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Is Noise Pollution the Next Big Public-Health Crisis?
- anotheryou 7y agoAs long as there is open offices there is a easy fix to lower pollution to 20% by doing home-office.
- aaron695 7y agoOffices are far more likely to have double glazing to remove the damageing noise like cars, so no. Plus working from home is known to also be damaging, so you've introduced a new hazard for no reason. ( And I know, the reader can work from home without the damage because 'they' are the exception to the rule )
- tty2300 7y agoI used to think my office was quiet until I got noise cancelling headphones. Now every time I take them off I am hit with a deafening ambiant noise which I think is a combination of the fans in peoples computers and the sound of cars making it through the building walls.
- davidivadavid 7y agoSame for a bunch of noise at home (mostly from the fridge).
- lupire 7y agoWhite noise is a good way to filter out spectral peaks that are more disturbing.
- frosted-flakes 7y agoI prefer a pink noise myself. https://mynoise.net https://mynoise.net is great for this. There are loads of sound generators for different environments, each of which has sliders for each frequency. I sometimes use it when I have trouble falling asleep (I pin the site to my homepage on Android Chrome).
- jdnier 7y agoThanks. An interesting one: "Neuromodulator • A sound designed to squash down your tinnitus"
- mgkimsal 7y agofrosted flakes mentioned pink noise; i recommend brown and/or grey noise. it really depends on the type of noise you're trying to counter, but these really helped me a lot with various types of road noise and lawnmower-style noise. pink, to my ears, is a bit thin/tinny, and doesn't assist much with my trigger points.
- rootusrootus 7y agoIf your office has a significant amount of open space, chances are pretty good they're using white/pink noise generators to try and mask distracting sounds (conversations, etc). Last place I worked at had one big room that was a couple hundred feet square, and they had the noise generators cranked up so high that you couldn't successfully have a conversation with someone unless they were within about five feet of you. When I'd walk outside, it was a physical relief from the onslaught of white noise.
- b_tterc_p 7y agoFirst half of the article felt more likely to be a modern risk due to earbuds. Actual ambient noise pollution might be a problem, but I doubt it. I don’t see how such studies could adequately control for air pollution. On a related note, this quote from the article didn’t make any sense to me: > ‘If you could eliminate all motor-vehicle noise or all motor-vehicle air pollution—but not both—which would you choose?’ As a rule, the majority chose noise.”
- atomical 7y agoNoise is the obvious answer if the respondents are in a city with a low AQI number. It can be hard to breathe in large cities in India and China.
- FrozenVoid 7y agoIt makes perfect sense, people can't see pollution - they hear noise.
- atomical 7y agoI didn't realize it when signing but the apartment I'm staying in through Bungalow is under a flight path. There is a curfew for flights at night but that only covers departures. Airplanes can still land at any hour. It's a slow torture. I can't wait to leave San Diego.
- shados 7y agoI did a ton of research when I got my place, about the area and all its quirk. It was fine. I bought it, then 2 years later a nearby airport changed their software which modified some flight routes, and more importantly lowered the altitude planes flew over extremely densely populated areas, making them incredibly noisy. All this happened in the name of saving fuel. Now I haven't opened the windows in years, especially not at night (else its impossible to sleep), the outdoor deck is unusable except for days where planes don't actually fly over because of wind direction, etc. Starting to plan selling the place partly because of it. Fortunately a lot of people swear until they're blue in the face that this isn't happening (even though its easy to find proof), so resell value isn't affected.
- atomical 7y agoBungalow's leasing agent told me the house had air conditioning. There was a thermostat when I toured. Upon moving in I found out the house doesn't actually have air conditioning. Closing the windows won't be an option in the summer. A lot of people say they are used to the sound and don't notice it. That's just not true though. I've sat outside at a bar and had a conversation interrupted because a plane flew overhead.
- briandear 7y agoI live on Moffett Field and the noise from the 101 is deafening and the occasional noise from a C-130 isn’t even noticeable. Freeway noise is far more disruptive than almost airplanes.
