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My mother has a beautiful Steinway grand piano she inherited from her father. Anyone familiar with the size of a grand piano knows they more or less require a m

My mother has a beautiful Steinway grand piano she inherited from her father. Anyone familiar with the size of a grand piano knows they more or less require a mid-sized room to themselves or a good chunk of a large room. They're also not worth that much anymore because the market for used grand's is tiny. So mot of the value is sentimental. We are most likely going to have to get rid of it when she downsizes. My brother and I are unsure where we would ever put it and neither of us play the piano (probably one of my bigger regrets is not learning...). Neither of us want a 4,000SF house especially in New England where 4,000SF probably means older house and lots of maintenance from weather over many years. Similar problem with the antique dining room and the billiard table (though I may try and save that one if I can).

scottlamb 8y ago
> My brother and I are unsure where we would ever put it and neither of us play the piano (probably one of my bigger regrets is not learning...). It's never too late! (But the grand piano still won't be practical even if you learn how to play it.)
jacquesm 8y ago
> They're also not worth that much anymore because the market for used grand's is tiny. To the right buyer that instrument will be worth a small fortune. The reason the market value is not that high is mostly because the few big names gobble up all the instruments they can to reduce the size of the secondary market so they can sell their instruments at the highest price they'll fetch. That's also why there are hardly ever prices on the websites of the various sellers, they would give a hint about what the instruments value is which would make it harder for them to purchase instruments for a small fraction of their true value.
- lostlogin 8y ago
  >The reason the market value is not that high is mostly because the few big names gobble up all the instruments they can to reduce the size of the secondary market so they can sell their instruments at the highest price they'll fetch. Is that really a thing? Seems like a great way to lose money.
  - jjeaff 8y ago
    Not if you are refurbishing them, and then reselling them as "certified used" for a profit. Then you have captured more of the secondary market while still helping to maintain your new prices. It's like how brand names manufacture "competing" store brand products right next to their brand name stuff.
  - jacksproit 8y ago
    It’s high risk and possibly illegal in some cases but people still attempt it https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornering_the_market https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornering_the_market
  - retsibsi 8y ago
    Going back a step, can someone explain the logic? If 'the few big names gobble up all the instruments they can', why doesn't this push the prices up?
    - setr 8y ago
      Dunno about at the start of the endeavor, but if they manage to buy out the whole after-market such that they can build the expectation that no real market exists, then both buyers and sellers will not even attempt to sell/buy at “true” prices, and instead look directly at “certified” and new models only. If I value a car at $5000, but can’t find that price anywhere, then I simply have to accept that its being valued higher by the market. If I want to sell at $5000, but can’t find a buyer, same story. Even if both persons exist simultaneously, if they can’t find each other, then there will be no sale. So by making use of the information disparity, and manipulating the perception of the used market, it should be possible to keep prices artificially high. The same kind of strategy works for diamonds at least, where “used” diamonds are not worthy of usage, so prices are simply set by the businesses; I know the video game market is also trying to get in on it, by gobbling up used games (eg through gamestop), keeping them out of the secondary market early (by encouraging sequels, trade-ins, etc), which then lets them set the prices on them later (particularly useful when you want to sell emulated games on the e-shops)
      - 8y ago
- impendia 8y ago
