5 ms·

I love the quality of the keyboards in these old machines. Is there anyone out there building all-in-one keyboard computers w/ Model M-quality keyboards?

by tcbawo 8y ago

_red 8y ago
A friend and I were speaking of this recently. The current trend for "all-in-ones" is to have "monitor computers", however practically speaking it would be better to have a "keyboard computer" that you can change every few years and keep the investment in your nice 2k monitor.
- paulmd 8y ago
  but then if you spill your drink you've ruined a $2000 computer instead of a $50 keyboard...
  - bovermyer 8y ago
    Then stop drinking near your computer.
    - tom_ 8y ago
      Or buy a laptop stand.
      - paulmd 8y ago
        with a combination keyboard/chassis you can't do that unless you want to reach up to your laptop stand everytime you need to type. Not practical.
        tom_ 8y ago
        Your laptop's keyboard and/or pointing device are/is for use when you aren't at your desk. When you are at your desk, you can put your laptop on its stand, plug in a USB keyboard and mouse, and use it like that.
    - paulmd 8y ago
      "just stop using your PC the way you're accustomed to so that you can use my new product", what a winning sales pitch. It's like if instead of making his phone not suck, Steve Jobs had told people to just stop carrying their keys around in their pockets. I mean, drinking soda and gaming is practically a meme at this point, so goodbye to all those customers. And anyone else who wants a beverage while they edit photos or do their taxes.
      - bovermyer 8y ago
        I was talking specifically to you, not all people who drink beverages at their computer. I'm not trying to sell anything. I'm just concerned for the longevity of your computing hardware.
  - LeifCarrotson 8y ago
    What if you installed a $200 monitor on your desk, upgradeable, connected by a standard interface like VGA or HDMI, and on your desk had a $50 keyboard and mouse connected over USB or PS2. You could kept the expensive parts of your computer in a separate (hear me out here) sturdy, formed sheet-steel enclosure. This could go under your desk out of the way, so it could be large enough that average users could open it with simple tools or thumbscrews to remove, replace, upgrade, or add internal components to the computer. Sounds crazy, right? That would never work..../s In contrast to the IBM-compatible PC form factor, the idea that you'd want to embed the computer into the monitor or keyboard, or replace the tower enclosure with a hockey-puck sized amalgamation of microscopic, proprietary, ESD-sensitive parts held together with glue, is a little crazy. I admit there's a place for laptop computers, but I don't think that most of those use cases require aerospace-grade thinness and lightness to the extent that it precludes serviceability. Or maybe I'm just bitter over the fact that my high-end E-ATX silent case now houses a mini-ITX board with a single graphics card and onboard M2 storage, and I can't find a replacement that I like for my aging Thinkpad...
    - gwbas1c 8y ago
      Honestly, I've been 100% MacBook Pro for years. Plenty powerful enough for me. My personal one is 7 years old, and my work one is a few years old. (I plug in two monitors, keyboard, mouse, ect.) I can understand needing a standalone, modular computer, if you're actually doing things that require a very powerful computer.
      - readams 8y ago
        It's likely you've now forgotten just how much faster and more powerful desktop computers are than laptops.
        gwbas1c 8y ago
        I stopped using my Windows development desktop computer because a Windows VM ran faster on my new Macbook in 2013. At that point I was thrilled that I could get rid of a KVM.
- neogodless 8y ago
  I can't even count the number of Microsoft Natural 4000 keyboards I bought over the years because they wore out, or I spilled milk on them. I've never owned an AIO, and I'm not sure I'll ever "get it." But then I'm just not the target audience for that particular niche market. I'd even prefer my laptops to be more "upgradeable", but lately they come with LPDDR3 soldered on, and if I'm really lucky, I can maybe install a SATA or M2 drive.
- ynac 8y ago
  Anyone remember the CW Keyboard from Heathkit? I'm frankly not even sure what it was for, but I have played on a busted unit and the keys and they were sw(ee)t. It also reminds me of a Brother computer/typewriter/printer I used for a while. Thermal built-in printer and a 3-row LCD display. With all the brand new tech in the house, whenever friends or kids visit, the first things they play with are the tunrtable and the typewriter that's nearing a century old.
sverige 8y ago
You can still buy brand new IBM Model M keyboards in several configurations from the people who bought the patent. I love this keyboard. It's the best ever made imo and I'll never switch for desktop. Sometimes I dock my laptop just to use this keyboard :0. https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/category/UKBD https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/category/UKBD
- derekp7 8y ago
  Wouldn't the patents be long expired by now? Also, I believe that Unicomp (PC Keyboard) factory is actually the same factory that made the Model M before (previously owned by Lexmark, which was an IBM spinoff).
  - sverige 8y ago
    I'm not sure about that. I know their site used to mention the patents. Their website says this now: "Unicomp was started in 1996 when we purchased keyboard technology from Lexmark International and IBM. You may recall that Lexmark manufactured the high quality Model M keyboards for IBM computers and terminals prior to 1996. Many of the same people, who in 1995 helped produce millions of keyboards for Lexmark customers, continue to manufacture keyboards for us today. Our goal is to build on our heritage and continue to provide our customers with the highest quality keyboard products." In any event, I've been very happy with their products. It's like 1988 all over again for me.
tyingq 8y ago
There's also the cheaper Atari 400 with a truly terrible membrane keyboard. https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81b69Drd97L._AC_.jpg https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81b69Drd97L...
- techdmn 8y ago
  I grew up with a 400 in the house. The keyboard was truly awful. Didn't stop me from firing up BASIC, but between the keyboard and lack of storage it sure wasn't my ten-year-old self's primary development machine. (We had a cassette drive, but I don't think it ever worked right.)
  - johnvega 8y ago
    My family also had Atari 400. Also had the cassette drive. I used it to program in BASIC. We got it with the Asteroids game and a joystick and that was a lot of fun.
  - protomyth 8y ago
    Learned to program on the 400 (with a 48k upgrade) in BASIC and 6502. I still think my preference for mechanical keyboards is a direct result of owning the 400.
- function_seven 8y ago
  The Atari 400 was my family's first gaming console as a kid. We filled the garden with roses in Dig Dug. The keyboard was terrible, but I am nostalgic for it. Those raised bumps that surround each "key", the on-trend brown and yellow scheme. That thing was built like a tank. Also, same typing feel as a 2019 Macbook, but with better dust resistance!
Cactus2018 8y ago
http://palmerluckey.com/oculus-goblack-how-to-make-your-oculus-go-better/ http://palmerluckey.com/oculus-goblack-how-to-make-your-ocul... > I built myself a custom PC inside one of my favorite mechanical keyboards, a dampened Happy Hacking Keyboard Professional Type 2 S
ilaksh 8y ago
There are some like that if you Google "PC inside keyboard".
CWuestefeld 8y ago
On the other hand, I can tell you first-hand that accidentally spilling fruit juice into an Atari 800 keyboard is very bad for the health of the computer.

