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Airplanes have autopilot and no one thinks that means there’s no pilot in front. Sure some drivers test the limit of their Tesla, just like some drivers test th

Airplanes have autopilot and no one thinks that means there’s no pilot in front. Sure some drivers test the limit of their Tesla, just like some drivers test the limit of their Porsche or Ferrari.

tacomonstrous 8y ago
This is a silly semantic argument. Many people drive cars; very few fly aircraft. The meaning of a word in the second context has little to do with the first.
- paulddraper 8y ago
  Please elaborate. In what more common context does autopilot imply no standby human operator?
  - simion314 8y ago
    It does not mean it must exists for people to know what it means, if I say "teleportation transport" you know what it means without having to seen one working before. Why you don't ask some people what an autopilot capable car should be able to do, then ask what a lane assist capable car should do, then see if the answers match.
    - paulddraper 8y ago
      I didn't say it had to exist. I asked "in what context". If I understand you right, the answer is "in the theoretical context"?
      - simion314 8y ago
        Say in movies,books, pop culture context autopilot means something that drives itself.
  - detaro 8y ago
    Standby, yes. Tesla's Autopilot appears to not be able to guarantee that sub-second reactions to random situations aren't necessary, at which point it's IMHO not "standby" anymore. An airliner's autopilot can do this for phases of the flight, backed up by ATC, collision warning systems, height over ground and the relative emptiness of the sky. In other situations, it needs close supervision too, but the first case probably leads the general public to associate the term with "standby".
    - paulddraper 8y ago
      In that case, the analogy to airplane autopilot is indeed inappropriate. Airpline autopilot can have a standby human operator, with more than a second transition time.
- Barrin92 8y ago
  I don't understand why you're downvoted. The reason we leave the plane nomenclature to the pilots is that we know that pilots are trained professionals and understand what 'autopilot' implies and what its technical limits are. Unless we expect the same rigor of people operating a vehicle, advertising matters. There aren't exactly a lot of pilots who will take the hand of the wheel and read a comic because they mistake the capabilities of the plane
ummonk 8y ago
No one thinks the pilot has to be ready to take over at a moment's notice and be constantly paying careful attention to what is happening in front of the plane though.
- smileysteve 8y ago
  Except for maybe pilots, anybody who has trained to be a pilot, or family or friends of pilots? The nicer thing in the air is that, if autopilot fails, you're typically thousands of feet up. Nobody's mentioning that autopilot in airplanes does nothing for collision avoidance. GCAS is collision avoidance and had its issues, but is considered well past autopilot.
  - YeGoblynQueenne 8y ago
    >> The nicer thing in the air is that, if autopilot fails, you're typically thousands of feet up. I'm not sure "nicer" is really the right word, here. I get what you're saying- there's time to react. But, that is time to react before you hit the ground. Not quite "nice".
- nradov 8y ago
  Everyone who knows anything about aviation thinks the pilot has to be ready to take over at a moment's notice and be constantly paying careful attention to what is happening in front of the plane. Autopilots merely lower the pilot workload. Even with the autopilot engaged, the pilot is still actively flying the aircraft.
ryandrake 8y ago
I think a lot of the general public thinks an airplane’s autopilot causes the airplane to do a lot more than it actually does. The name is not helping.
simion314 8y ago
Some scientists did some "Teleportation" experiements with photons, this does not mean that when people think abut what teleportation means they think about photons instead of teleporting people like in Star Trek, Similar autopilot for cars does not make people think about a card that drives itself but the driver must also be 100% concentrated on the road, the name implies something different and Tesla marketing knows that , the fans will try now to defend this bad choice with some bad examples from aviation, you need to go and ask people on the street what a car with an autopilot should be capable of.
- leetcrew 8y ago
  I really don't want to live in a world where my moral character is judged by whether some random people on the street think of the right thing when they hear the name of my technical feature. there is an inherent tradeoff between accessibility and precision in language. can we err a little bit on the side of precision in a technical field?
  - ceejayoz 8y ago
    You can call it whatever technically-correct term you want in the code, the FCC documentation, technical conferences, etc. When you're marketing it to the public, it's best to worry a little about how terms will be interpreted by laypeople, especially if said laypeople's lives are in the balance.
21 8y ago
In airplanes the pilot is never watching a movie on the phone while the autopilot is engaged.
raverbashing 8y ago
Autopilots have a very specific and determined role in aviation. Pilots are also trained extensively on its capabilities and limits (and all other 'auto-' systems on airplanes).
michaelt 8y ago
Aircraft autopilot: 1. Maintains a planned course without responding to obstacles. 2. Allows the pilots to safely take their hands off the controls and focus their attention elsewhere, such as on the radio. Tesla autopilot is similar in property (1), but different in property (2) because aircraft are 'protected' by the Big Sky Theory.
- ddalex 8y ago
  Aircraft autopilot can automatically avoid collisions based on TCAS data, for recent airplanes (https://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-releases/en/2009/08/easa-certifies-new-autopilot-flight-director-tcas-mode-for-a380.html https://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-releases/en/2009/08/ea...)
  - Piskvorrr 8y ago
    Sure. That is, however, an emergency system, and you are already in deep trouble if it triggers.
bibinou 8y ago
Autopilot was a major factor in Air France's deadliest crash: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_447 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_447
ceejayoz 8y ago
> Airplanes have autopilot and no one thinks that means there’s no pilot in front. If we're going to make that comparison, then we should also factor in the fact that you're not going to be allowed to use an aircraft autopilot without first being trained on its operation, limitations, etc.
ubernostrum 8y ago
Airlines have also had to do special training courses to teach pilots not to get over-reliant on automation. Tesla's "autopilot" seems to fall in that category of being just enough automation that it gets people complacent, but not enough to actually let them safely be complacent.
EpicEng 8y ago
That argument holds water the day Joe schmoe driver undergoes hundreds of hours of advanced training.