  I recently purchased a grand piano, and in the process I visited a lot of piano stores and got a very good sense of what is available and for how much. Large piano stores in the US will typically have some vintage Steinways for sale, whether or not they carry new Steinways. Vintage Steinways often sell for roughly $20K. This price may include a lot of prep work by the dealer -- a dealer might replace all the strings, for example. I once visited a shop where the dealer gutted the instruments and more or less rebuilt them from scratch. It's also reasonably common for dealers to have prices on their websites for used pianos. Not new pianos -- typically manufacturer contracts forbid this, and it's a high margin business. I'd estimate that one could probably sell a vintage Steinway, if it's in good condition, to a dealer for in the neighborhood of $10K. One might get more by advertising directly to buyers. However, this is a pain (it typically takes months to sell a piano). Moreover, any knowledgable buyer will hire a technician to inspect the instrument, and this could bring up all sorts of unpleasant surprises -- even if the instrument seems to be in good condition.
some-guy 8y ago
I’m in a very similar situation as you: my wife is inheriting a Steinway baby grand piano that needs internal repair, and needs to be shipped from Tucson to the Bay Area. It has a lot of sentimental value but not much resale value. It may cost up to $10k to ship it and get it repaired into a working state. I live in a 2 bedroom condo in Oakland that cannot possibly fit the thing, nor do either of us play piano anymore. My thought was to repair it and then donate it to a local school auditorium and maybe write off the expenses but I haven’t looked into the details.
- ghaff 8y ago
  FWIW, a friend of a friend wanted to buy a Steinway and donate it to her daughter's prep school so the daughter would have a Steinway to play. (Yes, some people have a lot of money.) The prep school turned her down because they didn't want the cost of maintaining it. Anecdata and perhaps an outlier, but nonetheless.
  - dddddaviddddd 8y ago
    Similarly I've seen some church congregations replace their small pipe organs with electric ones to reduce maintenance costs.
  - Consultant32452 8y ago
    Similar thing with my uncle. He wanted to donate an organ to his church worth $100k+. They couldn't afford the insurance and maintenance on it.
- dd36 8y ago
  I know some Tucsonans that might be interested.
- eigenvector 8y ago
  The best bet would be to try to sell it locally. It may take a long time to find the right buyer, but knowing that the instrument is used and treasured by a musician may appease the sentimental side just as much or even more than keeping it around as a piece of furniture.
eigenvector 8y ago
When I was a child studying piano, my dream was to own a grand piano. My parents could have never afforded such an extravagance, but did own a detached house in Toronto. Now, I could easily afford a high-end piano, but could never dream of affording a house to put it in.
- rwmj 8y ago
  Are grand pianos actually any better than the best electric pianos? I mean if you're not playing in an actual concert hall. I was in an electricals shop in Japan a couple of years ago and a few of the electric pianos there were wonderful (some were also terrible).
  - carlob 8y ago
    I don't think that even vertical pianos come even close to any electric I played. The stringed one keys just feels different and it has a lot more nuance in sound. Maybe I have never played a really high end one, but in the same price range, just no comparison. And no, I'm not some kind of nostalgic: whenever somebody gives me a paper book as a gift I try to find the ereader version because I prefer reading on an ebook.
  - romwell 8y ago
    Yes. You just can't sample your way out of the problem of getting the sound of many strings resonating when you press a key, especially when you hold the right pedal. Electronic pianos are good, and I have one, but they are a different instrument that doesn't do what a cheap cabinet piano can.
    - eigenvector 8y ago
      Yes, that is a good way of putting it. No one would ask whether an electric guitar is 'better' or 'as good' as an acoustic, they are simply different. I enjoy owning an electric piano simply because it lets me practise with headphones in a small apartment, but it does not substitute fully for a mechanical piano.
    - 8y ago
DenisM 8y ago
>probably one of my bigger regrets is not learning. I started taking lessons a year ago, and I play well enough now to fool most strangers into thinking I know how to play. :) My highest achievement is playing half of this piece now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d72mZVxdylA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d72mZVxdylA (it's not me in the video). Just go ahead and learn to play.
amptorn 8y ago
Consider donating it to a school?
mrcsparker 8y ago
Vintage Steinway is my dream piano. Sorry that you have to get rid of it.
jefftk 8y ago
Loft it: https://www.jefftk.com/p/lofted-grand-piano https://www.jefftk.com/p/lofted-grand-piano

