4 ms·

I think the most critical flaw in Sudbury's plan, is that people would have to live in Sudbury (no offense) It's a small, cold, somewhat-remote city known for

by etblg 8y ago

I think the most critical flaw in Sudbury's plan, is that people would have to live in Sudbury (no offense) It's a small, cold, somewhat-remote city known for mining, and particularly for having an incredibly tall smokestack visible everywhere in town. You can fund startups, but who is going to move from other places to Sudbury?

iguy 8y ago
Would be interesting to know how they grow, and whether they open another office elsewhere, for this reason? It often sounds like what SV lacks is good ideas for what to spend all the money and talent on. Maybe the residents of Sudbury have an edge there -- presumably everybody knows a dozen people in the mining business, and is well sited to figure out what their pain points are. You just need a few of those people also know enough about tech to see how to help... and then hire a dozen coders elsewhere once they are needed.
nickelcitymario 8y ago
LOL It's not a critical flaw. It's a reality to be contended with. The flaw would be pretending this isn't the case, and trying to be just like Silicon Valley and competing with them on their terms at their own game. Sudbury is a real city in a real place. It can't relocate. It can't choose a better climate. So community leaders have to contend with reality. Like any competitive landscape, you have to look at your strengths and weaknesses. Our weaknesses are obvious (it's fucking cold). But our strengths? How about having two of the largest and longest running mining companies in the world operating here? How about having an entire class of engineers who have specialized on mining and have already chosen to live here? How about having two colleges and a university supplying fresh talent every year? How about a radically lower cost of living? And an abundance of funding from local, provincial, and federal governments who are hungry to see real progress in this space? How about a far more open immigration policy attracting top talent from countries your president is afraid of? I'm sorry but this Valley-centric mentality is just weird. It may surprise you to learn that not everyone thinks the Bay Area is awesome. (I've been. I loved visiting. Wouldn't want to live there.) Alot of brilliant mathematicians, scientists, and engineers want nothing to do with it. We also have universal health care, radically lower crime rates, an abundance of nature, low population density, comparatively cheap real estate, and hockey. So much hockey. That smoke stack has long been roughly 98% water vapor because we long ago cleaned up our smelting process to not need it, and the steam was needed to push the other 2% to the top. It's also being decommissioned in the next few years. So who's moving here? The people who love it. Don't believe me? Check out #WeLiveUpHere for a hint of the passion locals have for this community. Anyway, that was all an aside. This wasn't about "hey, look how great Sudbury is, you should all be like Sudbury." It's 100% fine if you don't like it, but it's delusional to think that everyone feels the same way. My point was that every community has to contend with tech disruption. The desperate ones will throw their money behind anything tech and hope it sticks. The smart ones will focus on the areas where they're already strong.
- rayhendricks 8y ago
  It is cold and remote. As someone living in Seattle, why do you stay in the cold/dark and not go to Toronto/Vancouver/Victoria? Much better weather + much more tech $ + proximity to NY/LAX/Seattle..
Scoundreller 8y ago
> an incredibly tall smokestack visible everywhere in town. That smokestack was a crisi-tunity: decades of acid rain made the soil incredibly favourable for growing blueberries. Ignore those blue blobs they sell in supermarkets, they’re garbage.
0_gravitas 8y ago
If that means low col, than as someone who doesn't go site seeing much to begin with, I'm in (assuming the internet speeds up there are ok)
- Scoundreller 8y ago
  Their internet can be the best in Ontario. They have a local provider that overbuilt the incumbents with fibre to the home.
  - 0_gravitas 8y ago
    In seriousness I would totally consider it if it weren't for the fact that I hear getting a Visa is hell
    - Scoundreller 8y ago
      Canada really isn’t a hard place to immigrate to if you have at least a half-specialized degree, a year or two of experience and can pass an English or French test. There are a ton of immigration programs. The current fed gov is letting in a ton of people. If you have a job lined up, go for it. It’s a better situation here than most places.
      - ticmasta 8y ago
        >> The current fed gov is letting in a ton of people. No judgement implied, but this is primarily on humanitarian and compassionate grounds. There has been little increase to economic immigration quotas since the last government. Also, very few new Canadians want to go anywhere outside Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal, which is understandable to a degree but not where the need for skilled, employment-aged people is most critical.
        Scoundreller 8y ago
        Numbers/sources? The official reports say that they’re expecting 60% of immigration growth to come from economic migrants. And the proportion of new Canadians settling in BC/ON/PQ is down from ‘97. But who knows how many “settle” and move the next day. They’re blaming processing times on any decline for economic migration, which I’d expect this government to rectify. People tend to vote for the people that let them in. And if anything, the economic migrant categories have quotas. Less demand = less points required to win an invitation. https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/annual-report-parliament-immigration-2018/report.html https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/co...

