8 ms·

It might be overrated but when I read the crazy whiteboard interviewing, the pains people go through to get money here on HN, I would say it is pretty important

It might be overrated but when I read the crazy whiteboard interviewing, the pains people go through to get money here on HN, I would say it is pretty important. I never had to do an interview in my life (25+ years as a professional), never had to really look for projects or investors. Not because of my parents but because I like to talk and network and connect people. When I need something I know where to ask. Sure maybe it is not required, but it sure makes life a lot easier IMHO.

ghaff 8y ago
Yeah. I've had interviews and I won't say they were formalities. But pretty much every one of those interviews (post first job out of school) were conversations with people I knew reasonably well.
seem_2211 8y ago
+1. How much of the angst on HN on the tech discriminates on age (which I fully agree with) is partly because people have locked themselves in a cubicle for ten years?
- mixmastamyk 8y ago
  Or worked remote and let the network whither.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    That's my #1 fear now. Life circumstances made me leave the big city I lived in previously, which is also a regional business/tech hub. While I was never doing explicit networking, I got pretty high mileage out of casual encounters and common projects I've done while hanging around a bunch of social and tech communities. Now, I feel totally disconnected, and sans of eventually moving back to some large city, I have no idea how to solve it. "Networking on-line" doesn't seem to be a thing (or maybe I'm not trying hard enough). (I'm happy with my remote job. Most useful contacts and rewarding relationships I had came from off-job work. It's communities that I miss.)
    - danmaz74 8y ago
      I've been working remotely from Rome for 5 years with my own startup, and really felt that problem. Sometimes I think about possible solutions for people with this problem (even if I recently moved to London, I'm still not doing quite enough in this respect). Would you like to brainstorm about this, one of these days?
  - tluyben2 8y ago
    I solely work remotely and have always done (never worked in an office as such); I always work and worked in bars, coffeeshops, meetup venues: my breaks from coding, managing, negotiations during the day (and often to late evening) are talking with strangers. We end up with ‘keep in touch’ and even sometimes friendships come out of this (it also fixes the ‘you do not make new friends after 30’ thing).
- blablabla123 8y ago
  Might be true, also I want to emphasize that at least in the startup scene I've seen business people discouraging tech people from networking. Probably being afraid that the people would indeed "leave their cubicle". And yes, I also got almost all of my jobs through my network including LinkedIn, all formal tests I did - even when I passed - were for jobs that I didn't take in the end. Oftentimes because those weren't paid so well or because the perks were lousy. YMMV if you work for one of the big companies.
asaph 8y ago
> ... when I read the crazy whiteboard interviewing, the pains people go through to get money here on HN, I would say it is pretty important. Networking won't help you get hired at a top tech company if you cannot perform well on "whiteboard interviews". It generally doesn't matter that you have an internal referral. If you don't do well on the whiteboard, it's a no-hire regardless of network. Even famous people get turned away for failing on the whiteboard. e.g. the creator of Homebrew[0] when he interviewed @ Google[1]. [0] https://brew.sh/ https://brew.sh/ [1] https://twitter.com/mxcl/status/608682016205344768 https://twitter.com/mxcl/status/608682016205344768
- matwood 8y ago
  The tech world is so much larger than FAANG, no matter what SV wants you to believe.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    The greatest trick Silicon Valley ever pulled was convincing engineers their hoops were the righteous hoops to jump through.
    - m1n1 8y ago
      What was their payoff for pulling this trick?
      - deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
      - toomuchtodo 8y ago
        Quality talent that might have gone elsewhere.
- ousta 8y ago
  it will. not at an entry level job, not at a core technical job where you still need to code but anything else (VP, Manager) it will
everdev 8y ago
I ran a successful consulting company where ~90% of our revenue came from professional networking. If you want something from people (like a job, their time or their money) then you should probably build trust and a connection with those people. That's called networking.
- lifeisstillgood 8y ago
  Can you expand on that - what do you mean by professional networking - sales people taking leads out for coffee a lot, keeping in touch with folks you used to work with, glad handing at lots of industry events I think "networking" covers a lot of different behaviours and I am always interested in which ones work
  - my_username_is_ 8y ago
    The way I see it, networking is making friends with similar (or at least tangential) professional interests. In different roles and industries, the specifics can be very different. But the foundation of it is the relationship that you have with someone. I would say that my best networking contacts are friends that I know from college, or who I used to work with. These people need to know that you're competent enough to be successful in what you're looking to do. But they're also going to need to enjoy spending more time with you. It's the people I consider friends that I want to reach out to about working with, and I know that these people would be advocates for me within their respective organizations.
  - everdev 8y ago
    For me it was keeping a client happy and then always saying yes to introductions that would eventually be made. Even if the project wasn't a good fit I'd say yes to the meeting just to build a connection and hopefully point the person in the right direction. Or for non-clients, just taking time to ask how they're doing, what's new or really showing any spontaneous interest in their life or career. It's amazing how many times I checked in with people that it would remind them of someone they overheard needing consulting.
  - antonkm 8y ago
themodelplumber 8y ago
That's a gift that you have that many here don't, unfortunately. I coach some people for whom networking is all but out of the question. They test at really low levels of agreeableness, for example, but really high competence and a reasonable level of openness. So they aim for workplaces that want competent people who will keep their heads down. It's a different set of challenges for sure. We work on networking-arena skills in a sort of separate thread, but it sometimes just has to be lower priority or more focused on the fundamentals.

