appeal the ticket which then allows you to argue your innocence in a court. If the court finds you guilty they will then issue you a fine which is your punishment.
- the_watcher 7y agoNope. Many are not. Getting a speeding ticket is not a criminal offense. Same with most "did a thing without a permit" violations.
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- tres 7y agoHacking the system, following a vision going against the grain and persistence in the face of overwhelming obstacles. Maybe this guy should apply for YC.
- TelmoMenezes 7y ago"Hacking the system" now means being funded by the system? It used to mean something else when I was a kid...
- mannykannot 7y agoThat would be the apotheosis of hacking the system.
- TelmoMenezes 7y agoWell, not really if you are just doing what the system wants.
- paulcole 7y agoThe weakest point of his YC application is that he’s in a vertical where there are no laws to break. Ideally he’d actually be doing something illegal to limit ethical competitors.
- josh_fyi 7y agoWhy hasn't the city fenced off the knoll, and built something, say a utility shed, on it? It's good to see that you can fight City Hall and that City Hall can be incompetent in their brutality.
- 13of40 7y agoI'd put in a retaining wall along the sidewalk, level the surface on top, and cover it with shrubbery and paving stones. https://weekendroady.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/dallas5.jpg https://weekendroady.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/dallas5.jpg I'm sure that would put all of the conspiracy theories to rest!
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- bluGill 7y agoThe knoll was there long before JFK was shot.
- tomrod 7y agoHit an ad wall. Outline: https://outline.com/z28n5H https://outline.com/z28n5H
- yesplorer 7y agoWhat is an Ad wall? You mean the showed an ad you could have easily avoided with half the time you used in creating this outline link? Journalism, especially, local journalism should be supported if we don't want listicles to dominate. The website isn't subscription based. No need to click on their ad, but no need to actively encourage others to avoid it.
- tomrod 7y agoAn ad wall is something that prevents viewing of content without removing an adblocker, typically operating as a soft pay wall. Ads have turned into target vectors for malicious payloads, and as such are reasonable to keep blocked especially for unsophisticated sites that may not have invested in any sort of ad monitoring security, akin to keeping one's shoes on in a public location. The analogous grass may look appealing to the bare foot, but may also contain a used needle, broken glass, or other unpleasantries.
- glenneroo 7y ago> Journalism, especially, local journalism should be supported if we don't want listicles to dominate. The Guardian recently proved that it's possible to do journalism without "ad-walls": https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19799893 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19799893
- teilo 7y agoThere was a link for me to "Continue to site" and the ad wall went away.
- superhuzza 7y agoJust a warning, some sites seem to have defences against outline. I was reading an 'outlined' article from the NYT and entire paragraprhs were clearly missing.
- RappingBoomer 7y agogovt workers are very rarely fired...so they are not afraid of abusing the system like this
- barking 7y agoIn the case of Groden it's sort of like the employer (taxpayer) being persecuted by his employees (public servants).
- azhenley 7y agoWouldn't that be true for most people who commit crimes? They pay taxes and get persecuted by public servants.
- classicsnoot 7y agoYou are making the assumption that criminals pay taxes. I'm sure some of them do, but I would be interested to see some real numbers on it.
- vkou 7y agoIf they aren't homeless, they pay property taxes, directly, or via their landlord. If they buy anything in a state with sales taxes, they pay sales taxes. If they legally own a car, they pay vehicle taxes. If they buy gas for that car, they pay gas taxes. Nearly every man, woman, and child in the United States pays taxes.
- barking 7y agoCriminals are persecuted for their criminality. That's a whole different scenario to what was happening to Mr Groden where a law abiding citizen was being harassed because people in authority felt like it.
- mindslight 7y agoTaxation creates no employment relationship. Direction of money flow is orthogonal to power imbalance. Here are some examples of patronage in order of diminishing accountability: Employer-Employee, Consultancy-Client, HugeStore-Customer, Government-Subject, Mugger-Victim.
- eequah9L 7y agoFrom wikipedia article on Robert Groden: > One motivation for the city bringing the suits is a city > planning effort to prevent anyone from encouraging visitors > to recognize the site of the assassination as a tourist > destination. Congratulations to the city of Dallas for a flawless execution of Streisand effect. (Edit: formatting.)
- PMan74 7y agoIn fairness it's not like the site wasn't already world famous. I'm not even American and I know of it and have been there. The city's (farcical) efforts are not making the site more famous.
- C1sc0cat 7y agoWhy is not the State legislature not stepping in and sanctioning the City officials / elected councillors
- larrydag 7y agoI live in Dallas. There is certainly a lot of street vendors showing JFK consipiracies. This man is certainly not the only one. There is even a non-profit museum in the sixth floor of the warehouse building where shooting took place. I don't understand why Dallas or Texas doesn't memorialize this location. Yes it is a stain upon America but it is also a vital part of American history. They need to treat this area as they would any dignified place with respect for a U.S. president. I've visited Ford's theatre where Lincoln was assassinated and they have a small memorial. I think it just gives fuel to the conspiracy theorists out there by not giving it the due respect the location deserves.
- azhenley 7y agoI agree. The National Civil Rights museum is built at the location of MLK's shooting. One of the best museums I have visited.
- larrydag 7y agoNote there is a JFK Memorial in Dallas but it is not near the site of Dealey Plaza https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Fitzgerald_Kennedy_Memorial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Fitzgerald_Kennedy_Memori...
- larrydag 7y agoThe Sixth Floor Museum is a really good museum but it is not a U.S. national site. https://www.jfk.org/ https://www.jfk.org/
- bluGill 7y agoI found it really strange when visiting. This conspiracy theorist showing me the "supposed window", and the place where jfk was shot and claiming it is impossible to hit. I've done enough hunting to know it isn't a hard shot. The 6th floor museum is worth visiting as well.
- ryanmarsh 7y agoIn no way do I mean to diminish your hunting and marksmanship skills, however I think we should acknowledge how hard it is to get a head shot on a moving target.
- OliverJones 7y agoYikes. Doesn't Dallas have a city council? Don't they have the power to regulate street vendors? If they don't want a souvenir stand in a particular place, why don't they pass an ordinance? There's probably more to this story.
- defertoreptar 7y agoThat's what I was wondering. After 82 cases, you'd think it'd be easier to just require vendors to have a license.
- e40 7y agoIt's almost as if Dallas wants to lose these cases. I mean, how hard would it be to look up the code before you write the ticket, knowing he's going to challenge it?? Or, maybe they just want to harass him, but at this point they are looking pretty bad. Makes no sense.
- camgunz 7y agoThis guy should sue the city. I can't even imagine this happening 5 times, let alone over 80. Dallas should have to make him rich.
- chrismeller 7y agoIf you read the article... he’s tried. They agreed to stop harassing him until a retrial and instead have started harassing his assistant.
- camgunz 7y agoHah OK fair, I admit to skimming. That "can't identify the top-level official responsible for his ticketing" excuse is pretty odious, good god.
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