4 ms·

I support it too. Big corporations pay almost no taxes in our country; instead it is individual and small and medium entreprises that are heavily taxed. This ma

I support it too. Big corporations pay almost no taxes in our country; instead it is individual and small and medium entreprises that are heavily taxed. This makes it very hard to start and run a business in the long term.

bluecalm 8y ago
They pay VAT for sells in your country. It doesn't matter if it's consumer or a company paying the tax, the amount is added to the price. If you want them tax then increase that. Why do you feel entitled to profits of the company that isn't based in your country? It's like thinking the company should pay 5m in tax in Ireland based on sells in France while being ok with them deducting expenses from unrelated business in Ireland which you shouldn't care at all. If they paid that rate you should be happy even not even one dollar more made it to your country. The whole idea doesn't make any sense at all. You want companies to pay more in your country? Tax exactly that - consumption of their goods in your country. It's not your business to decide how other countries choose to organize their tax code. Seriously fuck you for trying to force them. Ideas like that make EU much less popular idea that it was in the past.
- J_cst 8y ago
  AFAIK Vat is a tax which insist on consumers, not on companies.
  - njarboe 8y ago
    So an oil company that buys steel pipe to make an oil well doesn't pay VAT on the pipe? Not a European, so just asking.
    - lultimouomo 8y ago
      Either it pays the VAT and gets an equal tax credit, or it doesn't pay it at all (when applying reverse charge). Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises. Obviously the fact that end consumers pay VAT might disincentivise them to buy stuff, so companies still suffer the effects of high VAT rates.
      - woodpanel 8y ago
        > Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises. That's just partly true. Depending on the taxing agreements between two countries involved you can apply reverse charge, yes. But within one company's country, the VAT is not something that you can "just refund" from the government. Instead you can set off the VAT you've paid against the VAT your customers paid. In other words: The only way for you pay zero VAT is if your earnings (income minus expenditures) are zero too (something that despite the tax-evasion clichés is something that companies usually try to avoid).
        unilynx 8y ago
        That's not how VAT works. As a simple example for a EU company: - buy something nationally (you pay VAT to the company) - export it to another EU company (reverse charge, so no VAT received or paid) - get the VAT refunded from your local tax agency. Even nationally, you get VAT refunded if you've paid more to others than you've collected. At least for NL, but I'm pretty sure these rules should be the same in all EU countries.
        lultimouomo 8y ago
        This. There are exceptions (e.g. in Italy you only get refunded for 50% of the VAT you pay when buying phones, or 40% the VAT you pay when buying cars), but they are pretty much that, exceptions. If operating domestically you will usually get more VAT money from customers than you will give to suppliers, so you will pay the difference to the state. If for any reason you pay more to suppliers than you get from customers, the difference becomes a tax credit that you can carry to the following accounting period or deduce from some other tax.
        mamon 8y ago
        >> If for any reason you pay more to suppliers than you get from customers, the difference becomes a tax credit that you can carry to the following accounting period or deduce from some other tax. In Poland it is even possible to get that difference in cash - Tax office wire transfers it to your bank account. This gave birth to a countless scams, where the shell companies forge invoices, ask for VAT tax refund and then disappear with the money.
  - bluecalm 8y ago
    Usually companies collect it and pay it but it really doesn't matter. At the end of the day all the money the corporation has comes from consumers and chunk of it goes to taxes. The question is what you are allowed to deduct and how tax burden is distributed among various companies. Every company will try to sell goods for as much as the customers are willing to pay. The consumer doesn't care if there is VAT, environmental tax or whatever else included. They just look at the final price.
- sofixa 8y ago
  > They pay VAT for sells in your country. It doesn't matter if it's consumer or a company paying the tax, the amount is added to the price. If you want them tax then increase that. VAT is tax for consumers, not corporations. > Why do you feel entitled to profits of the company that isn't based in your country? Because those profits are made from sales in that country, and every physical company selling in that country pays their taxes, just because Internet-based companies can avoid having a physical presence to perform their sales (Amazon still has warehouses), doesn't make them exempt from the same logic.
  - woodpanel 8y ago
    > VAT is tax for consumers, not corporations Sorry, but where does this misconception come from that companies don't pay VAT? It's not true, I see it on my company's tax statement every month ;-)
    - Rexxar 8y ago
      The answer is that company is the tax collector, not the tax payer. IMHO it's mainly a semantic distinction, the result is practically the same.
      - bsaul 8y ago
        it’s absolutely not the same. If the VAT goes up 10%, your benefits after taxes won’t change one bit. VAT is indeed not paid by corporations.
        Rexxar 8y ago
        If price is already fixed in a contract it's not the same, indeed. For new client, it's basically equivalent as the price will adjust. (For example, higher TVA => client pay more => less demand => you have to reduce margin to keep some clients. In this case even if you don't technically pay the tax, you lose money if the tax become higher).
  - obpacheco 8y ago
- arbitrary_name 8y ago
  Wow, you really don't know what you're talking about... Stop reading Ayn Rand, it won't help.

