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Business card-sized Japanese phone bucks the giant-phone trend
- gumby 8y agoReminds me of the Franklin REX (which I had in my wallet for a while -- eventually donated them to the CHM) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REX_5000 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REX_5000
- brlewis 8y agoThat's good. I can't think of anything but the SNL skit - last minute of this video: https://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/jeffreys-with-sean-hayes/3505971 https://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/jeffreys-with-...
- hn_throwaway_99 8y agoThis looks somewhat similar in purpose to the light phone 2: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-phone-2#/ https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-phone-2#/ . I've been looking forward to that phone because their ethos seems to be in line with what I want: all the "directed" tools you want (phone, text, contacts, alarm, maps, Uber/Lyft, etc) but nothing that lets you get into "mindless scroll" mode like social network apps or a browser.
- browsercoin 8y agonot to shit on this, this looks like a great initiative, but I strongly doubt them being able to deliver with only the money they raised.
- userbinator 8y agoTheir plan to use/modify Android and essentially a smartphone platform is a bit bizarre and certainly won't help with the cost, because they're aiming for a feature phone; there are existing platforms for those and I'm sure adapting one with an EPD and changing the UI slightly to match is going to be a far cheaper route. China will probably come out with similar clones before long... maybe even before the original: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18210950 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18210950
- fyfy18 8y agoThe Nokia Classic phones are probably the closest released phone that fits this criteria so far. I recently got a Nokia 105 (2017) for my parents as the bespoke charger on their old phone broke, and it was cheaper to get a new phone. I played with it a bit, and as far as a phone goes it's top notch for making calls, but the lack of even basic apps like maps or messaging (other than SMS) make it pretty limited. The phone has a grand total of 4MB of RAM in contrast with the latest smart phones which have up to 6GB. Android is too bloated as an OS for feature phones, but I'd love to see a new platform come out designed for limited RAM (maybe a few hundred megabytes) which it's easy to develop apps for, yet still produces devices that last for a week or two on a single charge. In developing countries these phones are still pretty popular, and from the comments people are posting here would go down pretty well with the HN croud.
- jaclaz 8y agoIt is all a matter of what you want a device to do (I know it seems obvious). I had a couple of what you could call a "smartphone" before "smartphone" existed (Sony Ericsson P900/P910), which anyway had a battery that normally lasted a couple days. I have an (ageing) Samsung Note, but what I now use daily (since a few years) and carry with me at all times a Nokia 1280: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_1280 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_1280 I can make and receive calls and SMS', it is tiny and extremely robust, it has been dropped countless times without any damage (shell and battery just "explode" and you have to find all the pieces and then reassemble it), battery lasts days, it simply fills most of my needs, without having to carry with me at all times a (bulky and fragile) smartphone.
- vageli 8y ago> I have an (ageing) Samsung Note, but what I now use daily (since a few years) and carry with me at all times a Nokia 1280 Curious to hear what carrier you use it on. 2G options in the US at least are severely limited.
- jaclaz 8y agoIn EU 2G is just fine (yet?), Italy here, but never had problems in EU and near countries.
- wtmt 8y agoWish these were not as expensive as they are. This, the new Palm phone and similar devices could potentially start a minimalist (and "cute"?) revolution where devices focus on some core aspects with battery life closer to that of feature phones.
- ip26 8y agoThat new Palm phone sounds like exactly what I've been looking for for two years, except for the carrier exclusive and the part where it only goes with another phone, not on its own-which might not be so bad, except for the extra $20/mo.
- gwbas1c 8y agoNice idea if you have to carry a second phone. Especially nice if the phone is passed amoung different people, like for pager duty.
- trynewideas 8y agoWhat actually happened to the market for 4" phones? I came across my old Droid Incredible II the other day and it felt so much better in my hand than any other smartphone I've held in the last 3 years. I could comfortably type on it with one hand, something I couldn't dream of doing well on a 5" or larger phone.
- jolmg 8y agoHaving a 5.5" myself, I can tell you that while a smaller phone would be more comfortable in my hand, having a larger screen provides more utility by allowing more content to be seen and used at once. I guess what I want is a super-portable substitute to my computer for when I'm on the go. Having big hands also makes it easier to get accustomed. EDIT: I also get the feeling that bigger phone means more features and longer battery times because of the extra space for electronics and the battery. Who knows, maybe if I held a 4" that's fast with a lot of memory and long battery life, I could get accustomed to seeing less content. There's also the fact that website layout is determined by the website developers. I wonder how good the layouts are generally on the internet for 4" screens. It might be that many websites have fixed width side margins that cause a bigger whitespace-to-text ratio on smaller screens.