Airplanes have autopilot and no one thinks that means there’s no pilot in front. Sure some drivers test the limit of their Tesla, just like some drivers test the limit of their Porsche or Ferrari.

tacomonstrous 8y ago

This is a silly semantic argument. Many people drive cars; very few fly aircraft. The meaning of a word in the second context has little to do with the first.

paulddraper 8y ago
Please elaborate. In what more common context does autopilot imply no standby human operator?
- simion314 8y ago
  It does not mean it must exists for people to know what it means, if I say "teleportation transport" you know what it means without having to seen one working before. Why you don't ask some people what an autopilot capable car should be able to do, then ask what a lane assist capable car should do, then see if the answers match.
  - paulddraper 8y ago
    I didn't say it had to exist. I asked "in what context". If I understand you right, the answer is "in the theoretical context"?
    - simion314 8y ago
      Say in movies,books, pop culture context autopilot means something that drives itself.
- detaro 8y ago
  Standby, yes. Tesla's Autopilot appears to not be able to guarantee that sub-second reactions to random situations aren't necessary, at which point it's IMHO not "standby" anymore. An airliner's autopilot can do this for phases of the flight, backed up by ATC, collision warning systems, height over ground and the relative emptiness of the sky. In other situations, it needs close supervision too, but the first case probably leads the general public to associate the term with "standby".
  - paulddraper 8y ago
    In that case, the analogy to airplane autopilot is indeed inappropriate. Airpline autopilot can have a standby human operator, with more than a second transition time.
Barrin92 8y ago
I don't understand why you're downvoted. The reason we leave the plane nomenclature to the pilots is that we know that pilots are trained professionals and understand what 'autopilot' implies and what its technical limits are. Unless we expect the same rigor of people operating a vehicle, advertising matters. There aren't exactly a lot of pilots who will take the hand of the wheel and read a comic because they mistake the capabilities of the plane

ummonk 8y ago

No one thinks the pilot has to be ready to take over at a moment's notice and be constantly paying careful attention to what is happening in front of the plane though.