- 80mph 7y agoHearing that (no pun intended) doesn't give me hope for the new Moffett housing development, which I believe, would be even closer to 101 than Wescoat Village. https://mv-voice.com/news/2018/06/01/nasa-picks-partner-for-huge-moffett-housing-development https://mv-voice.com/news/2018/06/01/nasa-picks-partner-for-...
- Creationer 7y agoThe technology is ready - EVs - but the ramp up is taking too long. States and cities need to ban the sale of new non-hybrid ICE vehicles starting now - there are already options at all price points.
- tamaharbor 7y agoDon’t they require that EV’s make noise to warn pedestrians?
- i_am_proteus 7y agoThis does not seem reasonable. Internal combustion engines with mufflers are not very loud. If the goal is to reduce noise, why not simply set a maximum noise level, such as n dB at 1m from the tailpipe?
- chrismcb 7y agoWhy are hybrids ok? And what exactly defines a hybrid?
- lupire 7y agoAn EV costs $10K+ premium over a comparable gas vehicle. Combustion engines are quieter than the tire+road/wind noise of a car at speed.
- maximus1983 7y agoThere is noway I am going to buy a new vehicle. I already have a car that is economical and reliable. EVs are great if you have the money for one but I am not putting my hand in my pocket when I have like a house to pay off first.
- Anechoic 7y agoThe technology is ready - EVs - but the ramp up is taking too long. Above about 30-35 mph, EV's aren't much quieter than ICE cars, the contribution from road/tire noise starts to dominate for both types of autos above those speeds.
- briandear 7y agoWhat seven seater electric is available at a price point below $70k? Any electric minivans yet? How about electric jeeps under $50k? Can you tow a large trailer with electric vehicles under $100k? There aren’t “options at all price points.”
- Causality1 7y agoGod I love not living in a dense city. I haven't heard a car horn in days. The air outside smells better than the air inside. Visiting NYC my biggest impression was how much a nightmare it would've been for me to live there. It sounded like a vacuum running all the time. It was all dark because the buildings blocked sunlight. The air made my nose burn. Seeing a tree and a patch of grass on a streetcorner was like an oasis in the middle of a concrete desert.
- lupire 7y agoIn the suburbs we get the buzz of gas-powered motors all day when we are home.
- nullc 7y agoSome places are doing something about that: https://www.marinij.com/2016/11/11/marin-voice-why-larkspurs-proposed-leaf-blower-restrictions-go-too-far/ https://www.marinij.com/2016/11/11/marin-voice-why-larkspurs... http://claycord.com/2018/12/06/group-looks-to-ban-gas-powered-leaf-blowers-in-walnut-creek/ http://claycord.com/2018/12/06/group-looks-to-ban-gas-powere... The trimmers and leaf blowers were the worst part of living in mountain view for me. My apartment had no AC (didn't really need it 99% of the time), so that meant open windows... and almost every day had a different neighbors lawn service blasting noise in the morning. Sometimes waking me up, almost always making it impossible to work from home.
- viburnum 7y agoI swear the quietest place to live is a pretty narrow street in a medium density urban neighborhood. All the buildings and trees really deaden the sound. When I lived in the boonies there was always a wood chipper going somewhere or barking dogs and nothing to break up the sound.
- adrianN 7y agoI live in Berlin. There are many very quiet neighborhoods and the city in general is a lot quieter than London or San Francisco. I never heard a car horn from my apartment.
- itsaidpens 7y agoThe police need to crack down on incredibly loud motorcycles.
- maximus1983 7y agoWhy? The whole point of one is to show how much of an arsehole you are. :D
- booleandilemma 7y agoAnd the sociopaths blasting music from their cars at 2am.
- BasicObject 7y agoHow about all the lifted trucks with vertical / smoke stack type exhaust while they're at it?
- majos 7y agoDo these things actually contribute meaningfully to air pollution? I think "rolling coal" is silly because it's so childishly spiteful, but I've rarely actually seen it. Loud cars and motorcycles seem to be everywhere.
