6 ms·

"Live or die" as in whether the company survives. They're not talking about clients literally killing them. They're saying the company has survived all these ye

"Live or die" as in whether the company survives. They're not talking about clients literally killing them. They're saying the company has survived all these years in the free-market environment because of their high ethical standards.

DoctorOetker 8y ago
that's also how I read it, but that doesn't mean it makes sense: if they had in that time and place set a high ethical standard of not participating in strikebreaking, they might indeed not have survived as a company, so their survival was the result of their lower ethical standards...
- wmf 8y ago
  Maybe they're libertarians so they think strikes are unethical.
  - benj111 8y ago
    Wouldn't libertarians support your right to strike?
    - hutzlibu 8y ago
      Depends. Libertarians believe in free individuals making contracts. So unless the right to strike is somewhere included (here in germany it is through laws on a higher level) they would not, as strike is a breach of contract otherwise.
      - benj111 8y ago
        Why would the right to strike have to be in the contract? The contract just doesn't have to ban strikes, surely? Libertarians default to liberty, unless opted out of, that's my understanding at least.
        hutzlibu 8y ago
        You make a contract which says you work for money. If you strike, you do not work - you therefore break contract. "libertarians default to liberty" True. The liberty of individual. For example to make contracts - or to brake them. But the idea is, that society can only work if people do not break their contracts. Otherwise whats the point in them?
        benj111 8y ago
        Surely then it depends upon the reason for the strike? If the strike is over layoffs, wage cuts, unsafe work practices. They're all potential contract breaches.
        hutzlibu 8y ago
        "Surely then it depends upon the reason for the strike?" For sure. If the other side breachs contract then, then strike is a very good way to fight that. Like work safe issues. But layoffs for example ... are not really a breach of contract. (unless of course their contract was fir a longer time)
        benj111 8y ago
        So we are back to the beginning again. Libertarians aren't ideologically against strikes.
        hutzlibu 8y ago
        Well, if you define things like that, than I have to ask who do you mean by libertarians? There are many different branches. I was refering to the free market libertarians and with strike I meant the ordinary one, like the one in question. Workers strike to get a better deal. Better money mostly and or less hours. And this is a breach of contract, which the free market libertarians I know, would be against. The leftwing anarchist libertarians I know on the other hand would be all for strike and workers seizing the factory for themself.

DoctorOetker 8y ago

that's also how I read it, but that doesn't mean it makes sense: if they had in that time and place set a high ethical standard of not participating in strikebreaking, they might indeed not have survived as a company, so their survival was the result of their lower ethical standards...

wmf 8y ago
Maybe they're libertarians so they think strikes are unethical.
- benj111 8y ago
  Wouldn't libertarians support your right to strike?
  - hutzlibu 8y ago
    Depends. Libertarians believe in free individuals making contracts. So unless the right to strike is somewhere included (here in germany it is through laws on a higher level) they would not, as strike is a breach of contract otherwise.
    - benj111 8y ago
      Why would the right to strike have to be in the contract? The contract just doesn't have to ban strikes, surely? Libertarians default to liberty, unless opted out of, that's my understanding at least.
      - hutzlibu 8y ago
        You make a contract which says you work for money. If you strike, you do not work - you therefore break contract. "libertarians default to liberty" True. The liberty of individual. For example to make contracts - or to brake them. But the idea is, that society can only work if people do not break their contracts. Otherwise whats the point in them?
        benj111 8y ago
        Surely then it depends upon the reason for the strike? If the strike is over layoffs, wage cuts, unsafe work practices. They're all potential contract breaches.
        hutzlibu 8y ago
        "Surely then it depends upon the reason for the strike?" For sure. If the other side breachs contract then, then strike is a very good way to fight that. Like work safe issues. But layoffs for example ... are not really a breach of contract. (unless of course their contract was fir a longer time)
        benj111 8y ago
        So we are back to the beginning again. Libertarians aren't ideologically against strikes.
        hutzlibu 8y ago
        Well, if you define things like that, than I have to ask who do you mean by libertarians? There are many different branches. I was refering to the free market libertarians and with strike I meant the ordinary one, like the one in question. Workers strike to get a better deal. Better money mostly and or less hours. And this is a breach of contract, which the free market libertarians I know, would be against. The leftwing anarchist libertarians I know on the other hand would be all for strike and workers seizing the factory for themself.