6 ms·

Hmm, I don't disagree with you, but my assessment of Chinese labor situations is that laborers are paid quite low wages and the living/working conditions in pro

Hmm, I don't disagree with you, but my assessment of Chinese labor situations is that laborers are paid quite low wages and the living/working conditions in proximity to the factory are probably worse than if they were just subsistence farmers. I feel similarly, because as an American laborer doing basic customer service in a high cost of living area, my wage is not enough to afford literally any discretionary spending.

Findeton 8y ago
If that was true, they would stay as subsistence farmers. If they are not doing that, they must have their reasons (probably that you're wrong and they're making more money).
- fipar 8y ago
  That assumes they have a choice, which may not be the case.
  - xapata 8y ago
    It's the opposite problem in China. Too many farmers want to be industrial laborers. They have strict control (relative to other countries) preventing farmers from moving to cities. While totalitarian, it makes sense to reduce the speed of urbanization. Switching from agrarian to industrial is very disruptive. You don't want too many unemployed laborers in your cities.
  - zaroth 8y ago
    Mass slavery would be a problem of a different order, and not really relevant to the economic discussion I think?
    - jschwartzi 8y ago
      It's not necessarily slavery. If your hometown used to be a farm town, but a bunch of companies buy up all the farmland and convert it to factories and warehouses, you now no longer have a choice but to work in those factories and warehouses unless you move. And the cost of living increases because there's more competition for the same amount of living space because there's a bunch of engineers and management that are now living in the area where before it was just farm laborers and farmers. You might be getting paid the same as you were when you were farming but it's not stretching as far because everything else is more expensive.
      - xapata 8y ago
        That's not what happened in China, as far as I know.
apatters 8y ago
We are talking about a country where tens of millions of subsistence farmers died in one of history's worst famines, subsistence farming isn't something anyone does if they have other options--one or two bad years can mean starvation. The common scenario in China is that if someone can get a factory job they go do it, and then they send as much money as they can back to their family, so that nobody starves.
xapata 8y ago
Please take this question in the most pleasant, friendly, and honestly curious tone: Since your neighborhood is so expensive, why don't you move to a less expensive neighborhood or even a different city?
- anoncoward111 8y ago
  Not a problem at all :) For me, I am already in the cheapest neighborhood that is reasonably close and liveable to my job. I am not the world's most employable person, so I really have a hard time leaving stable jobs in search of higher paying ones. But mostly, I am in this area for my girlfriend, who needs to be here for her very high paying job that is more niche and non-transferable to other cities I feel. One day our finances will maybe be linked, but for now I am content to just barely break even :)

Findeton 8y ago

If that was true, they would stay as subsistence farmers. If they are not doing that, they must have their reasons (probably that you're wrong and they're making more money).

fipar 8y ago
That assumes they have a choice, which may not be the case.
- xapata 8y ago
  It's the opposite problem in China. Too many farmers want to be industrial laborers. They have strict control (relative to other countries) preventing farmers from moving to cities. While totalitarian, it makes sense to reduce the speed of urbanization. Switching from agrarian to industrial is very disruptive. You don't want too many unemployed laborers in your cities.
- zaroth 8y ago
  Mass slavery would be a problem of a different order, and not really relevant to the economic discussion I think?
  - jschwartzi 8y ago
    It's not necessarily slavery. If your hometown used to be a farm town, but a bunch of companies buy up all the farmland and convert it to factories and warehouses, you now no longer have a choice but to work in those factories and warehouses unless you move. And the cost of living increases because there's more competition for the same amount of living space because there's a bunch of engineers and management that are now living in the area where before it was just farm laborers and farmers. You might be getting paid the same as you were when you were farming but it's not stretching as far because everything else is more expensive.
    - xapata 8y ago
      That's not what happened in China, as far as I know.

apatters 8y ago

We are talking about a country where tens of millions of subsistence farmers died in one of history's worst famines, subsistence farming isn't something anyone does if they have other options--one or two bad years can mean starvation. The common scenario in China is that if someone can get a factory job they go do it, and then they send as much money as they can back to their family, so that nobody starves.

xapata 8y ago

Please take this question in the most pleasant, friendly, and honestly curious tone: Since your neighborhood is so expensive, why don't you move to a less expensive neighborhood or even a different city?

anoncoward111 8y ago
Not a problem at all :) For me, I am already in the cheapest neighborhood that is reasonably close and liveable to my job. I am not the world's most employable person, so I really have a hard time leaving stable jobs in search of higher paying ones. But mostly, I am in this area for my girlfriend, who needs to be here for her very high paying job that is more niche and non-transferable to other cities I feel. One day our finances will maybe be linked, but for now I am content to just barely break even :)