bluecalm 8y ago

They pay VAT for sells in your country. It doesn't matter if it's consumer or a company paying the tax, the amount is added to the price. If you want them tax then increase that. Why do you feel entitled to profits of the company that isn't based in your country? It's like thinking the company should pay 5m in tax in Ireland based on sells in France while being ok with them deducting expenses from unrelated business in Ireland which you shouldn't care at all. If they paid that rate you should be happy even not even one dollar more made it to your country. The whole idea doesn't make any sense at all. You want companies to pay more in your country? Tax exactly that - consumption of their goods in your country. It's not your business to decide how other countries choose to organize their tax code. Seriously fuck you for trying to force them. Ideas like that make EU much less popular idea that it was in the past.

J_cst 8y ago
AFAIK Vat is a tax which insist on consumers, not on companies.
- njarboe 8y ago
  So an oil company that buys steel pipe to make an oil well doesn't pay VAT on the pipe? Not a European, so just asking.
  - lultimouomo 8y ago
    Either it pays the VAT and gets an equal tax credit, or it doesn't pay it at all (when applying reverse charge). Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises. Obviously the fact that end consumers pay VAT might disincentivise them to buy stuff, so companies still suffer the effects of high VAT rates.
    - woodpanel 8y ago
      > Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises. That's just partly true. Depending on the taxing agreements between two countries involved you can apply reverse charge, yes. But within one company's country, the VAT is not something that you can "just refund" from the government. Instead you can set off the VAT you've paid against the VAT your customers paid. In other words: The only way for you pay zero VAT is if your earnings (income minus expenditures) are zero too (something that despite the tax-evasion clichés is something that companies usually try to avoid).
      - unilynx 8y ago
        That's not how VAT works. As a simple example for a EU company: - buy something nationally (you pay VAT to the company) - export it to another EU company (reverse charge, so no VAT received or paid) - get the VAT refunded from your local tax agency. Even nationally, you get VAT refunded if you've paid more to others than you've collected. At least for NL, but I'm pretty sure these rules should be the same in all EU countries.
        lultimouomo 8y ago
        This. There are exceptions (e.g. in Italy you only get refunded for 50% of the VAT you pay when buying phones, or 40% the VAT you pay when buying cars), but they are pretty much that, exceptions. If operating domestically you will usually get more VAT money from customers than you will give to suppliers, so you will pay the difference to the state. If for any reason you pay more to suppliers than you get from customers, the difference becomes a tax credit that you can carry to the following accounting period or deduce from some other tax.
        mamon 8y ago
        >> If for any reason you pay more to suppliers than you get from customers, the difference becomes a tax credit that you can carry to the following accounting period or deduce from some other tax. In Poland it is even possible to get that difference in cash - Tax office wire transfers it to your bank account. This gave birth to a countless scams, where the shell companies forge invoices, ask for VAT tax refund and then disappear with the money.
- bluecalm 8y ago
  Usually companies collect it and pay it but it really doesn't matter. At the end of the day all the money the corporation has comes from consumers and chunk of it goes to taxes. The question is what you are allowed to deduct and how tax burden is distributed among various companies. Every company will try to sell goods for as much as the customers are willing to pay. The consumer doesn't care if there is VAT, environmental tax or whatever else included. They just look at the final price.
sofixa 8y ago
> They pay VAT for sells in your country. It doesn't matter if it's consumer or a company paying the tax, the amount is added to the price. If you want them tax then increase that. VAT is tax for consumers, not corporations. > Why do you feel entitled to profits of the company that isn't based in your country? Because those profits are made from sales in that country, and every physical company selling in that country pays their taxes, just because Internet-based companies can avoid having a physical presence to perform their sales (Amazon still has warehouses), doesn't make them exempt from the same logic.
- woodpanel 8y ago
  > VAT is tax for consumers, not corporations Sorry, but where does this misconception come from that companies don't pay VAT? It's not true, I see it on my company's tax statement every month ;-)
  - Rexxar 8y ago
    The answer is that company is the tax collector, not the tax payer. IMHO it's mainly a semantic distinction, the result is practically the same.
    - bsaul 8y ago
      it’s absolutely not the same. If the VAT goes up 10%, your benefits after taxes won’t change one bit. VAT is indeed not paid by corporations.
      - Rexxar 8y ago
        If price is already fixed in a contract it's not the same, indeed. For new client, it's basically equivalent as the price will adjust. (For example, higher TVA => client pay more => less demand => you have to reduce margin to keep some clients. In this case even if you don't technically pay the tax, you lose money if the tax become higher).
- obpacheco 8y ago
arbitrary_name 8y ago
Wow, you really don't know what you're talking about... Stop reading Ayn Rand, it won't help.