scottlamb 8y ago

> My brother and I are unsure where we would ever put it and neither of us play the piano (probably one of my bigger regrets is not learning...). It's never too late! (But the grand piano still won't be practical even if you learn how to play it.)

jacquesm 8y ago

> They're also not worth that much anymore because the market for used grand's is tiny. To the right buyer that instrument will be worth a small fortune. The reason the market value is not that high is mostly because the few big names gobble up all the instruments they can to reduce the size of the secondary market so they can sell their instruments at the highest price they'll fetch. That's also why there are hardly ever prices on the websites of the various sellers, they would give a hint about what the instruments value is which would make it harder for them to purchase instruments for a small fraction of their true value.

lostlogin 8y ago
>The reason the market value is not that high is mostly because the few big names gobble up all the instruments they can to reduce the size of the secondary market so they can sell their instruments at the highest price they'll fetch. Is that really a thing? Seems like a great way to lose money.
- jjeaff 8y ago
  Not if you are refurbishing them, and then reselling them as "certified used" for a profit. Then you have captured more of the secondary market while still helping to maintain your new prices. It's like how brand names manufacture "competing" store brand products right next to their brand name stuff.
- jacksproit 8y ago
  It’s high risk and possibly illegal in some cases but people still attempt it https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornering_the_market https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornering_the_market
- retsibsi 8y ago
  Going back a step, can someone explain the logic? If 'the few big names gobble up all the instruments they can', why doesn't this push the prices up?
  - setr 8y ago
    Dunno about at the start of the endeavor, but if they manage to buy out the whole after-market such that they can build the expectation that no real market exists, then both buyers and sellers will not even attempt to sell/buy at “true” prices, and instead look directly at “certified” and new models only. If I value a car at $5000, but can’t find that price anywhere, then I simply have to accept that its being valued higher by the market. If I want to sell at $5000, but can’t find a buyer, same story. Even if both persons exist simultaneously, if they can’t find each other, then there will be no sale. So by making use of the information disparity, and manipulating the perception of the used market, it should be possible to keep prices artificially high. The same kind of strategy works for diamonds at least, where “used” diamonds are not worthy of usage, so prices are simply set by the businesses; I know the video game market is also trying to get in on it, by gobbling up used games (eg through gamestop), keeping them out of the secondary market early (by encouraging sequels, trade-ins, etc), which then lets them set the prices on them later (particularly useful when you want to sell emulated games on the e-shops)
    - 8y ago
impendia 8y ago
I recently purchased a grand piano, and in the process I visited a lot of piano stores and got a very good sense of what is available and for how much. Large piano stores in the US will typically have some vintage Steinways for sale, whether or not they carry new Steinways. Vintage Steinways often sell for roughly $20K. This price may include a lot of prep work by the dealer -- a dealer might replace all the strings, for example. I once visited a shop where the dealer gutted the instruments and more or less rebuilt them from scratch. It's also reasonably common for dealers to have prices on their websites for used pianos. Not new pianos -- typically manufacturer contracts forbid this, and it's a high margin business. I'd estimate that one could probably sell a vintage Steinway, if it's in good condition, to a dealer for in the neighborhood of $10K. One might get more by advertising directly to buyers. However, this is a pain (it typically takes months to sell a piano). Moreover, any knowledgable buyer will hire a technician to inspect the instrument, and this could bring up all sorts of unpleasant surprises -- even if the instrument seems to be in good condition.

some-guy 8y ago

I’m in a very similar situation as you: my wife is inheriting a Steinway baby grand piano that needs internal repair, and needs to be shipped from Tucson to the Bay Area. It has a lot of sentimental value but not much resale value. It may cost up to $10k to ship it and get it repaired into a working state. I live in a 2 bedroom condo in Oakland that cannot possibly fit the thing, nor do either of us play piano anymore. My thought was to repair it and then donate it to a local school auditorium and maybe write off the expenses but I haven’t looked into the details.

ghaff 8y ago
FWIW, a friend of a friend wanted to buy a Steinway and donate it to her daughter's prep school so the daughter would have a Steinway to play. (Yes, some people have a lot of money.) The prep school turned her down because they didn't want the cost of maintaining it. Anecdata and perhaps an outlier, but nonetheless.
- dddddaviddddd 8y ago
  Similarly I've seen some church congregations replace their small pipe organs with electric ones to reduce maintenance costs.
- Consultant32452 8y ago
  Similar thing with my uncle. He wanted to donate an organ to his church worth $100k+. They couldn't afford the insurance and maintenance on it.
dd36 8y ago
I know some Tucsonans that might be interested.
eigenvector 8y ago
The best bet would be to try to sell it locally. It may take a long time to find the right buyer, but knowing that the instrument is used and treasured by a musician may appease the sentimental side just as much or even more than keeping it around as a piece of furniture.

eigenvector 8y ago

When I was a child studying piano, my dream was to own a grand piano. My parents could have never afforded such an extravagance, but did own a detached house in Toronto. Now, I could easily afford a high-end piano, but could never dream of affording a house to put it in.

rwmj 8y ago
Are grand pianos actually any better than the best electric pianos? I mean if you're not playing in an actual concert hall. I was in an electricals shop in Japan a couple of years ago and a few of the electric pianos there were wonderful (some were also terrible).
- carlob 8y ago
  I don't think that even vertical pianos come even close to any electric I played. The stringed one keys just feels different and it has a lot more nuance in sound. Maybe I have never played a really high end one, but in the same price range, just no comparison. And no, I'm not some kind of nostalgic: whenever somebody gives me a paper book as a gift I try to find the ereader version because I prefer reading on an ebook.
- romwell 8y ago
  Yes. You just can't sample your way out of the problem of getting the sound of many strings resonating when you press a key, especially when you hold the right pedal. Electronic pianos are good, and I have one, but they are a different instrument that doesn't do what a cheap cabinet piano can.
  - eigenvector 8y ago
    Yes, that is a good way of putting it. No one would ask whether an electric guitar is 'better' or 'as good' as an acoustic, they are simply different. I enjoy owning an electric piano simply because it lets me practise with headphones in a small apartment, but it does not substitute fully for a mechanical piano.
  - 8y ago

DenisM 8y ago

>probably one of my bigger regrets is not learning. I started taking lessons a year ago, and I play well enough now to fool most strangers into thinking I know how to play. :) My highest achievement is playing half of this piece now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d72mZVxdylA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d72mZVxdylA (it's not me in the video). Just go ahead and learn to play.

amptorn 8y ago

Consider donating it to a school?

mrcsparker 8y ago

Vintage Steinway is my dream piano. Sorry that you have to get rid of it.

jefftk 8y ago

Loft it: https://www.jefftk.com/p/lofted-grand-piano https://www.jefftk.com/p/lofted-grand-piano