5 ms·

Yep. I love space and science, but after working with NASA for a while, you see some of the problems. NIH syndrome is a huge problem, especially between GSFC an

Yep. I love space and science, but after working with NASA for a while, you see some of the problems. NIH syndrome is a huge problem, especially between GSFC and JPL. There are incompetent engineers who will have a well paying job at NASA for life. And then there the passionate, brilliant scientists and engineers the that dream and make it all work. A reduction in force of dead weight would go a long way but it will never happen.

mushufasa 8y ago
i think that's true generally of any organization. pareto -- 80% of work done by 20% of workers. there's also some other law about the work being done by the square root of the total workers.
- planteen 8y ago
  I agree the 80/20 is true of most organizations. But producing nothing and keep your job for life as long as you show up for work is not common in private industry. On the private side, I see developers get let go all the time for inadequate work.
  - carolinaCarl 8y ago
    Hmmm, so 9 to get 3 workers, 16 for 4, 25 for 5, 100 gets 10, 10,000 gets 100... Yeah, I think that about fits. But on the other side of the table, having been forced to accepts seats at the kids table where competence is prohibited, there's this weird purgatory you're forced to cope with, like a Cassandra, being forced to nurse a Sick System. You want to take action, you certainly could intervene, take charge, and set things right, but any number of workplace taboos might be infringed upon or violated, in so doing. I've had to sit, and watch morons bumble about, stare at hamfisted facts of existence for years on end, look but not touch, and let perfectly reasonable things burn and go to waste because my hands were tied. Being competent enough to know better, skilled enough to intervene with success, and yet find myself in such a position where I am forbidden to do so is maddening. At some point a post-traumatic learned helplessness sets in, and you grow catatonic at the futility of struggling. If I could rewind my life, I'd love to locate the moment when I died inside. I might ballpark it back somewhere around... 2002? And yet reality still continues to unfold before these eyes. C'est la vie.
  - fra 8y ago
    This is an oft repeated trope, and it couldn’t be further from the truth. I’ve personally worked at large private firms where incompetent folks coasted for decades. When management’s clout is measured in headcount, you get this (whether in the private or public sector)
- shodan666 8y ago
  "pareto " There is no such thing as 80/20 rule in science. Its a common "internet folklore" myth repeated over and over in internet, books and "experts" - without any scientific basis whatsoever.
BurningFrog 8y ago
From what I hear the original "startup" NASA from the 60s was a no deadweight organization that efficiently cranked out world class space flight. That it since followed the path of every other monopoly bureaucracy was of course unavoidable.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- solarkraft 8y ago
  Interestingly the Indian Space Research Organisation seems not to have followed this path.
  - indexerror 8y ago
    A professor of mine who used to work at ISRO says that the place is choke full of bureaucracy.
- mturmon 8y ago
  > ...it since followed the path of every other monopoly bureaucracy... This is not really true, but you are taking it as axiomatic.
  - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
    It's a heck of a lot more true than false. Of coarse if you use a roller you need to cut in with a fine brush.
- fouc 8y ago
  Could tweet Trump and ask him to remove the deadweight.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- basementcat 8y ago

mushufasa 8y ago

i think that's true generally of any organization. pareto -- 80% of work done by 20% of workers. there's also some other law about the work being done by the square root of the total workers.

planteen 8y ago
I agree the 80/20 is true of most organizations. But producing nothing and keep your job for life as long as you show up for work is not common in private industry. On the private side, I see developers get let go all the time for inadequate work.
- carolinaCarl 8y ago
  Hmmm, so 9 to get 3 workers, 16 for 4, 25 for 5, 100 gets 10, 10,000 gets 100... Yeah, I think that about fits. But on the other side of the table, having been forced to accepts seats at the kids table where competence is prohibited, there's this weird purgatory you're forced to cope with, like a Cassandra, being forced to nurse a Sick System. You want to take action, you certainly could intervene, take charge, and set things right, but any number of workplace taboos might be infringed upon or violated, in so doing. I've had to sit, and watch morons bumble about, stare at hamfisted facts of existence for years on end, look but not touch, and let perfectly reasonable things burn and go to waste because my hands were tied. Being competent enough to know better, skilled enough to intervene with success, and yet find myself in such a position where I am forbidden to do so is maddening. At some point a post-traumatic learned helplessness sets in, and you grow catatonic at the futility of struggling. If I could rewind my life, I'd love to locate the moment when I died inside. I might ballpark it back somewhere around... 2002? And yet reality still continues to unfold before these eyes. C'est la vie.
- fra 8y ago
  This is an oft repeated trope, and it couldn’t be further from the truth. I’ve personally worked at large private firms where incompetent folks coasted for decades. When management’s clout is measured in headcount, you get this (whether in the private or public sector)
shodan666 8y ago
"pareto " There is no such thing as 80/20 rule in science. Its a common "internet folklore" myth repeated over and over in internet, books and "experts" - without any scientific basis whatsoever.

BurningFrog 8y ago

From what I hear the original "startup" NASA from the 60s was a no deadweight organization that efficiently cranked out world class space flight. That it since followed the path of every other monopoly bureaucracy was of course unavoidable.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
solarkraft 8y ago
Interestingly the Indian Space Research Organisation seems not to have followed this path.
- indexerror 8y ago
  A professor of mine who used to work at ISRO says that the place is choke full of bureaucracy.
mturmon 8y ago
> ...it since followed the path of every other monopoly bureaucracy... This is not really true, but you are taking it as axiomatic.
- dsfyu404ed 8y ago
  It's a heck of a lot more true than false. Of coarse if you use a roller you need to cut in with a fine brush.
fouc 8y ago
Could tweet Trump and ask him to remove the deadweight.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
basementcat 8y ago