by etblg 8y ago

iguy 8y ago

Would be interesting to know how they grow, and whether they open another office elsewhere, for this reason? It often sounds like what SV lacks is good ideas for what to spend all the money and talent on. Maybe the residents of Sudbury have an edge there -- presumably everybody knows a dozen people in the mining business, and is well sited to figure out what their pain points are. You just need a few of those people also know enough about tech to see how to help... and then hire a dozen coders elsewhere once they are needed.

nickelcitymario 8y ago

LOL It's not a critical flaw. It's a reality to be contended with. The flaw would be pretending this isn't the case, and trying to be just like Silicon Valley and competing with them on their terms at their own game. Sudbury is a real city in a real place. It can't relocate. It can't choose a better climate. So community leaders have to contend with reality. Like any competitive landscape, you have to look at your strengths and weaknesses. Our weaknesses are obvious (it's fucking cold). But our strengths? How about having two of the largest and longest running mining companies in the world operating here? How about having an entire class of engineers who have specialized on mining and have already chosen to live here? How about having two colleges and a university supplying fresh talent every year? How about a radically lower cost of living? And an abundance of funding from local, provincial, and federal governments who are hungry to see real progress in this space? How about a far more open immigration policy attracting top talent from countries your president is afraid of? I'm sorry but this Valley-centric mentality is just weird. It may surprise you to learn that not everyone thinks the Bay Area is awesome. (I've been. I loved visiting. Wouldn't want to live there.) Alot of brilliant mathematicians, scientists, and engineers want nothing to do with it. We also have universal health care, radically lower crime rates, an abundance of nature, low population density, comparatively cheap real estate, and hockey. So much hockey. That smoke stack has long been roughly 98% water vapor because we long ago cleaned up our smelting process to not need it, and the steam was needed to push the other 2% to the top. It's also being decommissioned in the next few years. So who's moving here? The people who love it. Don't believe me? Check out #WeLiveUpHere for a hint of the passion locals have for this community. Anyway, that was all an aside. This wasn't about "hey, look how great Sudbury is, you should all be like Sudbury." It's 100% fine if you don't like it, but it's delusional to think that everyone feels the same way. My point was that every community has to contend with tech disruption. The desperate ones will throw their money behind anything tech and hope it sticks. The smart ones will focus on the areas where they're already strong.

rayhendricks 8y ago
It is cold and remote. As someone living in Seattle, why do you stay in the cold/dark and not go to Toronto/Vancouver/Victoria? Much better weather + much more tech $ + proximity to NY/LAX/Seattle..

Scoundreller 8y ago

> an incredibly tall smokestack visible everywhere in town. That smokestack was a crisi-tunity: decades of acid rain made the soil incredibly favourable for growing blueberries. Ignore those blue blobs they sell in supermarkets, they’re garbage.

0_gravitas 8y ago

If that means low col, than as someone who doesn't go site seeing much to begin with, I'm in (assuming the internet speeds up there are ok)

Scoundreller 8y ago
Their internet can be the best in Ontario. They have a local provider that overbuilt the incumbents with fibre to the home.
- 0_gravitas 8y ago
  In seriousness I would totally consider it if it weren't for the fact that I hear getting a Visa is hell
  - Scoundreller 8y ago
    Canada really isn’t a hard place to immigrate to if you have at least a half-specialized degree, a year or two of experience and can pass an English or French test. There are a ton of immigration programs. The current fed gov is letting in a ton of people. If you have a job lined up, go for it. It’s a better situation here than most places.
    - ticmasta 8y ago
      >> The current fed gov is letting in a ton of people. No judgement implied, but this is primarily on humanitarian and compassionate grounds. There has been little increase to economic immigration quotas since the last government. Also, very few new Canadians want to go anywhere outside Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal, which is understandable to a degree but not where the need for skilled, employment-aged people is most critical.
      - Scoundreller 8y ago
        Numbers/sources? The official reports say that they’re expecting 60% of immigration growth to come from economic migrants. And the proportion of new Canadians settling in BC/ON/PQ is down from ‘97. But who knows how many “settle” and move the next day. They’re blaming processing times on any decline for economic migration, which I’d expect this government to rectify. People tend to vote for the people that let them in. And if anything, the economic migrant categories have quotas. Less demand = less points required to win an invitation. https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/annual-report-parliament-immigration-2018/report.html https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/co...