4 ms·

If you're at that high a level, you got there because you loved the game. So it's not really gruelling, it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid

If you're at that high a level, you got there because you loved the game. So it's not really gruelling, it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid for it.

jimmy1 8y ago
I think this takes away from the professionalism of these individuals. At a certain level, we are all doing things we want to be doing, otherwise we would be looking for ways to do other things. If you follow a lot of top eSports players in LoL challenger, for example, they all love the game, but you can tell the difference in professionalism even in their online personas towards the game. There's no doubt QTPie loves the game, but it's also no secret that the reason he isn't a top tier ADC anymore is because he doesn't want to deal with the grind and just wants to enjoy himself (and more power to him for it -- this isn't a character judgement, just pointing out the difference) Most probably love the game, but having been a semi-professional CS player myself in the past, it very much feels like "work" sometimes. > it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid for it. Much different scrimming for fun or playing matches with your buddies/team mates/pub stomping versus practicing very detailed specifics or scenarios, or testing different team compositions and strategies over and over and over again.
- Macross8299 8y ago
  My understanding is that pro counter-strike players also have to memorize and practice an obscene amount of nade throws these days just to be competitive since the physics are so predictable and things like flashbangs are so strong.
  - BigJono 8y ago
    Eh, I'd say that's pretty insignificant to a CS pro, in the same way learning what every hero/champ does in DotA/LoL seems daunting at first but is pretty trivial once you have 1,000+ hours in the game. You're just incrementally building on knowledge that you've accrued while playing normally. It's not like a pro has to sit down and do some huge exercise in rote memorisation for smokes and flashes every week. Maybe rarely when a new map gets added to the active pool.
taurath 8y ago
Thats not true at all in my experience - programmers who love their work burn out all the time. I had a dream job in the gaming industry but after months of 65 hour weeks decided the tradeoffs aren't worth it. I loved that job, but the sacrifices necessary to do it were too much of a cost. There are a lot of people who would love to play a game for 10 hours a day. Playing and training are different things though.
- dmix 8y ago
  I'm not seeing the connection between being a top tier professional in a sport and working as a programmer 65hrs at a gaming company? One involves a necessary dedication and persistence for high reward, while the other is a useless exercise in exploitation (as no programmer is productive 65hrs/week and would only be rewarded sufficiently high in a few situations, such as having stock/ownership).
  - bluGill 8y ago
    Try being a top tier professional in an obscure sport: racquetball for example. You need a large amount of dedication and effort and you will not get high rewards no matter how good you are.
  - taurath 8y ago
    I wasn't a programmer at the gaming company - more of a producer type. I went into programming after for less hours and more work/life flexibility. I'd never program for 65hrs/week, but it was very possible to do my production job that much - the problem is I didn't go on a date for half a year, and my work became the entire bit of my life.
- imesh 8y ago
  I disagree. I wrestled at a DI level in college, it was grueling, it was incredibly hard, some days I hated it. But it wasn't the same kind of burn out that I feel from software development. I don't wake up excited for work the way I would wake up excited to train. It's just different. The harder you work the better you get in sport. You may work harder at software development and become a better developer but the gains you may get aren't so concrete, you don't win, you likely won't even get a raise.
rifung 8y ago
> If you're at that high a level, you got there because you loved the game. So it's not really gruelling, it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid for it. I don't think this is true. To reach the highest level you need more than passion: you need dedication and discipline. If you only practice when you feel like it then you're not going to practice as much as someone who has a set schedule they stick to no matter whether they're enjoying it or not. Not only that but practice or training is much different from playing and often not at all enjoyable. I would hope that all musicians love music, but practicing is usually very tiring and not fun. My current teacher always says that if you're practice feels completely painful and hopeless, you're probably doing it right. One of my friends trained with one of the top players in the world in her sport. When she wanted to take it easy because she was on her period, the coach, also female, said she should keep going. That dedication could be the difference between being #1 and #2.
keerthiko 8y ago
A professional gamer has to deal with so many more things as a result of their daily interaction with the game than someone who just loves the game. If a big weekend tournament is coming up, you can't just "take sick leave" because you're running a 102 fever. If you are in a slump or having a rough time personally for a few weeks, you bleed fans and have shoutcasters questioning whether you have fallen from grace or are no longer the best of the best. If you are just not in the mood to practice because it's a nice day out, but if you have a tournament net week, you can't skip your session. It becomes so very different when it changes from something you love doing purely because it was fun, to becoming a job you get paid for, to becoming something where it's your job to be the best in the world at scoring points in.
- chii 8y ago
  This is no different from being any other professional athlete. E-sports should drop the 'E' moniker, because the 'E' part is less significant than the 'sports' part. People think playing games is less taxing and less skillful than a 'real' athlete's work, but it's not. The same level applies, upto and including the revenue model.

