4 ms·

The more intelligent approach to building roads is one i've seen in Washington DC. While the metro system isnt perfect, they allocated a portion of the highway

The more intelligent approach to building roads is one i've seen in Washington DC. While the metro system isnt perfect, they allocated a portion of the highway to rail (middle track between both directions on the highway.) This way, the community expanded outwards via longer and longer highways and there was an obvious way to eventually simultaneously also expand the metro system outwards. They did this with the Orange Line westwards inbetween Route 66. They then did this with the Silver Line North-westwards in-between Route the Dulles tollway. I imagine the increased traffic due to increased highway capacity is partly because exurbs dont have mass transit support back to the center city...yet people reach further outwards to exurbs seeking more affordable housing. The Washington DC approach solves parts of that problem quite well.

jandrese 8y ago
The problem with this is the last mile problem. Cars are their own solution to the last mile problem and highway placement reflects that. Trying to fit a light rail system on the same footprint immediately runs into the question of how you're going to solve the last mile problem. If you don't, you'll have underutilized train stations sitting in the middle of a road nowhere near where people want to be.
barney54 8y ago
DC has increasing traffic congestion, but decreasing Metro ridership. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/local/trafficandcommuting/metro-says-it-doesnt-know-what-to-do-about-its-falling-ridership-an-internal-report-lays-out-exactly-what-to-do/2018/10/03/d8771d2e-c721-11e8-b2b5-79270f9cce17_story.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/...
- jandrese 8y ago
  These statistics are no doubt skewed by the Metro's deferred maintenance roosters coming home to roost and forcing the system to degrade service to accommodate repairs. It remains to be seen if the ridership numbers bounce back now that we are nearing the end of the extended closures.
reaperducer 8y ago
This was the plan in Houston, too — allocate the center median for future rail. But later politicians and voters decided that it was faster and cheaper to just pave over the planned railroad rights-of-way. When HOV lanes were first built in Houston, they were designed to eventually be converted to light rail. I bet it never happens.
tafda 8y ago
Transit works better if it is where people are going rather than where it is convenient to build - for example, downtown Falls Church VA instead of the freeway median. Building densely around the stations can drive ridership. See: Tokyo, Hong Kong, Singapore. Of course, building in more congested areas is more expensive. Freeway median transit is no panacea (though better than nothing).
- TuringNYC 8y ago
  Well the idea is that the major highways are a good indicator of where people are going. If you build a major high way, and then widen it, chances are good its where people want to travel along. With respect to getting to downtown Falls Church VA, that is more a last mile problem. One I dont want to dismiss, but not something a commuter rail can solve. The commuter rail does pretty well at getting people to several major job districts (DC, Tyson's Corner) Building commuter rail along highway medians solves a different problem -- the NYC problem where a city fiddles around for 40yrs figuring out where to dig a tunnel and eminent domain problems.
  - marcosdumay 8y ago
    Large roads are a good indicator of places everybody goes through. People rarely want to go there. Some are built so traffic is moved from where people actually want to go into some place that is not too far (by car) but will not disturb the destination; others are built at the end of a set of smaller roads, linking to a different set at the other end.

jandrese 8y ago

The problem with this is the last mile problem. Cars are their own solution to the last mile problem and highway placement reflects that. Trying to fit a light rail system on the same footprint immediately runs into the question of how you're going to solve the last mile problem. If you don't, you'll have underutilized train stations sitting in the middle of a road nowhere near where people want to be.

barney54 8y ago

DC has increasing traffic congestion, but decreasing Metro ridership. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/local/trafficandcommuting/metro-says-it-doesnt-know-what-to-do-about-its-falling-ridership-an-internal-report-lays-out-exactly-what-to-do/2018/10/03/d8771d2e-c721-11e8-b2b5-79270f9cce17_story.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/...

jandrese 8y ago
These statistics are no doubt skewed by the Metro's deferred maintenance roosters coming home to roost and forcing the system to degrade service to accommodate repairs. It remains to be seen if the ridership numbers bounce back now that we are nearing the end of the extended closures.

reaperducer 8y ago

This was the plan in Houston, too — allocate the center median for future rail. But later politicians and voters decided that it was faster and cheaper to just pave over the planned railroad rights-of-way. When HOV lanes were first built in Houston, they were designed to eventually be converted to light rail. I bet it never happens.

tafda 8y ago

Transit works better if it is where people are going rather than where it is convenient to build - for example, downtown Falls Church VA instead of the freeway median. Building densely around the stations can drive ridership. See: Tokyo, Hong Kong, Singapore. Of course, building in more congested areas is more expensive. Freeway median transit is no panacea (though better than nothing).

TuringNYC 8y ago
Well the idea is that the major highways are a good indicator of where people are going. If you build a major high way, and then widen it, chances are good its where people want to travel along. With respect to getting to downtown Falls Church VA, that is more a last mile problem. One I dont want to dismiss, but not something a commuter rail can solve. The commuter rail does pretty well at getting people to several major job districts (DC, Tyson's Corner) Building commuter rail along highway medians solves a different problem -- the NYC problem where a city fiddles around for 40yrs figuring out where to dig a tunnel and eminent domain problems.
- marcosdumay 8y ago
  Large roads are a good indicator of places everybody goes through. People rarely want to go there. Some are built so traffic is moved from where people actually want to go into some place that is not too far (by car) but will not disturb the destination; others are built at the end of a set of smaller roads, linking to a different set at the other end.