- elabajaba 8y agoJust saying, Sony was managing to fit a microSD card, headphone jack, and good sized battery (in terms of battery life, they've been some of the longest lasting phones despite using (admittedly low res) LCDs instead of OLEDs) in their 4.6" compacts up to the XZ1C last year. The only feature they were missing was wireless charging.
- oscilloscope 8y agoThe Motorola Razr M was an even smaller form factor with a 4.3" display. And all the iPhones from 3g to SE were outstanding in this now-extinct category, especially the 5s. The 5s has the venerable status of being not only small, but one of the oldest currently-supported smartphones. At over 5 years old, it can still run respectably with iOS 12.
- fenwick67 8y agoMight consider it if it wasn't so expensive. In a world where feature phones that are marginally larger cost under twenty dollars it's hard to justify.
- rb808 8y agoTo help break my addiction I'm looking for a phone with good camera, basic apps like uber and email, but small enough that surfing the net isn't great and clash of clans is unusable. :) Any small phone recommendations?
- whitepoplar 8y agoI think the best phone you can get today, regardless of price, is the iPhone SE, even though it's not being sold by Apple anymore.
- andrepd 8y agoSadly iphones aren't an option. It disrespects my freedoms in pretty glaring ways.
- whitepoplar 8y agoHow so?
- Casseres 8y agoI don't know about the other commentor, but Apple is extremely against Right To Repair.
- sagichmal 8y agoIronically, the Apple phone ecosystem is the only viable option, if you care about data privacy.
- gear54rus 8y agohah! backed by what? empty promises of inherently "closed" company with a huge ego?
- endemic 8y agoI would argue that an Android phone without Google apps (e.g. LineageOS) is just as good; perhaps even superior, as you don't have to rely on an arbitrary gatekeeper in order to install software.
- andrepd 8y agoOh god yes. I have a 5 inch phone going on 2 years now and it's about as big as I can tolerate. I dread the day it dies and I have to get another, because I literally don't see (mid to high end) phones below this size anymore (gsmarena shows... 6 fitting this bill released in the past year).
- ayushgp 8y agoNow that all the phones coming out have a bezelless display, why aren't manufacturers reducing the whole phone's size instead of extending the screen to the top and bottom. Take OnePlus 5 and OnePlus 6 for example. The OnePlus 6 could've easily been equal to only the screen size of OnePlus 5 but they chose to extend the screen to top and bottom instead.
- mrweasel 8y agoI don't understand the quest for bezel-less designs. It makes all phones look the same. It has meant that all but one manufacturer have moved the fingerprint reader to the back, or removed it. For someone like me who often use my phone while it's laying flat on the table, it means that I can't easily unlock it. Even FaceID wouldn't help, because it can't see my face in that angle. Then there's the notch. Come on, that just stupid, just add the 4 or 5mm of bezel a the top, it's fine. Why would I need the extra two top corners of screen, the screen is big enough.
- nickflood 8y agoIt does happen, Galaxy S8+ and S9+ is much narrower than iPhone 7+/8+ for to the point that it's actually easier to hold the phone.
- hliyan 8y agoI predict that within the next five years, the dominant form factor will move away from large, thin, shiny devices toward smaller, rounder, thicker (but less dense) devices that fit more comfortably into a human palm.
- kevin_thibedeau 8y agoI just wish you could find pocketable 4.7" phones in the US. They exist but are either not imported or don't support domestic LTE bands and not worth it. Older flagships are guaranteed to be Chinese knockoffs and not worth the bother. We don't all want a phablet.
- baddox 8y agoThe iPhone SE was a dream come true, though even smaller than 4.7” and obviously an iPhone which could be a dealbreaker for some. Funny enough, I feel like basically any smartphone with current flagship internals in any 2-3 year old flagship form factor would be ideal for me.
- jnaina 8y agoNot sure why this is news. There are a whole host of credit Card size phones available in China and you easily buy them on Aliexpress/Taobao at around < USD$30. Here's one example: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/ultrathin-mini-metal-credit-card-phone-3-5mm-jack-remote-camera-MP3-3-0-bluetooth-BT/32841185000.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.225.6cd539ebduxE6P&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_4_10065_10068_318_319_317_10696_450_10084_10083_10618_452_535_534_533_10307_532_5023915_204_10059_10884_323_10887_100031_320_321_322_5727615_10103_448_449,searchweb201603_45,ppcSwitch_0&algo_expid=66247b9f-a1b8-4f5d-a523-bdd3e1f72f24-32&algo_pvid=66247b9f-a1b8-4f5d-a523-bdd3e1f72f24 https://www.aliexpress.com/item/ultrathin-mini-metal-credit-...