- rangersanger 7y agoIt’s a regional thing I suspect. It’s a big problem in utah, home of the Diesel Brothers and some of the worst air pollution in the country. It’s just recently illegal here. One guy doing it might not be that meaningful but, that’s true of just about everything.
- planteen 7y agoI lived in a house on a busy street for 9 months. The master bedroom was in the back and there were only 2 types of traffic we could here back there: emergency vehicles and motorcycles with pipes. They were very loud in the front of the house. Motorcycles were far more common than emergency vehicles in summer. Cold weather luckily put a damper on the motorcycles eventually. So irritating. They terrified one of my cats every time they went by. I wonder why there aren't automated tickets for noise like the are for running red lights and speeding?
- jvanderbot 7y agoSure, maybe after we handle air pollution, carbon in the atmosphere, and plastic, then we can talk about noise pollution. It's so fun to point out new problems, but trying to prioritize everything is basically prioritizing nothing.
- Anechoic 7y agoIt is possible to tackle more than one issue at a time. Also realize that noise is often a measure of inefficiency - for instance, one of the ways to make trains quieter is to keep wheels and rails smooth. That has the added benefit of extending the life of wheels and rails.
- atoav 7y agoIt always depends where you live. I lived next to a main crossing once and I certainly got my share of air pollution there. If you would have asked me back then what I’d rather get rid off — noise or air pollution — I think I would’ve picked air pollution. The effect constant noise polution has is very hard to grasp. I only noticed what it did to me when I moved to a new flat after a few years. It felt like a 1000 pound weight had been lifted from me, and I realized it was about the noise after all. My sleep got much better, which had all kinds of positive effects on the rest of my life. I can still remember vividly the first night I slept in the new flat in (what felt like) complete silence and peace for the first time in years. If I could give advice to my past me, I would tell myself that the noise affects me much more than I thought.
- EForEndeavour 7y agoYour experience made me think back to the noisiest nights of sleep I recall ever having. Earplugs were an absolute godsend. Did you try those at your old flat?
- paulryanrogers 7y agoI've tried them. They can help but don't work for everyone.
- 7y ago
- maximus1983 7y agoI used to live near a train track. When I first moved there it bothered me quite a lot. When I moved out it was more like "what trains"?
- Sharlin 7y agoSomehow it's easier to get used to train noise than automobile noise. I'm not sure why.
- baron816 7y agoAir pollution is still the next big public-health crisis. 4.2 million people die each year from air pollution https://www.who.int/airpollution/en/ https://www.who.int/airpollution/en/.
- curtis 7y agoNoise in general is a problem, but in particular it seems to me that emergency vehicle sirens have gotten much louder over the last few years. Also, the flashing lights on police cars seem like they're a lot brighter. Am I just imagining this?
- marcosdumay 7y agoThey seem to have gotten brighter when LEDs become common.
- rootusrootus 7y agoNot sure about the siren level, but police cars have definitely been leveraging the low wattage bright LED technology to make their cars light up like the worlds brightest red & blue Christmas tree. Seems like they're innovating also on different strobe patterns to see just what is most attention getting. Sometimes I wonder if it isn't counterproductive to make your car so violently visible that nobody can actually look directly at it. Especially for drunks that might actually be drawn towards all those pretty flashin' lights.
- dazc 7y agoHere in the UK, there seems to be a tendency towards the use of light/sirens at any opportunity. I live near to a busy road junction and have often witnessed situations where the sirens make matters worse because some drivers panic to get out of the way when, really, the best thing they should do is just keep moving forwards.
- wiggler00m 7y agoEarplugs solve this for most locations.
- majos 7y agoFor a little while. But earplugs are not comfortable for hours of use, and they can cause tinnitus-type effects if you do that.
- rhinoceraptor 7y agoI've worn earplugs and put a big fan next to my head every night for years, because I'm a very light sleeper. I don't get any kind of irritation from it. I think the big thing is people don't know how to put earplugs in properly, the entire plug should be in your ear canal. To do it, you need to pull up from the top of your ear when inserting to fully seat it.