I love the quality of the keyboards in these old machines. Is there anyone out there building all-in-one keyboard computers w/ Model M-quality keyboards?

by tcbawo 8y ago

I love the quality of the keyboards in these old machines. Is there anyone out there building all-in-one keyboard computers w/ Model M-quality keyboards?

_red 8y ago

A friend and I were speaking of this recently. The current trend for "all-in-ones" is to have "monitor computers", however practically speaking it would be better to have a "keyboard computer" that you can change every few years and keep the investment in your nice 2k monitor.

paulmd 8y ago
but then if you spill your drink you've ruined a $2000 computer instead of a $50 keyboard...
- bovermyer 8y ago
  Then stop drinking near your computer.
  - tom_ 8y ago
    Or buy a laptop stand.
    - paulmd 8y ago
      with a combination keyboard/chassis you can't do that unless you want to reach up to your laptop stand everytime you need to type. Not practical.
      - tom_ 8y ago
        Your laptop's keyboard and/or pointing device are/is for use when you aren't at your desk. When you are at your desk, you can put your laptop on its stand, plug in a USB keyboard and mouse, and use it like that.
  - paulmd 8y ago
    "just stop using your PC the way you're accustomed to so that you can use my new product", what a winning sales pitch. It's like if instead of making his phone not suck, Steve Jobs had told people to just stop carrying their keys around in their pockets. I mean, drinking soda and gaming is practically a meme at this point, so goodbye to all those customers. And anyone else who wants a beverage while they edit photos or do their taxes.
    - bovermyer 8y ago
      I was talking specifically to you, not all people who drink beverages at their computer. I'm not trying to sell anything. I'm just concerned for the longevity of your computing hardware.
- LeifCarrotson 8y ago
  What if you installed a $200 monitor on your desk, upgradeable, connected by a standard interface like VGA or HDMI, and on your desk had a $50 keyboard and mouse connected over USB or PS2. You could kept the expensive parts of your computer in a separate (hear me out here) sturdy, formed sheet-steel enclosure. This could go under your desk out of the way, so it could be large enough that average users could open it with simple tools or thumbscrews to remove, replace, upgrade, or add internal components to the computer. Sounds crazy, right? That would never work..../s In contrast to the IBM-compatible PC form factor, the idea that you'd want to embed the computer into the monitor or keyboard, or replace the tower enclosure with a hockey-puck sized amalgamation of microscopic, proprietary, ESD-sensitive parts held together with glue, is a little crazy. I admit there's a place for laptop computers, but I don't think that most of those use cases require aerospace-grade thinness and lightness to the extent that it precludes serviceability. Or maybe I'm just bitter over the fact that my high-end E-ATX silent case now houses a mini-ITX board with a single graphics card and onboard M2 storage, and I can't find a replacement that I like for my aging Thinkpad...
  - gwbas1c 8y ago
    Honestly, I've been 100% MacBook Pro for years. Plenty powerful enough for me. My personal one is 7 years old, and my work one is a few years old. (I plug in two monitors, keyboard, mouse, ect.) I can understand needing a standalone, modular computer, if you're actually doing things that require a very powerful computer.
    - readams 8y ago
      It's likely you've now forgotten just how much faster and more powerful desktop computers are than laptops.
      - gwbas1c 8y ago
        I stopped using my Windows development desktop computer because a Windows VM ran faster on my new Macbook in 2013. At that point I was thrilled that I could get rid of a KVM.
neogodless 8y ago
