9 ms·
Some studies show an association between the herpes virus and Alzheimer’s
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- bicubic 8y ago>Excitingly, successful prevention of Alzheimer’s disease by use of specific anti-herpes agents has now been demonstrated in a large-scale population study in Taiwan. So why isn't that a standard treatment now? The abstracts of both studies indicate they were looking at existing antiherpetic treatments.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- bengrunfeld 8y agoThings move slowly in medicine, and this is bleeding edge research.
- iElectric2 8y agoBecause internet news spreads quicker than doctor gossip? Since the side-effects with some of the antiviral drugs are almost negligible, you can just but those and try :)
- stephengillie 8y agoPreviously on HN:. - Alzheimer's caused by dirty air. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18230932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18230932 - Alzheimer's caused by lack of sleep. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18228627 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18228627 There's mounting evidence that "health news" is neither healthy nor news.
- andai 8y agoIt's caused by brain damage, the sources of which are many.
- runarberg 8y agoBrain cell deterioration is a symptom of Alzheimer's disease, i.e. it brain damage is the effect of the disease, not the cause. What causes that deterioration is up for debate. Finding that cause is integral for better treatment and hopefully prevention and a cure.
- chiefalchemist 8y agoAt the risk of being a cynic, patterns to date necessitate I ask: - Who paid for this research / article. - Is this cause, or simply correlation of a fair common virus?
- DaiPlusPlus 8y agoThe article is written by a member of a team that publishes a lot of articles advancing this hypothesis - heck, that’s exactly what this article is about. I’m not qualified to judge the claims on-merit, but the self-serving nature of this article sets off my skepti-sense, and the fact this “major” revelation doesn’t come first-published in a notable journal is the strongest hint the research (while still useful) is probably vastly overstated.
- coldcode 8y agoMakes it hard to judge, but there are occasions where peers refuse to believe something right up until everyone accepts it, like the cause of ulcers often being Helicobacter pylori. Peer reviewed research these days isn't always dependable either given the for pay nature of many journals. Findings with actual anti-virals changing the brain function of people with Alzheimers would go a long way to showing the connection. That there is an inheritable connection to the disease is fairly well understood so that so that would make it more likely to get the disease wouldn't be much of a shock.
- taeric 8y agoThe story of what causes ulcers is truly crazy. Sounds like something from decades ago. Hard to believe we were that stubborn. And that is a full field of hard working individuals. I'm almost scared to think what my own biases are. I wish there was a solid framework to approach them, since I think most are basically invisible to the holder.
- Luc 8y agoWell knowing they exist (and affect intelligent, thoughtful people, too) is surely half the battle. I guess Charlie Munger wrote about the kind of thing you're looking for in 'Psychology of Human Misjudgement'. But then I heard him interviewed on Chinese TV recently, and he seemed to be displaying some huge misunderstandings on human genetics and intelligence, and making what I consider basic reasoning errors. Perhaps he didn't feel like applying his knowledge of cognitive biases to this area.
- gameswithgo 8y agoif lack of sleep and dirty air both compromise immune system function, it would be consistent with the virus hypothesis.
- lisper 8y agoYou forgot: - Alhiemers is a form of diabetes: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4578267 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4578267
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- narrator 8y agoThis is probably why methylene blue works so well to treat it. See http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3181/00379727-161-40521?journalCode=ebma http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3181/00379727-161-405... and http://taurx.com/phase-3.html http://taurx.com/phase-3.html
- user812 8y agoThanks for your comment. Some/Many HN commentators love what one could call the collective helplessness associated with authoritarian scientism and materialism - the idea that we are thrown into a ruthless and cold universe where life has emerged out of random and no easy solutions exist but instead only costly manipulation of small particles like genes and other molecules may safe us, but only in a distant future that we will probably never reach. Only persons of authority associated with the institutions in power may guide us to the holy land. Due to that philosophy there are many comments discrediting possible solutions.
- grenoire 8y agoWhat... are you?
- user812 8y agoWhat does that question mean?
- Chris_Chambers 8y agoMaking comments unreadably gray is a completely idiotic feature. I can’t fucking read this on my phone, and there’s no checkbox in the preferences marked “I am not a sensitive snowflake who needs comments to be made invisible to protect my feelie weelies”.
- adaptiveValleys 8y agoVery interesting. I was able to find the patent, but not the whole paper. Seems to suffice as a substitute. https://patents.google.com/patent/US4181128 https://patents.google.com/patent/US4181128
- gameswithgo 8y agoI know I have herpes simplex 1, it has a few times manifest itself as pinkeye or cold sores in times of stress for me. Is it possible I could get acyclovir or some other anti-viral prescribed? Or is it only used when the virus is not dormant? Is there any thing you can take long term to reduce the viral load, or eliminate it?