- instantwhat 7y agoNo, the big things are varying ear canal sizes and shapes, varying earplug sizes and shapes, and side sleepers. Put an earplug in your ear that seals the ear canal, then press firmly on the outside of your ear canal (on the side of your head, in front of the tragus). Feel that pressure. Now imagine doing that for 8 hours a night. I have had to sleep with ear plugs because of noise from neighbors. Two results: waking up with painful ear canals during the night, and semi-permanently enlarged ear canals, requiring the use of larger ear plugs to seal, which causes more pain. If you can comfortably sleep with ear plugs with no adverse effects, you are lucky.
- clarry 7y agoI sleep with plugs every night and I get that pain & irritation. It really sucks. Maybe one day we progress as a society to the point where one's right to quiet isn't dwarfed by others' right to make noise. Not gonna hold my breath though..
- rhinoceraptor 7y ago
- majos 7y agoIf I could pass one dictatorial law --- hypothetically ignoring constituents and implementation details, but limited to pretty low-consequence stuff --- I would give serious consideration to pricing car honking at max($5, $5 x # of seconds honking). If you really need to honk, you'll happily pay $5 for the ability. If you don't, please spare us your tantrum. I live on a semi-busy street in a big east coast city. It's almost amazing how many people honk and how often out of what looks mostly like frustration or spite. At least once a month someone honks for thirty straight seconds, always because they are mad about traffic that nobody can change.
- pmalynin 7y ago>big east coast city You mean Boston?
- cagenut 7y agoI would put like four figures into a kickstarter if somebody would make some kind of solar-panel+webcam+18650+microphones+arduino kit that can be strapped to every telephone pole and traffic light that just feeds back data on what license plates honk when and where to a public dataset.
- mstaoru 7y agoWelcome to Shanghai, we have it, provided by the government. 5 years ago it was such a cacophony, then they passed the law forbidding honking, and now cars just flash their lights like crazy. Scooters still honk though, but since they're all EV and otherwise pretty quiet, it's a reasonable enough tradeoff.
- ansgri 7y agoRussia also has regulations forbidding the honking within cities except for signaling immediate danger, and it seems to work well, somebody would honk for no good reason sometimes, but the fellow drivers wouldn't approve of it. The lack of automatic enforcement allows to use it sparingly to e.g. wake up somebody at the traffic light and not worry about protesting the fines.
- Shank 7y agoI hate noise pollution. I accidentally picked the worst apartment I can imagine, and I didn't realize it until I moved in: right next to the road that leads to the freeway on-ramp. After about 8pm, everyone wants to get on the highway as fast as possible, which results in tons of noise pollution. I finally broke down and got the Sony WH1000MX3 headphones, which apparently have the "best" active noise cancellation. They do help, but they aren't perfect. They're also super expensive, which makes them impractical for a lot of people. The entire problem could be solved with EVs or enforcing noise ordinances, but I feel like it just takes one person to ruin the whole thing.
- atomical 7y agoDo you have trouble sleeping?
- Sharlin 7y agoEVs do nothing to tire noise, which is a major part of the total noise output of a car.
- kwhitefoot 7y agoBut they would make a substantial difference for medium sized lorries.
- insickness 7y agoWhen a construction site sprang up next door to me, I was in the same situation. In addition to noise cancelling headphones, I also wear foam earplugs underneath and sometimes even stream white noise.
- nullc 7y agoI wish California would implement something like a revenue neutral cost shift on registration. Louder vehicle pay more (progressively with how loud they are, quieter ones pay less-- adjusted to be a net increase in cost over the median and a net decrease under it. (With louder defined using their noise at 0-25MH speeds) I'd certainly feel better about the irritating motorcycles if they were subsidizing all the quiet EVs. The bikers say the ear splitting noise is useful to improve safety? Okay, they can pay for it. Like other forms of pollution we don't need to immediately stop all of it to make an improvement. Now lets talk about dark skies...
- thereisnospork 7y agoYes because it is appropriate to have to pay more to have a safe mode of 'green' transit. Loud motorcycles are annoying; when they have a fatality rate per mile closer to cars you be can complain on that basis.
