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Postcards from Big Brother: The Curious Propaganda of a Brutal Soviet Era
- kushti 8y ago"Though most of the memorials were built from the 1960s through the 1980s, the most abstract designs harken back to the Russian Revolution of 1917, when Vladimir Lenin and his Bolsheviks promised to empower workers and take the reins from the Tsarist bourgeois." - the propaganda language of the article is illiterate as there were two revolutions in Russian Empire in 1917, Tsarist regime was overthrown by February Revolution and bolsheviks overthrew bourgeois regime in October revolution, thus talking about "Tsarist bourgeois" vs bolsheviks is simply not literate.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- v_lisivka 8y agoHistorically, Russia has one revolution (February Revolution) and October coup (Putsch)[1], which was then renamed into Great October Socialist [bla bla bla]... Revolution much later. [1]: http://grachev62.narod.ru/stalin/t4/t4_38.htm http://grachev62.narod.ru/stalin/t4/t4_38.htm
- kushti 8y agoThen you need to provide a credible source which provides an explanation why FR was a revolution and other is not, not a Stalin's article from 1918 you provided which is not about that at all. Left-leaning historians often define (a real) revolution as a change in ruling class, based on that definition both FR and OR were the very real revolutions (one was about passing power to bourgeois class, another about passing power to the working class), but if you are using other definitions, please provide them.
- v_lisivka 8y agoIf direct speech of executors of coup are not credible source for you, then what I need to provide to convince you? Wikipedia article? First hand evidence is enough for any court in the world.
- davidgould 8y agoI dunno, if the direct speech of say bank robbers claims that it was "account rebalancing" not robbery, is that sufficient? That is, I don't think history is obliged to take the claims of historical actors at face value.
- a7776f88862 8y agoYou are being disingenuously pedantic by making a distinction between synonymous words. From the linked document: "Уже с конца сентября ЦК партии большевиков решил мобилизовать все силы партии для организации успешного восстания. В этих целях ЦК решил организовать Военно-революционный комитет в Питере" Which translates to: "From the end of September, the central committee of the bolshevik party decided to mobilize all party forces for the organization of a successful uprising. To these ends, the central committee decided to organize a Military-revolutionary committee in St. Petersburg" Also note the reference to the counter-revolutionary plot. For Stalin, the October coup was clearly the continuation of the February revolution.
- v_lisivka 8y agoNo, I don't. You need to understand that whole process, started in February 1917, was named "Russian revolution", while October episode was just part of it. They were separated in to two "revolutions" much later. See [1] for more details. [1]: https://pikabu.ru/story/ot_revolyutsii_k_perevorotu_i_obratno_kak_menyalos_naimenovanie_sobyitiy_1917_goda_za_proshedshie_sto_let_5717461 https://pikabu.ru/story/ot_revolyutsii_k_perevorotu_i_obratn...
- a7776f88862 8y agoDid you even bother to read the article you linked to? The citations make it quite clear that the terms were synonymous, and it was multiple groups (not just the Bolsheviks) who referred to the October Bolshevik takeover as a revolution.
- duxup 8y agoThe regime was terrible, but I enjoy the scale of some of these soviet monuments.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- myst 8y agoWhy do you think it was terrible?
- petepete 8y agoAside from the millions of deaths, you mean?
- FranzFerdiNaN 8y agoCan’t say it’s much more than the US caused, when you count slavery, the extermination of native people, CIA backed coups, the prison complex and capitalism among others. But if the US does it it’s called “bringing freedom and democracy”, so those deaths dont seem to count.
- happyrock 8y agoYou people have really terrible arguments.
- swebs 8y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulag https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulag https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excess_mortality_in_the_Soviet_Union_under_Joseph_Stalin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excess_mortality_in_the_Soviet... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KGB https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KGB
- d0mine 8y ago
- Mediterraneo10 8y agoThat postcard with an aerial shot of housing blocks in Novi Beograd must represent a regional trend. In Romania after the turn of the millennium, I found some old postcards from the 1980s in a bookshop that were still, though covered in dust, for sale. Several of them were the same: aerial shots of new residential neighbourhoods with buildings of not particularly impressive architecture. I don’t know if Communist officials actually thought that Western tourists would be interested in these kind of shots, or if postcards were just exploited as one more disingenuous propaganda medium for boasting about development statistics. Probably a mix of both.
- Symbiote 8y agoWould there have been sufficient Western tourists for that to be a market? I think it's more likely they were produced for the residents of those places, to send to friends and relatives. "Look how nice our new home is!" — and it was nice, in 1980, compared to what it replaced.
- simias 8y agoEven in non-communist France these horrible concrete boxes were once hailed as the future of housing. When they were first built they had all the comfort the middle class yearned for at the time. The problem is that they degraded very fast and soon became synonymous with "poor people houses". Here's a postcard from the 60's for instance: https://i.redd.it/3ofea4jd6k2z.jpg https://i.redd.it/3ofea4jd6k2z.jpg
- V-2 8y agoFrance wasn't communist, but it was heavily influenced by communist ideas. I believe it had the second largest communist party in the West (after Italy), and Le Corbusier was highly revered in the USSR.
