4 ms·

I wonder, do you go to an art gallery and complain that paintings don't adhere to the Material design? This is a work of art. It's supposed to be playful and co

by avian 8y ago

I wonder, do you go to an art gallery and complain that paintings don't adhere to the Material design? This is a work of art. It's supposed to be playful and colorful and a bit crude. The message would be quite different if it would be written in a dark-grey Helvetica on light-gray background, don't you think?

zapzupnz 8y ago
> The message would be quite different if it would be written in a dark-grey Helvetica on light-grey background, don’t you think? Yes, it would be quite different. It’s be readable, to start with. Also, GP was complaining about the font — which is very decidedly /not/ made for legibility. You’ve added colours to the hypothetical, slightly changing the argument. Also, what’s with the crack about Material design? That has nothing to do with anything, least of all the well-studied and thoroughly understood principles of text legibility. No, people don’t go into art galleries and complain about them not adhering to user interface design principles because that’s absurd and irrelevant. This is text intended for people to read, not a drawing. Your argument is a weird straw man one.
- avian 8y ago
  The point I was trying to make was that the parent comment completely missed the point. Is the hand-written text really intended for people to read? Why is there a voice-over then? Or a link to a plain-ASCII version of the content in the bottom? It should be obvious that the form was a deliberate choice on part of the author, not some kind of web design incompetence. If nothing else, the color shifting backgrounds, blinking dots and animated swirls should give it away. You don't need to like it, but commenting on the font choice is just as silly as judging paintings by human-interface guidelines. Speaking more generally, I was just being annoyed with this type of comments. See any post that links to a website that doesn't adhere to whatever the latest web design fad is and there is a good chance that a large part of the discussion will be about how the font or colors make people's eyes bleed. As much as HN is able to foster intelligent discussion, this aspect of it is pretty annoying.
  - falcolas 8y ago
    Font, color, and size choices don’t just impact the meaning and the tone of the text, they can cause the text to become unreadable at worst, and painful in many cases (eye strain). I was lucky to have an 11” display that I was reading this on - I could enlarge the text to a point where it was readily legible. It was a good text, but the experience wasn’t enhanced by the fonts used. If I had a phone, I would not have been able to read it, even with reading glasses. The voice version of it was so slow and monotone I gave up on it after realizing the body of the text would be spoken in the same cadence. TL;DR: Your stylistic choices can limit who can even view your text.
    - icebraining 8y ago
      > Your stylistic choices can limit who can even view your text. And sometimes that's okay.
      - falcolas 8y ago
        Honest question - what author would knowingly limit the scope of their readers not only to those interested in the topics they're writing about, but those who can read moderately legible handwriting on a busy background? From getting their point across, building an audience, and making a living, it makes no practical sense. Even the OP came out with transcripts and improved accessibility in the long run - but you have to dig in the HN threads for those. How many potential valuable followers and opinions were lost in that time?
        CptFribble 8y ago
        > making a living > valuable followers Gaining followers and financial success is usually a sideshow to the artist's message. Compromising your message for more money is like the actual definition of selling out.
        falcolas 8y ago
        > Gaining followers and financial success is usually a sideshow to the artist's message. There's a subreddit devoted to the rather painful ridicule of this (unfortunately common) belief. It's /r/ChoosingBeggers and it has lots of tales of people who try and exploit artists for "the exposure" and accuse them of "selling out" when they demand payment for their work. I know of no professional-grade artists who are happy to give away all their art. Even face painters at fairs charge for their moderately simplistic work.
- Buge 8y ago
  The text is about exploring the boundaries of various different media (playing videogames, pencil drawing, programming). The form that the page takes is exploring the boundaries of how blogging and web design can be done. It seems to me the form was specifically designed to illustrate the idea of the text. One particular part I found interesting was the Zelda map with one part highlighted and one corresponding caption word highlighted, and the colors hue shifting together.
fabricexpert 8y ago
you might complain if you turned up an art gallery and couldn't see the art because the lights were off or the building was locked there's a reason paintings are framed and that same reason is why helvetica exists. UX.
darkerside 8y ago
It was a nice effect to start, but it sure got tiring. I think OP's criticism is valid. Where was the progression of the art medium to mirror the development of the narrator's character through the ages? It's a stretch to call this art when it doesn't cohere to the content at all.

