5 ms·

Nerds are very easy to take advantage of.

40acres 8y ago
I agree with this point. Earlier today I made a similar comment regarding the lack of political strength among software developers, for such a well paid (relative to most Americans) trade, it's hard to name a powerful special interest group for developers. There are lots of theories regarding personality types that lead to speculation of why this is the case, but I'd really like to see some research that digs into this. Labor by developers is becoming more and more valuable, with this you expect more political strength.. but it does not seem to be happening.
- mywittyname 8y ago
  Most of us believe the world being this meritocracy and we all get what we deserve and work for. And think the only people who would band together are the weak ones that can't compete on merit. People may not agree, but every argument I've heard against unionization contains this sentiment. Even if it isn't expressed so boldly.
  - moomin 8y ago
    Yep, plenty of us believe things that are very convenient for our employers. Which is why we earn a historically tiny proportion of the value we add. The truly smart recognise it’s not their co-workers taking money away from them.
    - rifung 8y ago
      > Which is why we earn a historically tiny proportion of the value we add. In capitalism the amount you get paid is dependent on supply and demand. The "value" you add is irrelevant if they could easily replace you with someone else.
      - zepto 8y ago
        I.e. workers are commodities traded by capitalists.
      - moomin 8y ago
        Which is why you need to take control of the supply side of the equation and unionise.
  - gamblor956 8y ago
    Funny thing is that in Hollywood, the best actors, writers, and directors, tend to be the most pro-union. Because before they were on the A-list, when they were no-names struggling to get by, it was the union rules that made it possible for them to eke out a living while they waited and worked for their big break, and it was the union rules that protected them from being exploited when they finally got their big break.
    - nradov 8y ago
      The Screen Actors Guild never did anything to protect their members from exploitation by Harvey Weinstein and others like him.
  - egypturnash 8y ago
    That sure is a nice line of propaganda the bosses fed you, isn’t it? Only a loser would join a union, and you aren’t a loser!
  - sj3k 8y ago
    >Most of us believe the world being this meritocracy I feel like I notice this more in my dev friends than my non dev friends. I wonder why?
    - aczerepinski 8y ago
      Because programmers are so in demand that for the most part, anybody skilled at it can get a job in the industry. If you haven't worked in other industries it might be easy to think that the whole world works like that.
- ForHackernews 8y ago
  Are there any politically powerful labor groups in America anymore? The Democrats pay lip service to unions, but tend to ignore their priorities when making policy.
  - Animats 8y ago
    There's still the AFL-CIO.[1] There was a time when the president of the AFL-CIO was one of the most powerful people in the US. No longer. [1] https://aflcio.org/ https://aflcio.org/
- rifung 8y ago
  > I agree with this point. Earlier today I made a similar comment regarding the lack of political strength among software developers, for such a well paid (relative to most Americans) trade, it's hard to name a powerful special interest group for developers. Please excuse my ignorance, but I was always under the impression that special interest groups are more likely to form for those whose conditions are pretty poor. I feel like programmers are treated pretty well compared to most other professions, especially when considering the lack of money and time required to enter the field so I'm not even sure what I'd want from a special interest group.
  - 40acres 8y ago
    There are definitely powerful SIGs that operate on behalf of more traditionally marginalized groups, the NAACP stands out. But a look at some other SIGs highlights that those in powerful positions often exert their political influence through SIGs. The ACLU, NRA, AARP and US Chamber of Commerce (surprise! it's not actually a part of the government) are notable examples.
    - jessaustin 8y ago
      I'm not sure why you're throwing ACLU in there, but others like American Medical Association, MPAA, etc. could be added.

I agree with this point. Earlier today I made a similar comment regarding the lack of political strength among software developers, for such a well paid (relative to most Americans) trade, it's hard to name a powerful special interest group for developers. There are lots of theories regarding personality types that lead to speculation of why this is the case, but I'd really like to see some research that digs into this. Labor by developers is becoming more and more valuable, with this you expect more political strength.. but it does not seem to be happening.

mywittyname 8y ago
Most of us believe the world being this meritocracy and we all get what we deserve and work for. And think the only people who would band together are the weak ones that can't compete on merit. People may not agree, but every argument I've heard against unionization contains this sentiment. Even if it isn't expressed so boldly.
- moomin 8y ago
  Yep, plenty of us believe things that are very convenient for our employers. Which is why we earn a historically tiny proportion of the value we add. The truly smart recognise it’s not their co-workers taking money away from them.
  - rifung 8y ago
    > Which is why we earn a historically tiny proportion of the value we add. In capitalism the amount you get paid is dependent on supply and demand. The "value" you add is irrelevant if they could easily replace you with someone else.
    - zepto 8y ago
      I.e. workers are commodities traded by capitalists.
    - moomin 8y ago
      Which is why you need to take control of the supply side of the equation and unionise.
- gamblor956 8y ago
  Funny thing is that in Hollywood, the best actors, writers, and directors, tend to be the most pro-union. Because before they were on the A-list, when they were no-names struggling to get by, it was the union rules that made it possible for them to eke out a living while they waited and worked for their big break, and it was the union rules that protected them from being exploited when they finally got their big break.
  - nradov 8y ago
    The Screen Actors Guild never did anything to protect their members from exploitation by Harvey Weinstein and others like him.
- egypturnash 8y ago
  That sure is a nice line of propaganda the bosses fed you, isn’t it? Only a loser would join a union, and you aren’t a loser!
- sj3k 8y ago
  >Most of us believe the world being this meritocracy I feel like I notice this more in my dev friends than my non dev friends. I wonder why?
  - aczerepinski 8y ago
    Because programmers are so in demand that for the most part, anybody skilled at it can get a job in the industry. If you haven't worked in other industries it might be easy to think that the whole world works like that.
ForHackernews 8y ago
Are there any politically powerful labor groups in America anymore? The Democrats pay lip service to unions, but tend to ignore their priorities when making policy.
- Animats 8y ago
  There's still the AFL-CIO.[1] There was a time when the president of the AFL-CIO was one of the most powerful people in the US. No longer. [1] https://aflcio.org/ https://aflcio.org/
rifung 8y ago
> I agree with this point. Earlier today I made a similar comment regarding the lack of political strength among software developers, for such a well paid (relative to most Americans) trade, it's hard to name a powerful special interest group for developers. Please excuse my ignorance, but I was always under the impression that special interest groups are more likely to form for those whose conditions are pretty poor. I feel like programmers are treated pretty well compared to most other professions, especially when considering the lack of money and time required to enter the field so I'm not even sure what I'd want from a special interest group.
- 40acres 8y ago
  There are definitely powerful SIGs that operate on behalf of more traditionally marginalized groups, the NAACP stands out. But a look at some other SIGs highlights that those in powerful positions often exert their political influence through SIGs. The ACLU, NRA, AARP and US Chamber of Commerce (surprise! it's not actually a part of the government) are notable examples.
  - jessaustin 8y ago
    I'm not sure why you're throwing ACLU in there, but others like American Medical Association, MPAA, etc. could be added.