- Symbiote 8y agoYou can find similar buildings in Britain, Sweden, Germany, Belgium and probably others.
- AnarchoYeasty 8y agoDoes anyone else find it interesting how when the Soviets do something it's propaganda, but when Liberals do something it's advertising. Those brutalist architectures was something to be proud of. Prior to the Soviet Union the region was almost entirely undeveloped. The new cities and blocs represented the rise of the proletarian class even if the face of Nazi and Western opposition. Was it as pretty and individualistic as Western housing? Sometimes. I mean let's not pretend housing for the poor in Western nation's was spectacular. Take a look at the inner city. Besides the soviets had other priorities than fun individualistic buildings.
- RodericDay 8y agogender topic? race topic? kavanaugh topic? trump topic? "keep politics out of hackernews! divisive! off-topic!" casual anti-communist propaganda? "omg so interesting!"
- amatecha 8y agoHmm, I was in Bosnia/Herzegovina, Croatia and Slovenia this past summer, and saw many "spomenik"[0]... It is interesting to see these in person and their size is usually surprising. If you are traveling in the area there's a site dedicated to cataloguing the location & appearance of these monuments.[1] 0: https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/spomenik-memorials-yugoslavia-balkans https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/spomenik-memorials-yug... 1: http://www.spomenikdatabase.org/ http://www.spomenikdatabase.org/
- TaylorAlexander 8y agoDetractors aside, does anyone here think that we should build subsidized housing en masse for the homeless in, say, San Francisco? If so, how do we do it?
- smacktoward 8y ago"Tax the rich" seems like a decent starting point.
- TaylorAlexander 8y agoI’d be particularly interested in solutions that do not involve taxation or any involuntary contributions. Can we change the law so that building housing for the homeless is cheaper, for example?
- davidgould 8y agoDo you have some ideas on how to make building housing cheaper? Make substandard housing for the homeless, no need for fire or seismic code compliance? Enslave the construction workers? Forced relocation to North Dakota to take advantage of lower land cost?
- TaylorAlexander 8y agoI almost thought you were serious. Do you realize that some of these people literally sleep on the concrete sidewalk? It would be hard to build something below those standards. But YES! Why not “substandard”? I see homeless people huddling under awnings. I think an enclosed space with some heating and a roof would be a wonderful place for someone who normally sleeps outside.
- stale2002 8y agoBuilding good housing is already very cheap, when you compare it to the actual market price. The reason why price is so high is because the government makes it literally illegal to actually build stuff. AKA building height limit zoning laws. Just go look at how much it costs to build a good apartment building in any place in the mid west. It's cheap. Cost has nothing to do with actual construction costs. Its zoning and government regulations that cause all this.
- Quequau 8y agoSomething that fascinates and discourages me is how effective propaganda is even when it is transparently (at least to outsiders) propaganda. There is so much media today which is also transparently propaganda but somehow the people it's directed at fail or refuse to recognize it.
- ilaksh 8y agoThere seems to be a belief (in the US) that the United States stopped creating or commissioning propaganda at some point in the past. Most people might say around the end of WWII. It's part of a greater American exceptionalist belief system. I am curious to know when people in this thread believe that American propaganda stopped. For me there are so many obvious examples, from misleading explanations on the news for military actions to giant blockbuster films and TV shows.
- jvanderbot 8y agoYes, we switched to media. Easier to distribute. I was on a flight and noticed a large number of modern war movies produced in China. They were quite like American "Blackhawk down" or "12 strong". Clearly meant to demonstrate the professionalism and ingenuity of their army vs the rest of the world.
- maxxxxx 8y agoThe human mind is interesting. For example even when people know that they are getting a placebo it still helps them. Or I know commercials are BS but I still trust products I have seen in a commercial more than others.
- smacktoward 8y agoI know we're meant to look at the subjects of these postcards and marvel at how horrible they are, but some of them actually look quite interesting. You've got plenty of your standard dreary Soviet-era monumentalism, of course, but the Flower of Life memorial is humble and affecting, the Armenian Writer's Union guesthouse annex is straight out of The Jetsons, and the Soldier's Field Memorial is one of the most creative war memorials I've ever seen. Compare the latter to the new-ish, thuddingly literal World War II Memorial in Washington, DC (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_World_War_II_Memorial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_World_War_II_Memorial), for instance, and it's no contest; as a way to remember both war and what war really is, the Volgograd memorial wins hands down.
- shortoncash 8y agoAnyone know what to Google to see what the insides of those buildings looked like? They look interesting.
- ataturk 8y agoThe first line of story turned me off completely. There is ZERO evidence that the Russians meddled in the US elections beyond some social media spamming. The media can't let go of it--it was the Democrats themselves who tampered with the elections! I hope the truth eventually comes out about what really goes on with US elections and who the fraudsters are, what party they all belong to, and let's just put an end once and for to all this hype. Talk about propaganda!
- gumby 8y agoThat monument to the conquerors of space (it's on top of the Museum of Space) is as impressive today as it must have been in the 1960s. I was there just a few months ago. As for the pictures of apartment blocks, I remember those kinds of postcards from the 60s and 70s myself in Western Europe, USA, Australia, Malaysia etc. In this regard the Soviet Union and Warsaw bloc were no different.