by avian 8y ago

zapzupnz 8y ago

> The message would be quite different if it would be written in a dark-grey Helvetica on light-grey background, don’t you think? Yes, it would be quite different. It’s be readable, to start with. Also, GP was complaining about the font — which is very decidedly /not/ made for legibility. You’ve added colours to the hypothetical, slightly changing the argument. Also, what’s with the crack about Material design? That has nothing to do with anything, least of all the well-studied and thoroughly understood principles of text legibility. No, people don’t go into art galleries and complain about them not adhering to user interface design principles because that’s absurd and irrelevant. This is text intended for people to read, not a drawing. Your argument is a weird straw man one.

avian 8y ago
The point I was trying to make was that the parent comment completely missed the point. Is the hand-written text really intended for people to read? Why is there a voice-over then? Or a link to a plain-ASCII version of the content in the bottom? It should be obvious that the form was a deliberate choice on part of the author, not some kind of web design incompetence. If nothing else, the color shifting backgrounds, blinking dots and animated swirls should give it away. You don't need to like it, but commenting on the font choice is just as silly as judging paintings by human-interface guidelines. Speaking more generally, I was just being annoyed with this type of comments. See any post that links to a website that doesn't adhere to whatever the latest web design fad is and there is a good chance that a large part of the discussion will be about how the font or colors make people's eyes bleed. As much as HN is able to foster intelligent discussion, this aspect of it is pretty annoying.
- falcolas 8y ago
  Font, color, and size choices don’t just impact the meaning and the tone of the text, they can cause the text to become unreadable at worst, and painful in many cases (eye strain). I was lucky to have an 11” display that I was reading this on - I could enlarge the text to a point where it was readily legible. It was a good text, but the experience wasn’t enhanced by the fonts used. If I had a phone, I would not have been able to read it, even with reading glasses. The voice version of it was so slow and monotone I gave up on it after realizing the body of the text would be spoken in the same cadence. TL;DR: Your stylistic choices can limit who can even view your text.
  - icebraining 8y ago
    > Your stylistic choices can limit who can even view your text. And sometimes that's okay.
    - falcolas 8y ago
      Honest question - what author would knowingly limit the scope of their readers not only to those interested in the topics they're writing about, but those who can read moderately legible handwriting on a busy background? From getting their point across, building an audience, and making a living, it makes no practical sense. Even the OP came out with transcripts and improved accessibility in the long run - but you have to dig in the HN threads for those. How many potential valuable followers and opinions were lost in that time?
      - CptFribble 8y ago
        > making a living > valuable followers Gaining followers and financial success is usually a sideshow to the artist's message. Compromising your message for more money is like the actual definition of selling out.
        falcolas 8y ago
        > Gaining followers and financial success is usually a sideshow to the artist's message. There's a subreddit devoted to the rather painful ridicule of this (unfortunately common) belief. It's /r/ChoosingBeggers and it has lots of tales of people who try and exploit artists for "the exposure" and accuse them of "selling out" when they demand payment for their work. I know of no professional-grade artists who are happy to give away all their art. Even face painters at fairs charge for their moderately simplistic work.
Buge 8y ago
The text is about exploring the boundaries of various different media (playing videogames, pencil drawing, programming). The form that the page takes is exploring the boundaries of how blogging and web design can be done. It seems to me the form was specifically designed to illustrate the idea of the text. One particular part I found interesting was the Zelda map with one part highlighted and one corresponding caption word highlighted, and the colors hue shifting together.

fabricexpert 8y ago

you might complain if you turned up an art gallery and couldn't see the art because the lights were off or the building was locked there's a reason paintings are framed and that same reason is why helvetica exists. UX.

darkerside 8y ago

It was a nice effect to start, but it sure got tiring. I think OP's criticism is valid. Where was the progression of the art medium to mirror the development of the narrator's character through the ages? It's a stretch to call this art when it doesn't cohere to the content at all.