4 ms·

>Make it illegal to put DRM on hardware for anti-competitive purposes. Can anyone give an example of DRM that isn't anti-competitive?

ashelmire 8y ago
DRM on a game, application, or media assets, for example? Which is most of the use of it.
- TheCoelacanth 8y ago
  If the company putting the DRM on the media also sells devices that play the media, that is anti-competitive, because they are preventing competition in media players using their media content business.
- josefx 8y ago
  Before widespread online DRM you could resell any of those used, which made them worth less over time as more used copies became available. Today you can buy many DRM riddled games for almost the same price you got them 5 years ago since the company selling them can maintain a monopoly.
Joeri 8y ago
The Content Scramble System on DVD's isn't anti-competitive, since all players can obtain a license for it, it's just anti-consumer. The example I'd like to see is of a single work that wasn't pirated due to DRM. DRM is hidden behind this wall of lies where ostensibly it's about piracy but in reality it is not. The true purpose is to control legal playback behavior, like how all legitimate hardware DVD players respect the flag that marks ads as unskippable because that's a requirement to obtain a DVD-CSS license, even though that DRM was already cracked in the 90's.
- Dylan16807 8y ago
  DRM is sometimes useful to delay the pirating of games. It would be nice if they were forced to remove it after 1/3/12 months.
  - jacoblambda 8y ago
    Considering DRM is often cracked within hours of release I'm not sure if it is really worth the cost of the license.
    - jsgo 8y ago
      Is that the case? I have read where Denuvo has been pretty effective for various games. I believe it eventually ends up getting cracked, but they've said the main goal is to delay it not to eliminate it as they feel the latter is impossible (and probably so, especially without impairing the enjoyment of their paying customers).
- chicob 8y ago
  Without trying to be picky, I would say that copying is not consuming. So DRM is not anti-consumer, but anti-freedom. The way words are thrown around theses days is kind of orwellian, and this has gotten into everyday's vocabulary. Part of this issue is philosophic in nature, and the absence of a proper public discussion is conditioning the way we speak in a perverse way. Consuming requires the exhaustion of the good being consumed: food is eaten, and consumed; clothing is worn, and consumed. This does not apply to data, and to culture in general. We consume tickets for the right to watch movies in a theater, or visiting a gallery. But we do not consume the movies or the art exhibition. We could argue whether the limitation of freedom is justified in a given situation, and that is a whole different and interesting discussion, but confusing concepts has led to the generalized (and wrong) conclusion that scarcity pertains to any good we buy, in particular those of cultural nature.
  - Joeri 8y ago
    Today the word consumer is basically a stand-in for citizen, which is really what I meant. There’s a whole podcast episode dedicated to this peculiar change: https://www.ridiculoushistoryshow.com/podcasts/rhs-citizens-vs-consumers.htm https://www.ridiculoushistoryshow.com/podcasts/rhs-citizens-...

ashelmire 8y ago

DRM on a game, application, or media assets, for example? Which is most of the use of it.

TheCoelacanth 8y ago
If the company putting the DRM on the media also sells devices that play the media, that is anti-competitive, because they are preventing competition in media players using their media content business.
josefx 8y ago
Before widespread online DRM you could resell any of those used, which made them worth less over time as more used copies became available. Today you can buy many DRM riddled games for almost the same price you got them 5 years ago since the company selling them can maintain a monopoly.

Joeri 8y ago

The Content Scramble System on DVD's isn't anti-competitive, since all players can obtain a license for it, it's just anti-consumer. The example I'd like to see is of a single work that wasn't pirated due to DRM. DRM is hidden behind this wall of lies where ostensibly it's about piracy but in reality it is not. The true purpose is to control legal playback behavior, like how all legitimate hardware DVD players respect the flag that marks ads as unskippable because that's a requirement to obtain a DVD-CSS license, even though that DRM was already cracked in the 90's.

Dylan16807 8y ago
DRM is sometimes useful to delay the pirating of games. It would be nice if they were forced to remove it after 1/3/12 months.
- jacoblambda 8y ago
  Considering DRM is often cracked within hours of release I'm not sure if it is really worth the cost of the license.
  - jsgo 8y ago
    Is that the case? I have read where Denuvo has been pretty effective for various games. I believe it eventually ends up getting cracked, but they've said the main goal is to delay it not to eliminate it as they feel the latter is impossible (and probably so, especially without impairing the enjoyment of their paying customers).
chicob 8y ago
Without trying to be picky, I would say that copying is not consuming. So DRM is not anti-consumer, but anti-freedom. The way words are thrown around theses days is kind of orwellian, and this has gotten into everyday's vocabulary. Part of this issue is philosophic in nature, and the absence of a proper public discussion is conditioning the way we speak in a perverse way. Consuming requires the exhaustion of the good being consumed: food is eaten, and consumed; clothing is worn, and consumed. This does not apply to data, and to culture in general. We consume tickets for the right to watch movies in a theater, or visiting a gallery. But we do not consume the movies or the art exhibition. We could argue whether the limitation of freedom is justified in a given situation, and that is a whole different and interesting discussion, but confusing concepts has led to the generalized (and wrong) conclusion that scarcity pertains to any good we buy, in particular those of cultural nature.
- Joeri 8y ago
  Today the word consumer is basically a stand-in for citizen, which is really what I meant. There’s a whole podcast episode dedicated to this peculiar change: https://www.ridiculoushistoryshow.com/podcasts/rhs-citizens-vs-consumers.htm https://www.ridiculoushistoryshow.com/podcasts/rhs-citizens-...