- userbinator 8y agoThose don't have an eink display (yet), so battery life and sunlight readability won't be as good. (Battery life might not be all that much better since the display of a feature phone is going to be used far less than a smartphone, but the readability certainly can be.)
- TheSpiceIsLife 8y agoNo discussion of tiny phones is complete without reference to John’s Phones: https://www.johnsphones.com/store/johns-phone-bar/item46 https://www.johnsphones.com/store/johns-phone-bar/item46
- fusiongyro 8y agoSite appears to be pretty broken.
- seabrookmx 8y agoYeah I got a file download prompt clicking on that link. Kinda sketch.
- themensch 8y agoImpeccable timing as I witness my iPhone 6 crash opening the phone app. You had one job, iPhone.....
- browsercoin 8y agoas a galaxy user I wondered why they dont make smaller phone that i can control with one hand without fear of dropping it? im okay with a smaller reddit is fun app.
- kazinator 8y agoTwenty-somethings today don't remember a time before the smartphone era when there was a race for phones to be smaller. Cell phones were initially huge. Actually, first they existed as "car phones". They were heavy boxes the size of a big bottle of laundry detergent, bearing a handset with a number pad. They operated on AMPS (analog mobile phone service). After that cell phones then became smaller and more portable, but still huge, resembling household cordless phones. There was a race in the 1990's and early 2000's for smaller and smaller phones. Having a smaller phone than the next person was a status symbol. Smartphones have disrupted that trend, because small touch screens suck. The trend has not entirely been disrupted: smartphones cannot be too large. Then they turn into tablets. And, thin matters, still.
- another-cuppa 8y agoPhones started to get too small in the 2000s. I can't remember which phones in particular but some definitely had buttons too small for most people's hands.
- asknthrow 8y agoMy old Nokia (don't remember the model) had buttons so small I had to use my nails instead of my fingertips!
- TomMarius 8y agoI had a phone that had almost no buttons. At least there were gaps. https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/0S0AAOSwaB5Xp-lT/s-l300.jpg https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/0S0AAOSwaB5Xp-lT/s-l300.jpg
- pmlnr 8y agoThin doesn't matter after a certain depth. Same applies to laptops, see macbook pro outcries. Phones need some depth to avoid slipping out of our hands.
- Novashi 8y agoI think we just really started to see the value of high resolution internet browsing and media consumption in your pocket. If the cell carriers did something crazy like not letting us browse the internet through their network (or charged us $1k+), phones would likely small and forgettable.
- joewee 8y agoWould love to switch to a phone like this, only problem I have is text messages are inherently insecure and I would have to create a convoluted setup of texting from a devices with apps like signal and forwarding calls to this dumb device...wish there was a simple phone with a restricted build that only included signal and WhatsApp or something similar, in addition to the basic phone features.
- brownbat 8y agoIf only you could hack signal on to whispernet...
- userbinator 8y agoIt also has no camera. It has built-in apps, though, including a Web browser, a calculator, and a calendar—so sure, it's technically a smartphone The established term for a phone with that functionality is "feature phone". In fact, it's even in the URL: https://www.nttdocomo.co.jp/product/feature_phone/ky01l/ https://www.nttdocomo.co.jp/product/feature_phone/ky01l/
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- fma 8y agoI don't think I can survive without a camera. I would take a feature phone with a high quality camera. Sacradkce everything else (except battery) and I'll buy it.
- issa 8y agoI thought the iPhone 5 was the last decently sized phone made. I recently held an older iPhone model and it was actually smaller and even better. I understand that most people, like my wife, use their phone for everything and a bigger screen makes sense. But I spend my day in front of a computer and my phone is for calls, texting, and photos. Throw in directions/maps, and I would gladly live without almost everything else.
- x0054 8y agoAll I want is an iPhone 3G with an all screen front. It would fit 4.2-4.5 inch screen with ease and it's the size of my wallet. iPhone X specs in the iPhone 3G body. Thicker is fine, just make the battery last a long time. Honestly, there must be people like me out there. I'll gladly pay $1k for a 4ish inch version of iPhone X. Large phones are fine, to each their own. But some of us what small phones. And I have large hands, but I want to be able to comfortably use a phone with one hand. Typed in iPhone SE.
