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This is exactly why Silicon Valley engineers, and engineers generally, need to stop being so dismissive of people with "useless" liberal arts educations, and in

This is exactly why Silicon Valley engineers, and engineers generally, need to stop being so dismissive of people with "useless" liberal arts educations, and instead bring in sociologists and anthropologists to think through these processes in a comprehensive way. I'm being downvoted into oblivion elsewhere on this site for suggesting this, but I feel like it's a very obvious move for tech companies that have this problem.

jmspring 8y ago
I have no problem with anthropologists and those in the liberal arts employed when there are skills they have that help a company. Bubble-1, many humanities students were hired around working with content. That wasn't a bad thing. As I said in another post, companies also actually used to hire people outside the tech bubble to deal with things like categorization of websites, etc. That went away once they could achieve a certain percentage with cheap labor.
- sunsetMurk 8y ago
  ..and now with ML/etc.!
nradov 8y ago
Classical liberal arts educations are tremendously valuable in teaching people how to think critically. However when we're dealing with complex emergent systems no one is capable of reliably predicting problems regardless of how much education in sociology and anthropology they have. Active monitoring and fast responses are the only viable approach.
- sunsetMurk 8y ago
  but what about seriously brainstorming some hypothetical scenarios as part of the process? For example, documenting some sort of 'ideal' or 'pro/con' type lists of potential fallout. When architecting a system.. or in design/feature proposals. Surely folks less in the weeds of technical requirements and actual implementation could help decide earlier on if something is 'good'.
  - nradov 8y ago
    Brainstorming hypothetical scenarios usually results in endless discussions about imaginary problems that never come to pass, and completely missing the real problems. This tends to happen regardless of who participates.
    - sunsetMurk 8y ago
      agreed. ...I guess why not have people who're better at it or who'd rather spend time on it, do it? Would probably miss most of the real problems, but could catch a few and help steer complex issues. I guess I'm thinking about it as applying the type of mission that OpenAI has[1] on a wider/smaller scale. 1- https://openai.com/about/#mission https://openai.com/about/#mission
      - nradov 8y ago
        The OpenAI people mean well but their their concerns over safety seem a bit silly considering they haven't actually demonstrated any progress toward building a true AGI. At this stage it's the equivalent of worrying about the problems that would be caused by an alien invasion: an interesting intellectual exercise but useless in practical terms.
username90 8y ago
Governments are typically packed with liberal arts majors but that never stopped them from doing stupid shit.
gaius 8y ago
with "useless" liberal arts educations Ironically it’s these graduates with the strongest opinions on what people should and shouldn’t be allowed to say. It’s not mechanical engineering grads freaking out on Twitter over cultural appropriation, tone policing, etc. They are the last people you would want to entrust with this power.
Joeboy 8y ago
But the actual relationship between nerds and liberal arts people is more like https://www.xkcd.com/743/ https://www.xkcd.com/743/ . I can see how the argument you're making would play well in some communities, but HN is not the right audience.

jmspring 8y ago

I have no problem with anthropologists and those in the liberal arts employed when there are skills they have that help a company. Bubble-1, many humanities students were hired around working with content. That wasn't a bad thing. As I said in another post, companies also actually used to hire people outside the tech bubble to deal with things like categorization of websites, etc. That went away once they could achieve a certain percentage with cheap labor.

sunsetMurk 8y ago
..and now with ML/etc.!

nradov 8y ago

Classical liberal arts educations are tremendously valuable in teaching people how to think critically. However when we're dealing with complex emergent systems no one is capable of reliably predicting problems regardless of how much education in sociology and anthropology they have. Active monitoring and fast responses are the only viable approach.

sunsetMurk 8y ago
but what about seriously brainstorming some hypothetical scenarios as part of the process? For example, documenting some sort of 'ideal' or 'pro/con' type lists of potential fallout. When architecting a system.. or in design/feature proposals. Surely folks less in the weeds of technical requirements and actual implementation could help decide earlier on if something is 'good'.
- nradov 8y ago
  Brainstorming hypothetical scenarios usually results in endless discussions about imaginary problems that never come to pass, and completely missing the real problems. This tends to happen regardless of who participates.
  - sunsetMurk 8y ago
    agreed. ...I guess why not have people who're better at it or who'd rather spend time on it, do it? Would probably miss most of the real problems, but could catch a few and help steer complex issues. I guess I'm thinking about it as applying the type of mission that OpenAI has[1] on a wider/smaller scale. 1- https://openai.com/about/#mission https://openai.com/about/#mission
    - nradov 8y ago
      The OpenAI people mean well but their their concerns over safety seem a bit silly considering they haven't actually demonstrated any progress toward building a true AGI. At this stage it's the equivalent of worrying about the problems that would be caused by an alien invasion: an interesting intellectual exercise but useless in practical terms.

username90 8y ago

Governments are typically packed with liberal arts majors but that never stopped them from doing stupid shit.

gaius 8y ago

with "useless" liberal arts educations Ironically it’s these graduates with the strongest opinions on what people should and shouldn’t be allowed to say. It’s not mechanical engineering grads freaking out on Twitter over cultural appropriation, tone policing, etc. They are the last people you would want to entrust with this power.

Joeboy 8y ago

But the actual relationship between nerds and liberal arts people is more like https://www.xkcd.com/743/ https://www.xkcd.com/743/ . I can see how the argument you're making would play well in some communities, but HN is not the right audience.