5 ms·

There is a technology called hair coloring, stack it with a hoodie and some well fitted slacks, roll up one of the ankle cuffs a bit. Talk like you've exited a

There is a technology called hair coloring, stack it with a hoodie and some well fitted slacks, roll up one of the ankle cuffs a bit. Talk like you've exited a startup and are just working for fun, or something to keep you interested, but not like you actually have to.

sigfubar 8y ago
Solid advice regardless of decade.
simonsarris 8y ago
Agree 100%, it has blown me away my whole life how engineers downplay marketing and [product|personal] presentation in spite of the reams of data suggesting it has some of the best ROI possible of anything you can spend your time improving. Do you want to make more money, get more connections, have everyone like you more and treat you better? It's as simple as buying some nicer shirts, getting regular haircuts, and eating better (which has its own host of plusses). Some programmers are 55 and really good. They also have stains on their t-shirts, are overweight, and act morose all the time. In a perfect world this wouldn't matter for a job interview, but you are not interviewing or operating for a job in a perfect world.
- mhd 8y ago
  In my experience, the opposite of the aforementioned 50-something hoodie wearer would be someone with a Oxford shirt and jacket, ie well-dressed, but not hip. And they might dress up similarly in their free time, when they're not with their co-workers. So the "Han Shot First" tee might be as much an unwanted disguise as the "business casual" dress code the startup bros avoid. I'm not saying that one shouldn't adapt a bit, but dyed hair and "How do you do, fellow kids" clothes overshoot the goal by a good bit.
- ams6110 8y ago
  > They also have stains on their t-shirts, are overweight, and act morose all the time. Describes more than one 20-something developer I know. Being a sloven does not correlate with age.
  - jimbokun 8y ago
    Yes, but the 20-somethings don't need to over-compensate for age discrimination.
- larrywright 8y ago
  I often tell people (particularly younger ones, college age-ish) that one of the best ways to stand out among their peers is to learn how to dress. You don't have to wear a three piece suit, but wear clothes that are clean, fit your body (and body type), and look nice. This applies regardless of company dress code. If it's jeans, then wear nice jeans that aren't wrinkly or full of holes. Pair it with a nice shirt and shoes, and you'll look better than 90% of the people around you. If your job calls for something dressier, buy the best quality stuff you can afford (it will last longer), and get it tailored so that it fits you. This seems like a minor thing, but assuming you're not incompetent, someone who knows how to dress themselves will be perceived better by those whose opinions matter. The key is to match the general attire of the people around you, but do it a bit nicer. If everyone is wearing shorts and jeans, don't wear a suit to work. Edit: This advice isn't limited to young people, there are plenty of older people that need to learn how to dress themselves. As a general rule, though, the younger generation dresses a lot more casually than I did at their age, and many don't seem to have been taught when an occasion calls for dressing a little nicer.
paulrpotts 8y ago
Absolutely not. This is idiotic advice. I'm not paid to be pretty. I earned this gray beard and if you don't respect the years of experience it represents, you and your hipster brogrammer culture can fuck right off.
- simonsarris 8y ago
  I totally understand your frustration and that looks matter even if just subconsciously to everyone is quite the shitty paradigm to navigate. Humans being mimetic creatures results in all sorts of weird unfairness and idiocy. However when it comes to advice, are we interviewing for a job in an imaginary world, or the real one? If it's the real world, this is great advice. Just like having a marketing team instead of thinking every product will sell itself is great advice that almost every company in existence learns at some point or another.
duderific 8y ago
This seems a bit tongue in cheek, but there is some truth to it. You have to at least be able to seem like someone the 20-somethings can hang out with without feeling awkward. This is less about appearance than attitude. If you are enthusiastic and keep up with the youth culture a bit, you can probably fit in ok. I'm 49 and have gray hair, and have since I was in my mid 30's, but I've not had any trouble getting work when I had to (or wanted to) change jobs. That said, I dress fairly youthfully (in typical Silicon Valley jeans/untucked shirt) and am told I don't look my age.
- brootstrap 8y ago
  your name is also duderific so you must be a fantastic duderino to hang out with! Who wouldnt want to work with such a dudeson.
ryandrake 8y ago
That’s an ok strategy if you actually want to end up in a loud open office, “crushing it” with 20-something tech ‘bros, failing fast and playing hard. However, I’d guess that most people will see past the “How do you do, fellow kids” disguise. Embrace the gray beard, find one of those companies that welcomes us geezers, and clearly articulate how our decades of experience translates to business value.
- ghaff 8y ago
  Take Dan Lyons' book about his time at Hubspot. In what universe was that going to end well? (Leaving aside the question of whether it was ever intended to end well by all involved.) Clearly there are some companies more open to more senior people in various roles. At some level, the path of least resistance at least is to accept that.
arcticfox 8y ago
Creed's plan from The Office. "I'm 30. Well, in November I'll be 30." https://makeameme.org/meme/im-30-well https://makeameme.org/meme/im-30-well
uptownfunk 8y ago
To all the haters, yes it was half tongue in cheek.. Forget about you 50 year olds out there, I was the stupid 22 year old wearing a suit out of university.. didn’t get any offers till I put on a scandinavian accent and dressed like a hipster.
sempron64 8y ago
I'm asking this seriously: Is rolling up one cuff a trend now? I have not noticed this.

