6 ms·

This is great news and may serve as a model for other cities facing similar housing shortages. Was the speculation tax a ballot measure or something passed at t

by tspike 8y ago

This is great news and may serve as a model for other cities facing similar housing shortages. Was the speculation tax a ballot measure or something passed at the city council level?

goatherders 8y ago
I believe the city has been adding different things for the last couple years trying to open up more rentals. If I recall correctly something like 25% of all condos downtown are unoccupied which is insane. They arent even available to rent, just sitting their empty. It has had a real effect on employment, especially in tech. A friend of mine at hootsuite laments that sometimes they miss on great hires because even though the salary is competitive, there is literally nowhere within an hour of the office for the candidate to afford to live.
- jimrandomh 8y ago
  > If I recall correctly something like 25% of all condos downtown are unoccupied which is insane. They arent even available to rent, just sitting their empty. You do not recall correctly. https://www.reuters.com/article/canada-housing-vancouver/nearly-5-pct-of-vancouver-homes-deemed-vacant-amid-housing-crunch-idUSL4N1QP593 https://www.reuters.com/article/canada-housing-vancouver/nea...
  - romed 8y ago
    5% is barely a functioning market. Normally you'd expect 8-10% vacancy rate in a well-supplied housing market.
  - Tiktaalik 8y ago
    He was probably thinking of Coal Harbour, a downtown neighbourhood which did have a census non-occupied by usual residents rate between 20-25%.
  - projectramo 8y ago
    I think i see the confusion: 1% vacancy 5% unoccupied but not open to rent So of the houses that are unoccupied, only 20% are vacant? (I actually read it as 1/6th but the point is where the confusion may have come from)
  - goatherders 8y ago
    Thanks, always nice to get a downvote when someone corrects a data point. And your link cites the whole area, not downtown. But thanks anyway.
  - baybal2 8y ago
    The rest of Vancouver, and the downtown is quite a different thing. In 2011, I did an occupancy survey for a college group study, and yes we counted 31% vacancy in Coal Harbour
Tiktaalik 8y ago
The speculation tax was a Provincial level election promise by the NDP. Interestingly since it is a minority government that governs with the support of the BC Green party, the legislation needed to be tweaked slightly to gain Green Party support. The City of Vancouver implemented an empty homes tax, which has similar impacts on demand, but they had to ask the province for new powers in order to levy that.
Patrick_Devine 8y ago
It's hard to draw direct comparisons between Vancouver and San Francisco's housing markets. Canada, as well as each of the provinces, local municipalities, and cities, have representational democracy, not a quasi-direct democracy like California. The spike in affordability in Vancouver wasn't caused directly due to a shortage in housing stock and an influx of residents. It was caused by rampant speculation from people essentially using Vancouver as a safety net to park wealth. I can't overstate how detrimental this is to a city. What you end up with are entire neighbourhoods which are occupied at 50% or less, and yet with the value of the homes exceeding $2-$4 million. It causes stores in those local neighbourhoods to close because there aren't enough customers. It taxes the fire department because no one is there to call 911 when a fire starts. It guts schools because there aren't enough kids to fill classrooms. And with all of this going on, former local residents and young people are pushed further and further out of the urban core due to affordability. Vancouverites make less than half of what an average tech salary pays in the SF Bay Area, and the jobs are much harder to come by. That said, yes, Airbnb and other vacation rentals were exacerbating the problem, and causing Vancouver to turn further into a vacation/tourism destination instead of a real working city. San Francisco suffers from this to a certain extent, however, its real problem is that it has a massive influx of workers due to a booming tech economy, and not enough housing stock to accommodate all of those workers.
- koolba 8y ago
  > It guts schools because there aren't enough kids to fill classrooms. That one doesn’t sound bad at all. Every other school district complains about the reviser, too many kids and not enough teachers / tax dollars.
  - crazypyro 8y ago
    Not sure about Canada, but I know in many places in America, schools are budgeted on a per student basis, so losing kids (who still are going to school, just somewhere else) strains the school they are leaving with less money and then strains the schools where they are migrating to as the infrastructure now has to support more kids without having time to ramp up. So I think the problem kind of goes both ways.