- ianai 8y agoMaybe ask around for methylene blue. You need an Rx in the US.
- kennywinker 8y agoThe occurence of HSV-1 and HSV-2 together is around 90% of the population. The occurrence of alzheimer’s is insignificant compared to that. So, clearly just having hsv doesn’t mean you’re going to get alzheimer’s. Ideally you’d be able to test for the presence of risk factors before taking a preventative drug (with potential side effects) for the rest of your life.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- gameswithgo 8y agoyes, I understand, but I would also like to not have the entire lining of my mouth and tongue obliterated for 3 weeks again. :D also I wonder if the fact that I'm actually experience outbreaks every now and then might imply I'm more at risk.
- Chris_Chambers 8y agoStop eating spicy food or anything with citrus. You will never experience an outbreak again.
- erentz 8y agoValtrex (valacyclovir) is commonly prescribed for people who get cold sores. Taken as needed at the first sign of an outbreak (e.g. before it’s visible but when you feel it coming) it can often prevent or reduce the outbreak. Your PCP should be able to do this for you. You’ll just have a bottle on hand and you’ll use it for only two or three days whenever the outbreak happens.
- artificialLimbs 8y ago100% anecdotal report, and slightly off-topic: I cured (as in not just remission) my HSV2 by swallowing my own loads for 2 years. Am a pretty heavy self-pleasurer, usually once a day. [Edit] I figured this would get downvoted. Is it because it's offtopic?
- syntaxing 8y agoA bit off tangent but I never understood why there is a vaccine for herpes zoster (shingles/chicken pox) but not HSV1/2? Are the two viruses that different?
- runarberg 8y agoMy former neurology teacher was working on finding a genetic model that could predict Alzheimer's. They said that work was going well. However they were also finding strong evidence for these infection models. which seems to contradict their work. The disease couldn't be both hereditary and infectious. Their answer were that possible we were looking at at least two different diseases that just so happened to attack the same neurons, and hence produce the same symptoms.
- EamonnMR 8y agoWell actually, it could be. Viral infections can cause mutations which lead to other diseases down the line, HPV causing cancer being the most famous. It could also, potentially, be heritable. Or the risk is heritable but the infection actually triggers the disease.
- amelius 8y ago> The disease couldn't be both hereditary and infectious. Why not? Why couldn't "proneness to infection" be hereditary, and the actual infection completing the disease mechanism?
- gameswithgo 8y agoor the way you respond to the infection could be genetic.
- choeger 8y agoYou would expect your models to distinguish the root cause. In your example their are either many infected that do not show symptoms or many related people that don't. In any case one of the models should be off.
- kens 8y agoA good overview of different hypotheses for Alzheimer's was published in Nature a couple months ago [1]. I recommend reading this before jumping on the latest HN theory. This article includes evidence for and against HSV. [1] https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-05719-4 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-05719-4
- ncmncm 8y agoI've seen an assertion that brain surgeons have seven times the risk of developing Alzheimer's as other surgeons (although I can't seem to find it now). If true, that would support an infection hypothesis, though not necessarily implicating HSV. Valacyclovir is cheap and safe enough that it could be given "on spec", to a very large number of people at risk. If it works, it works. One might interpret the delay in acting on the infectious hypothesis here as a result of the overwhelming majority of Alzheimer's researchers having no experience with virology. What should you do when you discover you have spent your career on something that turns out to have nothing to do with the cause of the disease you have studied? Probably not try to become a virologist. The most nimble must be casting about for other topics in brain microanatomy and gene expression. In ten years we might see a flowering of other results as they turn their attention away from Alzheimer's to topics that had been neglected.
- ncmncm 8y agoAha: https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/09/09/645629133/infectious-theory-of-alzheimers-disease-draws-fresh-interest https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/09/09/6456291... "Correction: Sept. 13, 2018 The initial version of this article overstated the rate at which neurosurgeons and spouses of Alzheimer's patients develop the dementia. The risk is nearly 2 1/2 times greater for neurosurgeons, not sevenfold, and 1.6 times higher for spouses, not six times greater. On Sept. 18, the article was changed to say that the risk for neurosurgeons was a comparison with the general population, not other causes of death for the doctors."
- nikolayav1 8y agoHave not opened the original links and papers, but valacyclovir only works on some of the human herpes viruses. There's something like 6 or 8, and for example the drugs that do exist that tream HHV 5 aka CMV effectively are highly toxic, and are/were only mostly used during the AIDS epidemic because it destroys various vital organs in immunocompromised patients, so the tradeoff is worth it.