- jen729w 8y agoSE owner here. Total tech nerd, but I just want a small phone that fits in my back pocket when I'm cycling. It makes me very sad that they're all getting enormous. When I'm out, I'm just sending messages. Maybe a bit of maps and occasionally Safari. But all of my proper browsing is done at home, on an iPad or my Mac. When I'm out, I'm out. The phone is a tool, it's not the thing I'm doing.
- lerie82 8y agoWhere to get browser specs for design testing?
- rwmj 8y agoI'd like to see a flip phone again. Large screen, small size (and would actually justify the modern trend to make everything incredibly thin). Having said that I'd like to know if this small phone is a success or not. If no one buys it then maybe everyone is happy with phablets.
- rtpg 8y agoI feel like there's an untapped space for a small phone with a good 9-key keyboard (or something). There are a couple niche small phones out there but they all insist on using a software keyboard that is _amazingly slow_. Typing is basically the thing that needs to work as fast as possible, otherwise it ruins the experience. Almost no design is trying to acknowledge that the idea of a high-end small phone might be appealing to people (despite Apple having evidence with iPhone SE sales being decent enough). In a world without all the apps, designing something almost ground up would make a lot of sense, since Android isn't meant to fit on such a small screen anymore.
- mrweasel 8y agoFlip phones was never really my thing, I like the old school Nokia designs better. I have some really weird wishes for a new phone. Something like the Nokia 104, but with 4G and wifi for tethering support. Oh, and a Google Authenticator app, for work. If possible I would also like the option of having an Linux or Mac OS app for writing SMS messages on my laptop, so I can have a real keyboard.
- rwmj 8y agoFlip phones were huge in Japan from about 2000 up to the iPhone. Nokia-style chocolate bars were never really popular there. I think a new flip phone which folded out into a large flat screen (rather than having a physical keyboard) might be an interesting proposition. For what you describe in your message above, have you thought about buying a laptop with built in SIM card support or alternately USB 4G SIM card modem?
- mrweasel 8y ago
- submeta 8y agoFor me the larger screen has much more value than the ability to have a small phone with me. For typing reasons and for doing research on a larger screen or reading news or ebooks. Also, I use my iPhone more like a PDA, the telephone feature is used lesser and lesser. And if I do use it to do phone calls I do it in combination with my AirPods while my iPhone is in my pocket. And in that case perceptionally my AirPods + Siri ("Hey Siri, call my wife") are my telephone. The way I see it a small(er) phone or even a small dumbphone makes sense for people who use their devices mainly for doing phonecalls. Having said that I must add that going for a run with my iPhone 7 Plus is cumbersome because it's too bulky. I need it to listen to music while running. Cant't load music on my running watch from Garmin (Fenix 5)
- npapag7 8y agoThe market wants mobiles phones and PDAs to be the same device. That is what phones with large screens are.
- Animats 8y agoWhat's needed is a carrier offering which allows you to have a small phone on an account in addition to a big one, at no extra charge. Both ring on the same number, and you can't have independent calls on both at the same time, and there's some limitation to prevent using both for major data at the same time. Then you should be able to get a $49 feature phone as a spare, or for when you don't need a big phone. (Yes, you can kludge this up using Google Voice, or Twilio, or running Asterisk on your home Linux server, but it needs to be easier than that.)
- vageli 8y ago> What's needed is a carrier offering which allows you to have a small phone on an account in addition to a big one, at no extra charge. Both ring on the same number, and you can't have independent calls on both at the same time, and there's some limitation to prevent using both for major data at the same time. Why would a carrier offer for free something they can easily monetize? A proxy for this would be how Verizon charges customers a monthly fee for the "soft" sim present in Apple watches.
- maxsilver 8y agoVerizon is sort-of doing this with the new Palm "Plam" phone - https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/15/17974850/new-palm-smartphone-android-lifemode-time-well-spent-verizon https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/15/17974850/new-palm-smartp... It's not "no extra charge" -- you pay an extra $10/month. But you get a traditional full-sized smartphone, and an additional small "Palm" phone with limited screen size and features, running on the same telephone number, with no extra setup or services required.
- jstewartmobile 8y agoKeeping a cell around at all times is about as good for your sanity as smoking is for your lungs. They could reduce it all the way down to a "Jitterbug", and the problem would still be there.
- pmlnr 8y agoThe best sizes and felt phone I ever owned was the HTC Desire. I'd love a teeny bit larger successor to thatvwith the same build quality and better battery life.
