4 ms·

As a noob in biology - let alone the power of CRISPR - I am often wondering about claims of any GMO being declared safe for wide-scale use 'in the wild'. This w

by rapnie 8y ago

As a noob in biology - let alone the power of CRISPR - I am often wondering about claims of any GMO being declared safe for wide-scale use 'in the wild'. This while (other) scientists are marveling at the incredible new intricacies they are discovering about the ecosystems they study. I know mutations are occurring all of the time, but to me the ones we humans create seem likely to be more risky / impactful than the natural ones. But, then, I am a noob :)

SuoDuanDao 8y ago
The analogy I always use is of a computer program - a 700 megabyte program in a language not designed for readability would be bad enough, but there's also epigenetics to consider - every cell in a multicellular organism is essentially forming part of the compiler for the cells next to it, so the actual complexity is probably orders of magnitude larger. And people want to give it a clean bill of health after three months of beta testing by mice? No games studio would ship something like this.
- lawlessone 8y ago
  >No games studio would ship something like this. Bethesda might
  - belenos46 8y ago
    But if they did, we'd be able to patch it at home :D
orwin 8y ago
The main risk in "artificial" GMOs are that the evolved species might be a bit too adapted to the environment and start to replace the original and/or destroy species from the old biome (because new toxins kill usefull insect or small bugs, or because its taking to much from the soil thus kill surounding trees and plants...). Other concerns exist (especially when playing around viruses or other self-repliquant organisms). I had two really long discussions (hours) with a former PhD in genetic, although he did not wrote anything about DNA: he was studying population of plants, insects and sometime cattle. From what i understood, the issue with GMOs is that the change is too fast, and other organisms from the same ecosystem often can't adapt. But this case sometime appear with "natural" settings too. And human exploitation of ressources have the exact same effect, but often without any scientist to limit the damage, as they are called after most of the damage are done.
mschuster91 8y ago
We're actually already doing this - in Burkina Faso, researchers now have the permit to release GMO mosquitoes: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/researchers-to-release-genetically-engineered-mosquitoes-in-africa-for-first-time/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/researchers-to-re... Obviously, the first papers already are discussing the ethical impact of such actions: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6062015/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6062015/
Ultimatt 8y ago
GMO crops for example are usually quite small changes, frequently genetically less drastic and more controlled than selective crossing of plants to achieve a similar outcome. Sort of like the difference in risk of switching from a bread knife to a scalpel. Its sharper sure so you need to be careful but its fundamentally a more accurate equivalent of what you were already doing before and understandable. What's being discussed here is more like moving to training crocodiles to only bite down on the line you want to cut, and trust them to not eat the patient. The fundamental question anyone working in that gig would ask: "can you actually train crocodiles? will they turn on you?"

by rapnie 8y ago

SuoDuanDao 8y ago

The analogy I always use is of a computer program - a 700 megabyte program in a language not designed for readability would be bad enough, but there's also epigenetics to consider - every cell in a multicellular organism is essentially forming part of the compiler for the cells next to it, so the actual complexity is probably orders of magnitude larger. And people want to give it a clean bill of health after three months of beta testing by mice? No games studio would ship something like this.

lawlessone 8y ago
>No games studio would ship something like this. Bethesda might
- belenos46 8y ago
  But if they did, we'd be able to patch it at home :D

orwin 8y ago

The main risk in "artificial" GMOs are that the evolved species might be a bit too adapted to the environment and start to replace the original and/or destroy species from the old biome (because new toxins kill usefull insect or small bugs, or because its taking to much from the soil thus kill surounding trees and plants...). Other concerns exist (especially when playing around viruses or other self-repliquant organisms). I had two really long discussions (hours) with a former PhD in genetic, although he did not wrote anything about DNA: he was studying population of plants, insects and sometime cattle. From what i understood, the issue with GMOs is that the change is too fast, and other organisms from the same ecosystem often can't adapt. But this case sometime appear with "natural" settings too. And human exploitation of ressources have the exact same effect, but often without any scientist to limit the damage, as they are called after most of the damage are done.

mschuster91 8y ago

We're actually already doing this - in Burkina Faso, researchers now have the permit to release GMO mosquitoes: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/researchers-to-release-genetically-engineered-mosquitoes-in-africa-for-first-time/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/researchers-to-re... Obviously, the first papers already are discussing the ethical impact of such actions: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6062015/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6062015/

Ultimatt 8y ago

GMO crops for example are usually quite small changes, frequently genetically less drastic and more controlled than selective crossing of plants to achieve a similar outcome. Sort of like the difference in risk of switching from a bread knife to a scalpel. Its sharper sure so you need to be careful but its fundamentally a more accurate equivalent of what you were already doing before and understandable. What's being discussed here is more like moving to training crocodiles to only bite down on the line you want to cut, and trust them to not eat the patient. The fundamental question anyone working in that gig would ask: "can you actually train crocodiles? will they turn on you?"