I can't even count the number of Microsoft Natural 4000 keyboards I bought over the years because they wore out, or I spilled milk on them. I've never owned an AIO, and I'm not sure I'll ever "get it." But then I'm just not the target audience for that particular niche market. I'd even prefer my laptops to be more "upgradeable", but lately they come with LPDDR3 soldered on, and if I'm really lucky, I can maybe install a SATA or M2 drive.
ynac 8y ago
Anyone remember the CW Keyboard from Heathkit? I'm frankly not even sure what it was for, but I have played on a busted unit and the keys and they were sw(ee)t. It also reminds me of a Brother computer/typewriter/printer I used for a while. Thermal built-in printer and a 3-row LCD display. With all the brand new tech in the house, whenever friends or kids visit, the first things they play with are the tunrtable and the typewriter that's nearing a century old.

sverige 8y ago

You can still buy brand new IBM Model M keyboards in several configurations from the people who bought the patent. I love this keyboard. It's the best ever made imo and I'll never switch for desktop. Sometimes I dock my laptop just to use this keyboard :0. https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/category/UKBD https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/category/UKBD

derekp7 8y ago
Wouldn't the patents be long expired by now? Also, I believe that Unicomp (PC Keyboard) factory is actually the same factory that made the Model M before (previously owned by Lexmark, which was an IBM spinoff).
- sverige 8y ago
  I'm not sure about that. I know their site used to mention the patents. Their website says this now: "Unicomp was started in 1996 when we purchased keyboard technology from Lexmark International and IBM. You may recall that Lexmark manufactured the high quality Model M keyboards for IBM computers and terminals prior to 1996. Many of the same people, who in 1995 helped produce millions of keyboards for Lexmark customers, continue to manufacture keyboards for us today. Our goal is to build on our heritage and continue to provide our customers with the highest quality keyboard products." In any event, I've been very happy with their products. It's like 1988 all over again for me.

tyingq 8y ago

There's also the cheaper Atari 400 with a truly terrible membrane keyboard. https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81b69Drd97L._AC_.jpg https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81b69Drd97L...

techdmn 8y ago
I grew up with a 400 in the house. The keyboard was truly awful. Didn't stop me from firing up BASIC, but between the keyboard and lack of storage it sure wasn't my ten-year-old self's primary development machine. (We had a cassette drive, but I don't think it ever worked right.)
- johnvega 8y ago
  My family also had Atari 400. Also had the cassette drive. I used it to program in BASIC. We got it with the Asteroids game and a joystick and that was a lot of fun.
- protomyth 8y ago
  Learned to program on the 400 (with a 48k upgrade) in BASIC and 6502. I still think my preference for mechanical keyboards is a direct result of owning the 400.
function_seven 8y ago
The Atari 400 was my family's first gaming console as a kid. We filled the garden with roses in Dig Dug. The keyboard was terrible, but I am nostalgic for it. Those raised bumps that surround each "key", the on-trend brown and yellow scheme. That thing was built like a tank. Also, same typing feel as a 2019 Macbook, but with better dust resistance!

Cactus2018 8y ago

http://palmerluckey.com/oculus-goblack-how-to-make-your-oculus-go-better/ http://palmerluckey.com/oculus-goblack-how-to-make-your-ocul... > I built myself a custom PC inside one of my favorite mechanical keyboards, a dampened Happy Hacking Keyboard Professional Type 2 S

ilaksh 8y ago

There are some like that if you Google "PC inside keyboard".

CWuestefeld 8y ago

On the other hand, I can tell you first-hand that accidentally spilling fruit juice into an Atari 800 keyboard is very bad for the health of the computer.