sigfubar 8y ago

Solid advice regardless of decade.

simonsarris 8y ago

Agree 100%, it has blown me away my whole life how engineers downplay marketing and [product|personal] presentation in spite of the reams of data suggesting it has some of the best ROI possible of anything you can spend your time improving. Do you want to make more money, get more connections, have everyone like you more and treat you better? It's as simple as buying some nicer shirts, getting regular haircuts, and eating better (which has its own host of plusses). Some programmers are 55 and really good. They also have stains on their t-shirts, are overweight, and act morose all the time. In a perfect world this wouldn't matter for a job interview, but you are not interviewing or operating for a job in a perfect world.

mhd 8y ago
In my experience, the opposite of the aforementioned 50-something hoodie wearer would be someone with a Oxford shirt and jacket, ie well-dressed, but not hip. And they might dress up similarly in their free time, when they're not with their co-workers. So the "Han Shot First" tee might be as much an unwanted disguise as the "business casual" dress code the startup bros avoid. I'm not saying that one shouldn't adapt a bit, but dyed hair and "How do you do, fellow kids" clothes overshoot the goal by a good bit.
ams6110 8y ago
> They also have stains on their t-shirts, are overweight, and act morose all the time. Describes more than one 20-something developer I know. Being a sloven does not correlate with age.
- jimbokun 8y ago
  Yes, but the 20-somethings don't need to over-compensate for age discrimination.
larrywright 8y ago
I often tell people (particularly younger ones, college age-ish) that one of the best ways to stand out among their peers is to learn how to dress. You don't have to wear a three piece suit, but wear clothes that are clean, fit your body (and body type), and look nice. This applies regardless of company dress code. If it's jeans, then wear nice jeans that aren't wrinkly or full of holes. Pair it with a nice shirt and shoes, and you'll look better than 90% of the people around you. If your job calls for something dressier, buy the best quality stuff you can afford (it will last longer), and get it tailored so that it fits you. This seems like a minor thing, but assuming you're not incompetent, someone who knows how to dress themselves will be perceived better by those whose opinions matter. The key is to match the general attire of the people around you, but do it a bit nicer. If everyone is wearing shorts and jeans, don't wear a suit to work. Edit: This advice isn't limited to young people, there are plenty of older people that need to learn how to dress themselves. As a general rule, though, the younger generation dresses a lot more casually than I did at their age, and many don't seem to have been taught when an occasion calls for dressing a little nicer.

paulrpotts 8y ago

Absolutely not. This is idiotic advice. I'm not paid to be pretty. I earned this gray beard and if you don't respect the years of experience it represents, you and your hipster brogrammer culture can fuck right off.

simonsarris 8y ago
I totally understand your frustration and that looks matter even if just subconsciously to everyone is quite the shitty paradigm to navigate. Humans being mimetic creatures results in all sorts of weird unfairness and idiocy. However when it comes to advice, are we interviewing for a job in an imaginary world, or the real one? If it's the real world, this is great advice. Just like having a marketing team instead of thinking every product will sell itself is great advice that almost every company in existence learns at some point or another.

duderific 8y ago

This seems a bit tongue in cheek, but there is some truth to it. You have to at least be able to seem like someone the 20-somethings can hang out with without feeling awkward. This is less about appearance than attitude. If you are enthusiastic and keep up with the youth culture a bit, you can probably fit in ok. I'm 49 and have gray hair, and have since I was in my mid 30's, but I've not had any trouble getting work when I had to (or wanted to) change jobs. That said, I dress fairly youthfully (in typical Silicon Valley jeans/untucked shirt) and am told I don't look my age.

brootstrap 8y ago
your name is also duderific so you must be a fantastic duderino to hang out with! Who wouldnt want to work with such a dudeson.

ryandrake 8y ago

That’s an ok strategy if you actually want to end up in a loud open office, “crushing it” with 20-something tech ‘bros, failing fast and playing hard. However, I’d guess that most people will see past the “How do you do, fellow kids” disguise. Embrace the gray beard, find one of those companies that welcomes us geezers, and clearly articulate how our decades of experience translates to business value.

ghaff 8y ago
Take Dan Lyons' book about his time at Hubspot. In what universe was that going to end well? (Leaving aside the question of whether it was ever intended to end well by all involved.) Clearly there are some companies more open to more senior people in various roles. At some level, the path of least resistance at least is to accept that.

arcticfox 8y ago

Creed's plan from The Office. "I'm 30. Well, in November I'll be 30." https://makeameme.org/meme/im-30-well https://makeameme.org/meme/im-30-well

uptownfunk 8y ago

To all the haters, yes it was half tongue in cheek.. Forget about you 50 year olds out there, I was the stupid 22 year old wearing a suit out of university.. didn’t get any offers till I put on a scandinavian accent and dressed like a hipster.

sempron64 8y ago

I'm asking this seriously: Is rolling up one cuff a trend now? I have not noticed this.