4 ms·

I don't really have a good explanation other than we already have words like 'However' and 'But'. It also seems redundant, maybe just start typing your contradi

by coat 7y ago

I don't really have a good explanation other than we already have words like 'However' and 'But'. It also seems redundant, maybe just start typing your contradictory position without the need for a connecting phrase? That being said, it may just be me who is annoyed by the phrase. I think it just gets used a lot and I can't help but notice for some reason. I think I've associated the phrase with strawman arguments and my hollow cringe is unfair judgement.

SolaceQuantum 7y ago
”...maybe just start typing your contradictory position without the need for a connecting phrase?...” Don’t do this. It’s a good way to make your writing appear incoherent.
mykowebhn 7y ago
Could the overuse of "that said" also be a reason for not liking it? I find there are many words and phrases that tend to be overused, especially in marketing and Ted talks.
ACow_Adonis 7y ago
I don't mind phrases like 'that being said', aside from the general critique of cliche-repetition. To me it carries connotations of the first clause having validity while the second apparently contrasting point also has validity. Its specific purpose is to allow a connection between points, without explicitly eliminating or contradicting any of the clauses. Using 'however' or 'but' lacks this contextualisation, and that's without getting into the criticisms of their use is popular speech and writing (i.e. when someone says two clauses of the form 'A, but B.' what they usually mean is 'B').
Dylan16807 7y ago
> I don't really have a good explanation other than we already have words like 'However' and 'But'. 'But' is very generic and 'However' is longer than 'that said'. > It also seems redundant, maybe just start typing your contradictory position without the need for a connecting phrase? That makes it much more difficult to keep the topic flowing, and it can be very confusing if you jump to an almost-contradiction without warning the reader that it's time to do some contrasting and fine-tuning.
- EForEndeavour 7y ago
  > 'However' is longer than 'that said'. We're both nitpicking at this point: "however" is shorter than "that said" according to two out of three relevant metrics: "however": 1 word, 3 syllables, 7 characters "that said": 2 words, 2 syllables, 9 characters That said, it's a waste of time to worry about the difference anyway. Keep in mind that we aren't minifying JS or hand-optimizing processor code. When it comes to natural-language communication between humans, not every byte matters. Use the words that sound natural to you for your intended audience. Weigh feedback from trusted coworkers and members of that audience.

by coat 7y ago

SolaceQuantum 7y ago

”...maybe just start typing your contradictory position without the need for a connecting phrase?...” Don’t do this. It’s a good way to make your writing appear incoherent.

mykowebhn 7y ago

Could the overuse of "that said" also be a reason for not liking it? I find there are many words and phrases that tend to be overused, especially in marketing and Ted talks.

ACow_Adonis 7y ago

I don't mind phrases like 'that being said', aside from the general critique of cliche-repetition. To me it carries connotations of the first clause having validity while the second apparently contrasting point also has validity. Its specific purpose is to allow a connection between points, without explicitly eliminating or contradicting any of the clauses. Using 'however' or 'but' lacks this contextualisation, and that's without getting into the criticisms of their use is popular speech and writing (i.e. when someone says two clauses of the form 'A, but B.' what they usually mean is 'B').

Dylan16807 7y ago

> I don't really have a good explanation other than we already have words like 'However' and 'But'. 'But' is very generic and 'However' is longer than 'that said'. > It also seems redundant, maybe just start typing your contradictory position without the need for a connecting phrase? That makes it much more difficult to keep the topic flowing, and it can be very confusing if you jump to an almost-contradiction without warning the reader that it's time to do some contrasting and fine-tuning.

EForEndeavour 7y ago
> 'However' is longer than 'that said'. We're both nitpicking at this point: "however" is shorter than "that said" according to two out of three relevant metrics: "however": 1 word, 3 syllables, 7 characters "that said": 2 words, 2 syllables, 9 characters That said, it's a waste of time to worry about the difference anyway. Keep in mind that we aren't minifying JS or hand-optimizing processor code. When it comes to natural-language communication between humans, not every byte matters. Use the words that sound natural to you for your intended audience. Weigh feedback from trusted coworkers and members of that audience.