by tspike 8y ago

This is great news and may serve as a model for other cities facing similar housing shortages. Was the speculation tax a ballot measure or something passed at the city council level?

goatherders 8y ago

I believe the city has been adding different things for the last couple years trying to open up more rentals. If I recall correctly something like 25% of all condos downtown are unoccupied which is insane. They arent even available to rent, just sitting their empty. It has had a real effect on employment, especially in tech. A friend of mine at hootsuite laments that sometimes they miss on great hires because even though the salary is competitive, there is literally nowhere within an hour of the office for the candidate to afford to live.

jimrandomh 8y ago
> If I recall correctly something like 25% of all condos downtown are unoccupied which is insane. They arent even available to rent, just sitting their empty. You do not recall correctly. https://www.reuters.com/article/canada-housing-vancouver/nearly-5-pct-of-vancouver-homes-deemed-vacant-amid-housing-crunch-idUSL4N1QP593 https://www.reuters.com/article/canada-housing-vancouver/nea...
- romed 8y ago
  5% is barely a functioning market. Normally you'd expect 8-10% vacancy rate in a well-supplied housing market.
- Tiktaalik 8y ago
  He was probably thinking of Coal Harbour, a downtown neighbourhood which did have a census non-occupied by usual residents rate between 20-25%.
- projectramo 8y ago
  I think i see the confusion: 1% vacancy 5% unoccupied but not open to rent So of the houses that are unoccupied, only 20% are vacant? (I actually read it as 1/6th but the point is where the confusion may have come from)
- goatherders 8y ago
  Thanks, always nice to get a downvote when someone corrects a data point. And your link cites the whole area, not downtown. But thanks anyway.
- baybal2 8y ago
  The rest of Vancouver, and the downtown is quite a different thing. In 2011, I did an occupancy survey for a college group study, and yes we counted 31% vacancy in Coal Harbour

Tiktaalik 8y ago

The speculation tax was a Provincial level election promise by the NDP. Interestingly since it is a minority government that governs with the support of the BC Green party, the legislation needed to be tweaked slightly to gain Green Party support. The City of Vancouver implemented an empty homes tax, which has similar impacts on demand, but they had to ask the province for new powers in order to levy that.

Patrick_Devine 8y ago

It's hard to draw direct comparisons between Vancouver and San Francisco's housing markets. Canada, as well as each of the provinces, local municipalities, and cities, have representational democracy, not a quasi-direct democracy like California. The spike in affordability in Vancouver wasn't caused directly due to a shortage in housing stock and an influx of residents. It was caused by rampant speculation from people essentially using Vancouver as a safety net to park wealth. I can't overstate how detrimental this is to a city. What you end up with are entire neighbourhoods which are occupied at 50% or less, and yet with the value of the homes exceeding $2-$4 million. It causes stores in those local neighbourhoods to close because there aren't enough customers. It taxes the fire department because no one is there to call 911 when a fire starts. It guts schools because there aren't enough kids to fill classrooms. And with all of this going on, former local residents and young people are pushed further and further out of the urban core due to affordability. Vancouverites make less than half of what an average tech salary pays in the SF Bay Area, and the jobs are much harder to come by. That said, yes, Airbnb and other vacation rentals were exacerbating the problem, and causing Vancouver to turn further into a vacation/tourism destination instead of a real working city. San Francisco suffers from this to a certain extent, however, its real problem is that it has a massive influx of workers due to a booming tech economy, and not enough housing stock to accommodate all of those workers.

koolba 8y ago
> It guts schools because there aren't enough kids to fill classrooms. That one doesn’t sound bad at all. Every other school district complains about the reviser, too many kids and not enough teachers / tax dollars.
- crazypyro 8y ago
  Not sure about Canada, but I know in many places in America, schools are budgeted on a per student basis, so losing kids (who still are going to school, just somewhere else) strains the school they are leaving with less money and then strains the schools where they are migrating to as the infrastructure now has to support more kids without having time to ramp up. So I think the problem kind of goes both ways.