6 ms·

This seems like a very fair policy if the developer doesn’t need the money, as in this example. However, as a user, I hope that setting up a recurring donation

by snazz 8y ago

This seems like a very fair policy if the developer doesn’t need the money, as in this example. However, as a user, I hope that setting up a recurring donation keeps the project going and provides motivation to its author.

newnewpdro 8y ago
> However, as a user, I hope that setting up a recurring donation keeps the project going and provides motivation to its author. Which is yet another reason to not want donations, since you're basically describing employment, turning their casual hobby into an obligation.
- johnday 8y ago
  I think the parent might have meant something slightly different - that by donating, they are showing the author that their work has actual value to other people, and that motivates them to continue. That's my take, anyway: a social rather than fiscal incentive.
  - tylerhou 8y ago
    The developer could ask people to tell him/her when they donate (on the developer's behalf) to a charity the developer suggests. This would have the same effect as showing the developer that her/his work has value.
mikekchar 8y ago
I may be misremembering (and the situation is a bit different now, lending credence to the idea that I'm misremembering), but I think Bram Moolenaar used to request that people donate to the children of Uganda and send a post card to him. For people who would like that donation, I think that would be awesome: make the donation and send an email saying that you did it. This should provide the motivation you are looking for. Rather than a notification that money when into their bank account, it's a notification that it went into a bank account that they value higher.
- scarejunba 8y ago
  Here’s an example from what he’d send you if you sponsored vim a while ago: > Thank you very much for your contribution towards the development of Vim! This will motivate me to spend more time on improving Vim. The money will be used to help needy children in Kibaale, Uganda.
endorphone 8y ago
This particular trend -- not only not asking for contributions, but openly denying them (often in advance, and when none were ever offered) for a better cause -- is a rising tendency across virtually all of Western society. Watch any challenge with a monetary prize and invariably they'll turn the sad music on and demand that the contestants regale a tale about the old grandma in the old country, or the kid's club they want to donate to, etc (obviously not the hot tub they really plan on buying, or the better SUV). If a kid has a lemonade stand they can't just want to buy a WOW membership, they have to promise that it is for some good cause. Etc. Honest giving is great, but undermining the value of work to do so isn't always constructive. In this case presumably the hypothetical people who would have given him cash are also in a good place financially.
- chongli 8y ago
  Your analysis is good but there is one element you're missing: chargebacks. People who accept a lot of donations get hit with chargebacks from time to time and they can be so difficult to deal with that they actually cost the recipient money. This is a common complaint among people who take donations for a living, such as Twitch streamers. If you ask any streamer, they will tell you they prefer Twitch "bits" over any one-off donation specifically because bits are non-refundable. Unfortunately, there are people out there who go around donating and then doing a chargeback just to troll streamers they don't like. It's a really frustrating element of the system which happens to be set up to prefer the customer over the vendor in all disputes, making it ripe for abuse.
  - Aeolun 8y ago
    It seems like any dispute involving a donation should pretty much be lost by default. It’s not as if anyone delivers an inappropriate product for a donation...
    - chongli 8y ago
      You would think so, but that's not the case. The problem is that people who receive donations don't have any special status with the payment processor. They are treated like any other vendor, so chargebacks are handled the same way.
Zrdr 8y ago
The author explicitly said it is not motivated by money for this project. When you have money, you may like the power it gives you to make incentives so people do what you like. However, in some rare cases, someone doesn't need your money and prefers doing thing how himself likes. If you don't like that, that's your problem and not the one of the people refusing your money.

by snazz 8y ago

newnewpdro 8y ago

> However, as a user, I hope that setting up a recurring donation keeps the project going and provides motivation to its author. Which is yet another reason to not want donations, since you're basically describing employment, turning their casual hobby into an obligation.

johnday 8y ago
I think the parent might have meant something slightly different - that by donating, they are showing the author that their work has actual value to other people, and that motivates them to continue. That's my take, anyway: a social rather than fiscal incentive.
- tylerhou 8y ago
  The developer could ask people to tell him/her when they donate (on the developer's behalf) to a charity the developer suggests. This would have the same effect as showing the developer that her/his work has value.

mikekchar 8y ago

I may be misremembering (and the situation is a bit different now, lending credence to the idea that I'm misremembering), but I think Bram Moolenaar used to request that people donate to the children of Uganda and send a post card to him. For people who would like that donation, I think that would be awesome: make the donation and send an email saying that you did it. This should provide the motivation you are looking for. Rather than a notification that money when into their bank account, it's a notification that it went into a bank account that they value higher.

scarejunba 8y ago
Here’s an example from what he’d send you if you sponsored vim a while ago: > Thank you very much for your contribution towards the development of Vim! This will motivate me to spend more time on improving Vim. The money will be used to help needy children in Kibaale, Uganda.

endorphone 8y ago

This particular trend -- not only not asking for contributions, but openly denying them (often in advance, and when none were ever offered) for a better cause -- is a rising tendency across virtually all of Western society. Watch any challenge with a monetary prize and invariably they'll turn the sad music on and demand that the contestants regale a tale about the old grandma in the old country, or the kid's club they want to donate to, etc (obviously not the hot tub they really plan on buying, or the better SUV). If a kid has a lemonade stand they can't just want to buy a WOW membership, they have to promise that it is for some good cause. Etc. Honest giving is great, but undermining the value of work to do so isn't always constructive. In this case presumably the hypothetical people who would have given him cash are also in a good place financially.

chongli 8y ago
Your analysis is good but there is one element you're missing: chargebacks. People who accept a lot of donations get hit with chargebacks from time to time and they can be so difficult to deal with that they actually cost the recipient money. This is a common complaint among people who take donations for a living, such as Twitch streamers. If you ask any streamer, they will tell you they prefer Twitch "bits" over any one-off donation specifically because bits are non-refundable. Unfortunately, there are people out there who go around donating and then doing a chargeback just to troll streamers they don't like. It's a really frustrating element of the system which happens to be set up to prefer the customer over the vendor in all disputes, making it ripe for abuse.
- Aeolun 8y ago
  It seems like any dispute involving a donation should pretty much be lost by default. It’s not as if anyone delivers an inappropriate product for a donation...
  - chongli 8y ago
    You would think so, but that's not the case. The problem is that people who receive donations don't have any special status with the payment processor. They are treated like any other vendor, so chargebacks are handled the same way.

Zrdr 8y ago

The author explicitly said it is not motivated by money for this project. When you have money, you may like the power it gives you to make incentives so people do what you like. However, in some rare cases, someone doesn't need your money and prefers doing thing how himself likes. If you don't like that, that's your problem and not the one of the people refusing your money.