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I think publicly calling one of the rescuers a paedophile without grounds sunk Musk permanently on this one, regardless of the excellent but unusable engineerin

by dx7tnt 8y ago

I think publicly calling one of the rescuers a paedophile without grounds sunk Musk permanently on this one, regardless of the excellent but unusable engineering solution provided by his nootropicly charged ego.

markdown 8y ago
It was a horrible choice of insult, but to be fair, the rescuer was a real asshole to him for no good reason (this isn't a defence of the insult, just saying that Musk was justifiably furious). Why would you attack some guy trying to help you achieve your goal of rescuing the trapped boys, and call him names on international tv.
- maxerickson 8y ago
  It's really not clear at all that Musk did anything other than get in the way. Trying to help and getting in the way instead isn't praiseworthy.
  - markdown 8y ago
    I addressed that claim in my earlier comment. > The biggest argument against I've read was that the online drama took attention and resources away from the people in the cave. I find that absolutely absurd. The rescue team weren't checking their social media or waiting on Musk, or distracted in any way by the online drama. Has anyone in the cave said that some engineers on the other side of the world were holding them up or in some way impeding their efforts? I find it extremely hard to believe that some shitty twitter drama got in the way of cave rescue efforts.
    - Rebelgecko 8y ago
      I believe one of the divers did. Then Musk accused him of having sex with children.
      - Supermancho 8y ago
        That was not what happened. The tweet is here: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-28/elon-musk-says-cave-rescuer-defamation-case-should-be-dismissed/10671066 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-28/elon-musk-says-cave-r... I thought it was obvious, that it was a clever dig at a guy he was fighting with (as much as idiots can fight on twitter, cough trump). Something about a guy with a hard on for getting to some kids. I'm sure Elon was high. I REALLY don't understand the HN brigade trying to imagine it into more than that. There's plenty of reason to go after some of Elon's money to keep the fame train going, but it wouldn't go anywhere in the US. In the UK? They are big on curbing particular kinds of speech and behavior. He has a good shot at getting the money. Edit: I am wrong, that's why.
        detaro 8y ago
        From your link: > he later urged a BuzzFeed News reporter in an August 30 email to investigate Mr Unsworth and "stop defending child rapists".
        Supermancho 8y ago
        That's not an accusation (or defamation) either. Sheesh.
        detaro 8y ago
        How is "stop defending child rapists" not suggesting the person is a child rapist, doubling down on the initial claim? (which was in bad taste, but wouldn't have been to big a deal if he'd not stuck by it)
        Supermancho 8y ago
        That's a circumstantial partial quote from an email, editorialized, that fits the narrative. That's how. I really don't understand how this is confusing. I mean, I'm willing to read the email where he makes an accusation, but you would think that would be helpful evidence in the case presented.
- praneshp 8y ago
  > Why would you attack some guy trying to help you achieve your goal of rescuing the trapped boys, and call him names on twitter Something I've been wondering about too.
  - bjl 8y ago
    >> Why would you attack some guy trying to help you achieve your goal of rescuing the trapped boys, and call him names on twitter >Something I've been wondering about too. Because it was a distracting and transparent PR stunt designed to nothing other than stroke Musk's ego.
- rsynnott 8y ago
  So on top of everything else, Musk has such anger management issues that he can't avoid being sued for libel and making a fool of himself in the media? You're not really helping your case.
- stef25 8y ago
  There are very few people in the world that can dive like these guys do. If I was that good at something, having some Silicon Valley billionaire show up to "help" with some outrageously stupid idea, that would also piss me off. Although he should have known better than to throw the first punch.
  - markdown 8y ago
    > some outrageously stupid idea Citation needed. It was a great idea, and vastly superior to the method they actually used to get the kids out. Of course it turned out not to fit, but that just means the cave diver who was in communication with Musk gave him incorrect data in the first place. The divers themselves said it was a great risk bringing them out and the only reason they eventually took the risk they did was because the rain continued and it was feared that the water level would rise. You can be the best diver in the world, but have no idea how to handle panicked kids who have no dive training. Sticking them in a tube and dragging them out would have been far safer than the method that luckily worked. You and the douchebag diver who attacked Musk for offering help would both be singing a different tune right now had a couple of the kids drowned on the way out.
    - stef25 8y ago
      That douchebag diver did succeed though. There were like a dozen people involved that were the best in the world at what they do and that's the plan they came up with and it worked. US and Thai navy seals couldn't do any better. Maybe if Harry was an engineer / cave diver instead of an anaesthesiologist / cave diver they would have come up with the submarine idea. > that just means the cave diver who was in communication with Musk gave him incorrect data in the first place Citation needed?