- nullc 7y agoThe riders intentionally choose a less safe form of transit and gain many benefits from doing so, including lower fuel and maintenance cost. Good for them, but their noise is an externality: I shouldn't get less enjoyment from my home because someone decided to use a less safe but more cost efficient mode of transportation. The loud noise also presumably causes something of an arms race with more acoustically insulated, less fuel efficient, cars. The eventual alternative is outright banning the noise. I think paying for some of that externality would be better.
- thereisnospork 7y agoI hate excessively loud bikes as much as anyone; there is a line between 'hearable' and 'earsplitting' that is often missed. Is not some noise, though, a de minimis appropriate compense for the danger associated with choosing a lighter weight, more environmental, and federal HOV-compliant vehicle? If the per person transportation ecologics and economics are favorable for bikes vs. cars shouldn't we look to improve the externalities (safety) around such transportation methods? Even if it comes with some externtalacious discomfort? (fwiw my current vehicle is approximately the loudest allowable per federal regulations, because I enjoy the sound it makes, not safety per say.)
- rangersanger 7y agoMy neighbors put up a 20 foot plus wide American flag. It’s absurdly loud. When it storms and gets wet, it’s all I can hear inside my house. While I don’t think it’s the next public health crisis, it’s certainly a crisis for me. And no, there’s nothing I can do about it. Good luck getting a city official to take up that battle. I’ve been told that maybe I’m just more sensitive to noise than others, and that their sensors can’t pick up noises over wind.
- rich-tea 7y ago> When it storms and gets wet, it’s all I can hear inside my house. Isn't that illegal?
- all2 7y agoNot in the USA. Display and treatment of the flag is covered by freedom of speech.
- morsch 7y agoSpeech itself is also covered by freedom of speech, does that mean you can shout into your neighbours property for hours a day? With amplification? From a recording?
- rangersanger 7y agoNo, but that’s often regulated against, and much easier politically to deal with. The problem is that a flag is, well, a flag. It’s treated as if they’d planted a tree and I’m upset but the wind rustling the leaves. I’ve looked for anything analogous where wind acts upon an object to make loud noises, and I haven’t had luck.
- rich-tea 7y agoI actually thought the flag code disallowed flying the flag in bad weather. But I'm now unable to find any confirmation of that.
- 7y ago
- cadence- 7y agoAC installed between houses that are close to each other are another menace that makes it hard to sleep if your bedroom is on the wrong side of house. It’s not even the noise level, as it is the vibration and low frequency hum that often has an annoying phase that makes it difficult to ignore. White noise helps a bit, but that only works for people who are okay with blasting white noise in their bedrooms. Same goes for swimming pool pumps. Most places don’t have good laws regarding constant noise levels (as opposed to laws that govern things like loud music at night). Noise pollution is a real problem that affects your health. And most of it could be solved by engineering if the required laws were more strict.
- jerzyt 7y agoSeems like in the last decade, there's been a design trend in fast food restaurant for maximizing the ambient noise. I love Chipotle's food, but I just can't eat inside, it's so ridiculously loud. I hope this trend dies soon.
- xena 7y agoThat almost sounds intentional so you leave sooner. This allows the restaurant to hold more people.
- cromulent 7y ago"It’s aural litter — acoustical litter — and, if you could see what you hear, it would look like piles and piles of McDonald’s wrappers, just thrown out the window as we go driving down the road.” That's how I feel about noise pollution inside the office.
- Proven 7y agoNo. And do us a favor and stop looking for the next most profitable fake health crisis
- purplezooey 7y agoHarleys with no muffler. They need to be banned.
- musicale 7y agoConstant sirens from emergency vehicles seem to be about as useful as car alarms. Except in urban environments the sirens are 24/7, reverberate for blocks, and are extremely hard to localize until the vehicle is right next to you and blaring at 120dB. It's like someone constantly yelling "hey, there's an emergency somewhere!"
- musicale 7y agoLow-frequency rumbling noise is particularly horrible. You can hear it from miles away. It seems almost inescapable in and near cities.