- walterbell 8y agoIt is hard to believe that Apple, of all companies, does not understand how customers build their "device portfolios": • one device = biggest phone • two devices = 13/12 laptop or iPad Pro 12 + medium phone • three devices = 13/12 laptop, iPad 10.5 + smallest phone • four devices = three devices + watch / AR glasses It does not take a genius to see that the iPhone SE form factor is the logical choice for Apple customers with three or four devices. These are the customers spending the most money in Apple's ecosystem. In the absence of a product visionary at the helm, large companies may want to ask why US/EU customers purchased a product developed for the Indian market. Abandoning emerging markets' low-cost phones does not require abandoning the global market of customers buying a coordinated portfolio of fit-for-purpose devices. On a secondary footnote, the creation of "Screen Time" is likely a pre-emptive defense against future lawsuits for smartphone health consequences, ranging from eye health to psychological effects on developing brains. What reduces screen time? A small phone like the iPhone SE that can still be used with headphones for audio. So there is a legal argument to be made for small phones: the presence in a corporate product line allows liability to be shifted to customers — if you suffer negative consequences from screen time, you should have bought the small phone to discourage screen use. On the other hand, if companies only offer large phones, and we find out years later that they knew the health risks of excess screen time were increased by large phones, they would have contributed to the problem instead of possible solutions (like the iPhone SE).
- gurkendoktor 8y ago> if you suffer negative consequences from screen time, you should have bought the small phone to discourage screen use. To play devil's advocate: You could also buy an Apple Watch, and only use your phablet when you absolutely need to.
- walterbell 8y agoWe have years of data from closed device ecosystems where carriers and other gatekeepers decided what devices could do, including restricting TCP/IP connections (hello Blackberry). If the Apple Watch meets all your use cases, it is the preferred option to reduce sceeen time. If you need intermittent, short and all-day business critical mobile access to an application or web browser, a small "phone" (mobile computer with radio) is the device which currently supports the most use cases.
- xaduha 8y agoI'd rather buy some old Nokia.
- cjblomqvist 8y agoI'm surprised at all the disappointment about no small smartphones existing. I'm typing this on a Sony Xperia Compact (XZ1) I just bought. It's cheap, battery lasts two full days after 1-2 years of usage (I lost my last one, that's why I bought a new one). It works great and have a pretty clean version of Android. Instead of complaining, why not just go buy a small phone? I thought people in here knew better than to complain without doing any research.
- dade_ 8y agoIt was the best phone on the market for me. It is the most durable smartphone I have ever owned and Sony is releasing an upgrade to Pie: http://www.xperiablog.net/2018/10/18/sony-confirms-early-android-9-pie-updates-for-some-xperia-models/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+XperiaBlog+%28Xperia+Blog%29 http://www.xperiablog.net/2018/10/18/sony-confirms-early-and...
- iguy 8y agoFor anyone else curious & lazy, here's a size comparison to some older iphones -- the Sony is a little bigger than an SE. https://www.phonearena.com/phones/size#/phones/size/Sony-Xperia-XZ1-Compact,Apple-iPhone-SE,Apple-iPhone-3GS/phones/10650,10001,3774 https://www.phonearena.com/phones/size#/phones/size/Sony-Xpe...
- wlesieutre 8y agoDoes unlocking the bootloader still erase the DRM keys for the camera’s image processing and turn it into a piece of garbage? That’s how it worked on my Z3C. Other than that, decent phone if not a biiit too big still. https://www.androidpolice.com/2014/10/02/unlocking-the-bootloader-on-sonys-xperia-z3-and-z3-compact-causes-poor-low-light-camera-performance-thanks-to-drm/ https://www.androidpolice.com/2014/10/02/unlocking-the-bootl...
- upofadown 8y ago>It has a 380mAh battery, which sounds abysmal, but the ePaper display should not use very much power, so we wouldn't be surprised if its battery life is just fine regardless. It has a LTE radio in it. Battery life is not going to be fine. The 80g phones of the '00s era with 2 week battery life are just a fond memory. The technology is degrading over time.
- user5994461 8y ago>>> It has a 380mAh battery, which sounds abysmal It is truly abysmal. Can it even last a full day being idle? Contrary to what people may think, it's not the screen that consumes the most battery (unless actively used) but the radio.
- forinti 8y agoI really like the idea of an e-ink display so that the battery will last longer, but they are also not so strong and I'm afraid it won't last long if you treat this phone like other phones (toss into your backpack or put it in your back pocket).
- Const-me 8y agoAwesome idea, but $350? I’ve recently bought another Lumia 930, brand new, for $100…
- gymshoes 8y agoI love this design. All I want is a 4 inch e-Paper display with a browser that can open epub files.