by dx7tnt 8y ago

markdown 8y ago

It was a horrible choice of insult, but to be fair, the rescuer was a real asshole to him for no good reason (this isn't a defence of the insult, just saying that Musk was justifiably furious). Why would you attack some guy trying to help you achieve your goal of rescuing the trapped boys, and call him names on international tv.

maxerickson 8y ago
It's really not clear at all that Musk did anything other than get in the way. Trying to help and getting in the way instead isn't praiseworthy.
- markdown 8y ago
  I addressed that claim in my earlier comment. > The biggest argument against I've read was that the online drama took attention and resources away from the people in the cave. I find that absolutely absurd. The rescue team weren't checking their social media or waiting on Musk, or distracted in any way by the online drama. Has anyone in the cave said that some engineers on the other side of the world were holding them up or in some way impeding their efforts? I find it extremely hard to believe that some shitty twitter drama got in the way of cave rescue efforts.
  - Rebelgecko 8y ago
    I believe one of the divers did. Then Musk accused him of having sex with children.
    - Supermancho 8y ago
      That was not what happened. The tweet is here: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-28/elon-musk-says-cave-rescuer-defamation-case-should-be-dismissed/10671066 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-28/elon-musk-says-cave-r... I thought it was obvious, that it was a clever dig at a guy he was fighting with (as much as idiots can fight on twitter, cough trump). Something about a guy with a hard on for getting to some kids. I'm sure Elon was high. I REALLY don't understand the HN brigade trying to imagine it into more than that. There's plenty of reason to go after some of Elon's money to keep the fame train going, but it wouldn't go anywhere in the US. In the UK? They are big on curbing particular kinds of speech and behavior. He has a good shot at getting the money. Edit: I am wrong, that's why.
      - detaro 8y ago
        From your link: > he later urged a BuzzFeed News reporter in an August 30 email to investigate Mr Unsworth and "stop defending child rapists".
        Supermancho 8y ago
        That's not an accusation (or defamation) either. Sheesh.
        detaro 8y ago
        How is "stop defending child rapists" not suggesting the person is a child rapist, doubling down on the initial claim? (which was in bad taste, but wouldn't have been to big a deal if he'd not stuck by it)
        Supermancho 8y ago
        That's a circumstantial partial quote from an email, editorialized, that fits the narrative. That's how. I really don't understand how this is confusing. I mean, I'm willing to read the email where he makes an accusation, but you would think that would be helpful evidence in the case presented.
praneshp 8y ago
> Why would you attack some guy trying to help you achieve your goal of rescuing the trapped boys, and call him names on twitter Something I've been wondering about too.
- bjl 8y ago
  >> Why would you attack some guy trying to help you achieve your goal of rescuing the trapped boys, and call him names on twitter >Something I've been wondering about too. Because it was a distracting and transparent PR stunt designed to nothing other than stroke Musk's ego.
rsynnott 8y ago
So on top of everything else, Musk has such anger management issues that he can't avoid being sued for libel and making a fool of himself in the media? You're not really helping your case.
stef25 8y ago
There are very few people in the world that can dive like these guys do. If I was that good at something, having some Silicon Valley billionaire show up to "help" with some outrageously stupid idea, that would also piss me off. Although he should have known better than to throw the first punch.
- markdown 8y ago
  > some outrageously stupid idea Citation needed. It was a great idea, and vastly superior to the method they actually used to get the kids out. Of course it turned out not to fit, but that just means the cave diver who was in communication with Musk gave him incorrect data in the first place. The divers themselves said it was a great risk bringing them out and the only reason they eventually took the risk they did was because the rain continued and it was feared that the water level would rise. You can be the best diver in the world, but have no idea how to handle panicked kids who have no dive training. Sticking them in a tube and dragging them out would have been far safer than the method that luckily worked. You and the douchebag diver who attacked Musk for offering help would both be singing a different tune right now had a couple of the kids drowned on the way out.
  - stef25 8y ago
    That douchebag diver did succeed though. There were like a dozen people involved that were the best in the world at what they do and that's the plan they came up with and it worked. US and Thai navy seals couldn't do any better. Maybe if Harry was an engineer / cave diver instead of an anaesthesiologist / cave diver they would have come up with the submarine idea. > that just means the cave diver who was in communication with Musk gave him incorrect data in the first place Citation needed?