smileysteve 8y ago
Except for maybe pilots, anybody who has trained to be a pilot, or family or friends of pilots? The nicer thing in the air is that, if autopilot fails, you're typically thousands of feet up. Nobody's mentioning that autopilot in airplanes does nothing for collision avoidance. GCAS is collision avoidance and had its issues, but is considered well past autopilot.
- YeGoblynQueenne 8y ago
  >> The nicer thing in the air is that, if autopilot fails, you're typically thousands of feet up. I'm not sure "nicer" is really the right word, here. I get what you're saying- there's time to react. But, that is time to react before you hit the ground. Not quite "nice".
nradov 8y ago
Everyone who knows anything about aviation thinks the pilot has to be ready to take over at a moment's notice and be constantly paying careful attention to what is happening in front of the plane. Autopilots merely lower the pilot workload. Even with the autopilot engaged, the pilot is still actively flying the aircraft.

ryandrake 8y ago

I think a lot of the general public thinks an airplane’s autopilot causes the airplane to do a lot more than it actually does. The name is not helping.

simion314 8y ago

Some scientists did some "Teleportation" experiements with photons, this does not mean that when people think abut what teleportation means they think about photons instead of teleporting people like in Star Trek, Similar autopilot for cars does not make people think about a card that drives itself but the driver must also be 100% concentrated on the road, the name implies something different and Tesla marketing knows that , the fans will try now to defend this bad choice with some bad examples from aviation, you need to go and ask people on the street what a car with an autopilot should be capable of.

leetcrew 8y ago
I really don't want to live in a world where my moral character is judged by whether some random people on the street think of the right thing when they hear the name of my technical feature. there is an inherent tradeoff between accessibility and precision in language. can we err a little bit on the side of precision in a technical field?
- ceejayoz 8y ago
  You can call it whatever technically-correct term you want in the code, the FCC documentation, technical conferences, etc. When you're marketing it to the public, it's best to worry a little about how terms will be interpreted by laypeople, especially if said laypeople's lives are in the balance.

21 8y ago

In airplanes the pilot is never watching a movie on the phone while the autopilot is engaged.

raverbashing 8y ago

Autopilots have a very specific and determined role in aviation. Pilots are also trained extensively on its capabilities and limits (and all other 'auto-' systems on airplanes).

michaelt 8y ago

Aircraft autopilot: 1. Maintains a planned course without responding to obstacles. 2. Allows the pilots to safely take their hands off the controls and focus their attention elsewhere, such as on the radio. Tesla autopilot is similar in property (1), but different in property (2) because aircraft are 'protected' by the Big Sky Theory.

ddalex 8y ago
Aircraft autopilot can automatically avoid collisions based on TCAS data, for recent airplanes (https://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-releases/en/2009/08/easa-certifies-new-autopilot-flight-director-tcas-mode-for-a380.html https://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-releases/en/2009/08/ea...)
- Piskvorrr 8y ago
  Sure. That is, however, an emergency system, and you are already in deep trouble if it triggers.

bibinou 8y ago

Autopilot was a major factor in Air France's deadliest crash: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_447 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_447

ceejayoz 8y ago

> Airplanes have autopilot and no one thinks that means there’s no pilot in front. If we're going to make that comparison, then we should also factor in the fact that you're not going to be allowed to use an aircraft autopilot without first being trained on its operation, limitations, etc.

ubernostrum 8y ago

Airlines have also had to do special training courses to teach pilots not to get over-reliant on automation. Tesla's "autopilot" seems to fall in that category of being just enough automation that it gets people complacent, but not enough to actually let them safely be complacent.

EpicEng 8y ago

That argument holds water the day Joe schmoe driver undergoes hundreds of hours of advanced training.