19 ms·

> They were setting chrome as default browser in android. Also they did not allow changing the default search engine so easily. Isn't this the same case with S

by boggio 8y ago

> They were setting chrome as default browser in android. Also they did not allow changing the default search engine so easily. Isn't this the same case with Safari on iOS devices? Update: I posted this before the motivation was published.

isolli 8y ago
I guess the difference is market share...
- rimliu 8y ago
  And the fact that iOS is installed on devices made by Apple itself. Android is the OS used by different phone manufacturers.
  - boudin 8y ago
    If iOS would have the marketshare of Android, it would be hit by the same regulations.
    - Carnageous 8y ago
      Agreed, and this needs to stop in my opinion. The EU makes an enormous amount of money by suing tech-giants over and over again without doing enough research to know what companies in this sector are doing.
      - cbg0 8y ago
        They have a very good idea of what the tech giants are doing, don't you worry.
      - boudin 8y ago
        Those aren't based on nothing. There is laws and being a tech giant doesn't grant the right to go around those. If those fines aren't justified, those companies can use the justice system in place to fight back, like everybody else. It's not a free for all, get free money from tech companies with no legal background. Antitrust laws aren't specific to EU by the way.
    - hopler 8y ago
      No, if Apple opened it's OS to OEMs, it would be hit. Apple isn't getting fined for it's app store which is essentially the same structure as Google's OEM hardware setup
      - adventured 8y ago
        > Apple isn't getting fined for it's app store They're working on that, give it some time. The complaint from Spotify gets the ball rolling. The EU will do the rest. Two or three years from now they'll have a $4 billion fine for Apple. "Spotify announced this morning that it’s filed an antitrust complaint against Apple with the European Union, alleging that the iPhone maker is harming consumer choice and stifling innovation via the rules it enforces on the App Store." https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263453/spotify-apple-app-store-antitrust-complaint-ec-30-percent-cut-unfair https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263453/spotify-apple-ap...
      - boudin 8y ago
        It's based on marketshare. iOS doesn't have enough marketshare on the smartphone market to be bothered by those laws. If apple was controlling the whole smartphone market, it could fall under those laws, even if its operating system wasn't open to other manufacturer.
- throwaway9d0291 8y ago
  No, not really. Basically the way the EU sees it, Google has a monopoly in a market: mobile operating systems. That is, if you're an OEM and you want to sell a device with an operating system, Google is currently the only place you can really turn. Apple exists but since it doesn't sell its operating system, it's not a participant in this market. So the EU saw Google saying to OEMs "you can have Android but you have to install our stuff on it or pay extra" and decided that Google was using its monopoly position in one market (mobile OS) to give itself an advantage in other markets (app stores, browsers, search). They see this as anti-competitive.
  - hopler 8y ago
    Google could satisfy EU by cancelling OEM Android licensing programming and reducing consumer choice to Google phones only, relegating OEMs to suppliers like "good" Apple, and putting most OEMs out of business. Good job, EU.
    - cbg0 8y ago
      Google could do that, but it would hurt their business tremendously, as the amount of diverse brands which provide their own unique flavor on top of Android is what helps them keep this dominance. Reducing the choice to just Google phones running Android will spark other providers to develop their own OS and increase competition in the market, which would indeed lead a great deal of people to say "Good job, EU" if the EU was the catalyst for such a scenario.
    - hrktb 8y ago
      The reason android exists was to allow OEMs to compete with Apple. Google could shut it down and only publish their own phones, but they don't have the chops to become a premier customer goods maker. The field would be free for Apple until Samsung catches up. In the end Google lose negotiation power in getting their search engine, browser and services on Apple's and Samsung phones. Basically they would be the main loser in the move.
  - olalonde 8y ago
    As far as I know, Android is open source and any OEM is free to use it without asking permission. The licensing program is for the right to install proprietary Google apps like the Play Store or Google Maps. There are plenty of Chinese OEMs who aren't licensed and sell phones without the Play store.

by boggio 8y ago

isolli 8y ago

I guess the difference is market share...

rimliu 8y ago
And the fact that iOS is installed on devices made by Apple itself. Android is the OS used by different phone manufacturers.
- boudin 8y ago
  If iOS would have the marketshare of Android, it would be hit by the same regulations.
  - Carnageous 8y ago
    Agreed, and this needs to stop in my opinion. The EU makes an enormous amount of money by suing tech-giants over and over again without doing enough research to know what companies in this sector are doing.
    - cbg0 8y ago
      They have a very good idea of what the tech giants are doing, don't you worry.
    - boudin 8y ago
      Those aren't based on nothing. There is laws and being a tech giant doesn't grant the right to go around those. If those fines aren't justified, those companies can use the justice system in place to fight back, like everybody else. It's not a free for all, get free money from tech companies with no legal background. Antitrust laws aren't specific to EU by the way.
  - hopler 8y ago
    No, if Apple opened it's OS to OEMs, it would be hit. Apple isn't getting fined for it's app store which is essentially the same structure as Google's OEM hardware setup
    - adventured 8y ago
      > Apple isn't getting fined for it's app store They're working on that, give it some time. The complaint from Spotify gets the ball rolling. The EU will do the rest. Two or three years from now they'll have a $4 billion fine for Apple. "Spotify announced this morning that it’s filed an antitrust complaint against Apple with the European Union, alleging that the iPhone maker is harming consumer choice and stifling innovation via the rules it enforces on the App Store." https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263453/spotify-apple-app-store-antitrust-complaint-ec-30-percent-cut-unfair https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/13/18263453/spotify-apple-ap...
    - boudin 8y ago
      It's based on marketshare. iOS doesn't have enough marketshare on the smartphone market to be bothered by those laws. If apple was controlling the whole smartphone market, it could fall under those laws, even if its operating system wasn't open to other manufacturer.
throwaway9d0291 8y ago
No, not really. Basically the way the EU sees it, Google has a monopoly in a market: mobile operating systems. That is, if you're an OEM and you want to sell a device with an operating system, Google is currently the only place you can really turn. Apple exists but since it doesn't sell its operating system, it's not a participant in this market. So the EU saw Google saying to OEMs "you can have Android but you have to install our stuff on it or pay extra" and decided that Google was using its monopoly position in one market (mobile OS) to give itself an advantage in other markets (app stores, browsers, search). They see this as anti-competitive.
- hopler 8y ago
  Google could satisfy EU by cancelling OEM Android licensing programming and reducing consumer choice to Google phones only, relegating OEMs to suppliers like "good" Apple, and putting most OEMs out of business. Good job, EU.
  - cbg0 8y ago
    Google could do that, but it would hurt their business tremendously, as the amount of diverse brands which provide their own unique flavor on top of Android is what helps them keep this dominance. Reducing the choice to just Google phones running Android will spark other providers to develop their own OS and increase competition in the market, which would indeed lead a great deal of people to say "Good job, EU" if the EU was the catalyst for such a scenario.
  - hrktb 8y ago
    The reason android exists was to allow OEMs to compete with Apple. Google could shut it down and only publish their own phones, but they don't have the chops to become a premier customer goods maker. The field would be free for Apple until Samsung catches up. In the end Google lose negotiation power in getting their search engine, browser and services on Apple's and Samsung phones. Basically they would be the main loser in the move.
- olalonde 8y ago
  As far as I know, Android is open source and any OEM is free to use it without asking permission. The licensing program is for the right to install proprietary Google apps like the Play Store or Google Maps. There are plenty of Chinese OEMs who aren't licensed and sell phones without the Play store.