If you're at that high a level, you got there because you loved the game. So it's not really gruelling, it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid for it.

jimmy1 8y ago

I think this takes away from the professionalism of these individuals. At a certain level, we are all doing things we want to be doing, otherwise we would be looking for ways to do other things. If you follow a lot of top eSports players in LoL challenger, for example, they all love the game, but you can tell the difference in professionalism even in their online personas towards the game. There's no doubt QTPie loves the game, but it's also no secret that the reason he isn't a top tier ADC anymore is because he doesn't want to deal with the grind and just wants to enjoy himself (and more power to him for it -- this isn't a character judgement, just pointing out the difference) Most probably love the game, but having been a semi-professional CS player myself in the past, it very much feels like "work" sometimes. > it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid for it. Much different scrimming for fun or playing matches with your buddies/team mates/pub stomping versus practicing very detailed specifics or scenarios, or testing different team compositions and strategies over and over and over again.

Macross8299 8y ago
My understanding is that pro counter-strike players also have to memorize and practice an obscene amount of nade throws these days just to be competitive since the physics are so predictable and things like flashbangs are so strong.
- BigJono 8y ago
  Eh, I'd say that's pretty insignificant to a CS pro, in the same way learning what every hero/champ does in DotA/LoL seems daunting at first but is pretty trivial once you have 1,000+ hours in the game. You're just incrementally building on knowledge that you've accrued while playing normally. It's not like a pro has to sit down and do some huge exercise in rote memorisation for smokes and flashes every week. Maybe rarely when a new map gets added to the active pool.

taurath 8y ago

Thats not true at all in my experience - programmers who love their work burn out all the time. I had a dream job in the gaming industry but after months of 65 hour weeks decided the tradeoffs aren't worth it. I loved that job, but the sacrifices necessary to do it were too much of a cost. There are a lot of people who would love to play a game for 10 hours a day. Playing and training are different things though.

dmix 8y ago
I'm not seeing the connection between being a top tier professional in a sport and working as a programmer 65hrs at a gaming company? One involves a necessary dedication and persistence for high reward, while the other is a useless exercise in exploitation (as no programmer is productive 65hrs/week and would only be rewarded sufficiently high in a few situations, such as having stock/ownership).
- bluGill 8y ago
  Try being a top tier professional in an obscure sport: racquetball for example. You need a large amount of dedication and effort and you will not get high rewards no matter how good you are.
- taurath 8y ago
  I wasn't a programmer at the gaming company - more of a producer type. I went into programming after for less hours and more work/life flexibility. I'd never program for 65hrs/week, but it was very possible to do my production job that much - the problem is I didn't go on a date for half a year, and my work became the entire bit of my life.
imesh 8y ago
I disagree. I wrestled at a DI level in college, it was grueling, it was incredibly hard, some days I hated it. But it wasn't the same kind of burn out that I feel from software development. I don't wake up excited for work the way I would wake up excited to train. It's just different. The harder you work the better you get in sport. You may work harder at software development and become a better developer but the gains you may get aren't so concrete, you don't win, you likely won't even get a raise.

rifung 8y ago

> If you're at that high a level, you got there because you loved the game. So it's not really gruelling, it's what you would do anyhow if you weren't being paid for it. I don't think this is true. To reach the highest level you need more than passion: you need dedication and discipline. If you only practice when you feel like it then you're not going to practice as much as someone who has a set schedule they stick to no matter whether they're enjoying it or not. Not only that but practice or training is much different from playing and often not at all enjoyable. I would hope that all musicians love music, but practicing is usually very tiring and not fun. My current teacher always says that if you're practice feels completely painful and hopeless, you're probably doing it right. One of my friends trained with one of the top players in the world in her sport. When she wanted to take it easy because she was on her period, the coach, also female, said she should keep going. That dedication could be the difference between being #1 and #2.

keerthiko 8y ago

A professional gamer has to deal with so many more things as a result of their daily interaction with the game than someone who just loves the game. If a big weekend tournament is coming up, you can't just "take sick leave" because you're running a 102 fever. If you are in a slump or having a rough time personally for a few weeks, you bleed fans and have shoutcasters questioning whether you have fallen from grace or are no longer the best of the best. If you are just not in the mood to practice because it's a nice day out, but if you have a tournament net week, you can't skip your session. It becomes so very different when it changes from something you love doing purely because it was fun, to becoming a job you get paid for, to becoming something where it's your job to be the best in the world at scoring points in.

chii 8y ago
This is no different from being any other professional athlete. E-sports should drop the 'E' moniker, because the 'E' part is less significant than the 'sports' part. People think playing games is less taxing and less skillful than a 'real' athlete's work, but it's not. The same level applies, upto and including the revenue model.