ghaff 8y ago

Yeah. I've had interviews and I won't say they were formalities. But pretty much every one of those interviews (post first job out of school) were conversations with people I knew reasonably well.

seem_2211 8y ago

+1. How much of the angst on HN on the tech discriminates on age (which I fully agree with) is partly because people have locked themselves in a cubicle for ten years?

mixmastamyk 8y ago
Or worked remote and let the network whither.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  That's my #1 fear now. Life circumstances made me leave the big city I lived in previously, which is also a regional business/tech hub. While I was never doing explicit networking, I got pretty high mileage out of casual encounters and common projects I've done while hanging around a bunch of social and tech communities. Now, I feel totally disconnected, and sans of eventually moving back to some large city, I have no idea how to solve it. "Networking on-line" doesn't seem to be a thing (or maybe I'm not trying hard enough). (I'm happy with my remote job. Most useful contacts and rewarding relationships I had came from off-job work. It's communities that I miss.)
  - danmaz74 8y ago
    I've been working remotely from Rome for 5 years with my own startup, and really felt that problem. Sometimes I think about possible solutions for people with this problem (even if I recently moved to London, I'm still not doing quite enough in this respect). Would you like to brainstorm about this, one of these days?
- tluyben2 8y ago
  I solely work remotely and have always done (never worked in an office as such); I always work and worked in bars, coffeeshops, meetup venues: my breaks from coding, managing, negotiations during the day (and often to late evening) are talking with strangers. We end up with ‘keep in touch’ and even sometimes friendships come out of this (it also fixes the ‘you do not make new friends after 30’ thing).
blablabla123 8y ago
Might be true, also I want to emphasize that at least in the startup scene I've seen business people discouraging tech people from networking. Probably being afraid that the people would indeed "leave their cubicle". And yes, I also got almost all of my jobs through my network including LinkedIn, all formal tests I did - even when I passed - were for jobs that I didn't take in the end. Oftentimes because those weren't paid so well or because the perks were lousy. YMMV if you work for one of the big companies.

asaph 8y ago

> ... when I read the crazy whiteboard interviewing, the pains people go through to get money here on HN, I would say it is pretty important. Networking won't help you get hired at a top tech company if you cannot perform well on "whiteboard interviews". It generally doesn't matter that you have an internal referral. If you don't do well on the whiteboard, it's a no-hire regardless of network. Even famous people get turned away for failing on the whiteboard. e.g. the creator of Homebrew[0] when he interviewed @ Google[1]. [0] https://brew.sh/ https://brew.sh/ [1] https://twitter.com/mxcl/status/608682016205344768 https://twitter.com/mxcl/status/608682016205344768

matwood 8y ago
The tech world is so much larger than FAANG, no matter what SV wants you to believe.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  The greatest trick Silicon Valley ever pulled was convincing engineers their hoops were the righteous hoops to jump through.
  - m1n1 8y ago
    What was their payoff for pulling this trick?
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - toomuchtodo 8y ago
      Quality talent that might have gone elsewhere.
ousta 8y ago
it will. not at an entry level job, not at a core technical job where you still need to code but anything else (VP, Manager) it will

everdev 8y ago

I ran a successful consulting company where ~90% of our revenue came from professional networking. If you want something from people (like a job, their time or their money) then you should probably build trust and a connection with those people. That's called networking.

lifeisstillgood 8y ago
Can you expand on that - what do you mean by professional networking - sales people taking leads out for coffee a lot, keeping in touch with folks you used to work with, glad handing at lots of industry events I think "networking" covers a lot of different behaviours and I am always interested in which ones work
- my_username_is_ 8y ago
  The way I see it, networking is making friends with similar (or at least tangential) professional interests. In different roles and industries, the specifics can be very different. But the foundation of it is the relationship that you have with someone. I would say that my best networking contacts are friends that I know from college, or who I used to work with. These people need to know that you're competent enough to be successful in what you're looking to do. But they're also going to need to enjoy spending more time with you. It's the people I consider friends that I want to reach out to about working with, and I know that these people would be advocates for me within their respective organizations.
- everdev 8y ago
  For me it was keeping a client happy and then always saying yes to introductions that would eventually be made. Even if the project wasn't a good fit I'd say yes to the meeting just to build a connection and hopefully point the person in the right direction. Or for non-clients, just taking time to ask how they're doing, what's new or really showing any spontaneous interest in their life or career. It's amazing how many times I checked in with people that it would remind them of someone they overheard needing consulting.
- antonkm 8y ago

themodelplumber 8y ago

That's a gift that you have that many here don't, unfortunately. I coach some people for whom networking is all but out of the question. They test at really low levels of agreeableness, for example, but really high competence and a reasonable level of openness. So they aim for workplaces that want competent people who will keep their heads down. It's a different set of challenges for sure. We work on networking-arena skills in a sort of separate thread, but it sometimes just has to be lower priority or more focused on the fundamentals.