5 ms·
All this complication around methods of execution baffles me. Why don’t we use a massive dose of fentanyl or some other opioid? I’ve got to be missing somethin
by function_seven 8y ago
All this complication around methods of execution baffles me.
Why don’t we use a massive dose of fentanyl or some other opioid? I’ve got to be missing something, because that seems like a simple, one-step process that doesn’t risk the pain of paralytics and potassium chloride.
I think the death penalty is a useless relic, but if we’re going to do it, why make it so bizarre?
- ams6110 8y agoI'd say use carbon monoxide. No taste or odor, no sense of suffocation, just a quiet loss of consciousness and then death.
- onetimemanytime 8y agoHow long would that need to be?
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- cloudbubble 8y agoThere are symptoms. It's only a nice, calm death if you're sleeping - so you'd want to do the usual suicide technique of sleeping pills + carbon monoxide.
- Kaveren 8y agoNitrogen gas appears to be what states* are looking into [1] [2]. [1] http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2014/05/death_by_nitrogen_gas_will_the_new_method_of_execution_save_the_death_penalty.html http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudenc... [2] http://time.com/3749879/nitrogen-gas-execution-oklahoma-lethal-injection/ http://time.com/3749879/nitrogen-gas-execution-oklahoma-leth... *Edit: Changed "statesn" to "states".
- dmm 8y agoNitrogen would be a lot safer for everyone else around. You can release lots of N2 in a reasonably ventilated room without harm but that's not the case with CO.
- TylerE 8y agoHelium would likely be even safer, since any that leaked would rise towards the ceiling/ventilation.
- sebazzz 8y agoThen it would be funny if the convicted would speak. I'm not sure you want that in an execution. Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRKVQcbIByo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRKVQcbIByo
- mikeash 8y agoEverything I’ve heard about hypoxia indicates that it’s a neutral or pleasant experience. You lose your higher mental functions first so you don’t panic or worry about what’s going on. You feel fine until you keel over. The fact that this isn’t the standard way to do it is a clear sign to me that the people making these decisions aren’t interested in making it quick and simple.
- emilfihlman 8y agoGas chambers herewecome!
- dannypgh 8y agoThat would require either the state finding a legal source of fentanyl that is willing to sell them the drug for that purpose (challenging, given most pharma companies refuse due to some mix of principles and not wanting their product to be associated with death) or the state contracting with black market suppliers. Given the state imprisons low level illicit drug suppliers, I'm guessing the hypocrisy of granting legit contracts to illicit drug manufacturers is enough to make the black market route a non-starter.
- tomatocracy 8y agoIt's not just principles that causes the issue for pharma companies (although the principles are, I think, real and truly held by the senior executives of those companies) - the EU has also banned export of any drugs for use in executions which makes it legally problematic for them too.
- function_seven 8y agoThat already have that problem with the drugs currently used, so it doesn’t seem to be an additional roadblock to using a simpler cocktail. Also, aren’t there Chinese suppliers who wouldn’t add those troublesome stipulations?
- wolfgke 8y ago> That would require either the state finding a legal source of fentanyl that is willing to sell them the drug for that purpose (challenging, given most pharma companies refuse due to some mix of principles and not wanting their product to be associated with death) or the state contracting with black market suppliers. Or simply open a small gouvernmental lab that produces the drug in the small amounts necessary.
- Overtonwindow 8y agoI’m very surprised that someone hasn’t opened a company explicitly to manufacture execution drugs.
- Swizec 8y agoI understand the desire to make it humane. But killing someone is not particularly humane in the first place. You also have to wonder about whether it’s worth making killing someone super humane since, you know, they’re gonna die anyway. So they have an unpleasant few seconds, or perhaps minutes, and then they’re dead. I mean, they just suffered some 10 years or more of imprisonment, often solitary, which is extremely inhumane in general. What’s 2 more minutes? That said, we have plenty of fast and humane execution methods that are hard to botch. Most involve a swift disabling of the brain stem. Like a bullet to the back of the neck, hanging, guillotine, that long nail thing they use for cows. All those seem easier, cheaper, more reliable, and faster than these lethal injection and electric chair contraptions. But surely I must be missing something important.
- sokoloff 8y agoIt always struck me as odd that for lethal injection, the medical staff sterilized the needle site before hooking up the line.
- mikeash 8y agoThe governor might issue a pardon before you actually inject the drug.
- jjoonathan 8y agoIt has nothing to do with being humane and everything to do with appearing humane and, even more importantly, avoiding association with otherwise extremely similar killing. Shooting prisoners in the head would be humane, but it would invite comparison to terrorists, revolutionaries, and other unsavories. However warranted the comparisons are, dressing up executions in medical nonsense avoids them, so our government does it.
- function_seven 8y agoAgreed. Yet they somehow manage to over-complicate the medical dressing up.
- bodas 8y agoThe whole point of death penalties is to kill someone gruesomely as a warning to everyone else. Electric chairs do that, opioids not so much.
- JoeAltmaier 8y agoYet 'getting the needle' is also used as a threat.
- jacobsheehy 8y agoCitation needed. From what I understand, 1) that theory is incorrect and the death penalty is not seen as a deterrent by potential future criminals (rather it may be the opposite) [citation coming]; and 2) Policymakers who say it is a deterrent are either lying or disinformed. My understanding of the death penalty is that it is intended as violent punishment and is done gruesomely for the purposes of revenge. Read any thread online about a bad crime and you will see mobs of people calling for violent, public murders of the accused. It's human nature for a lot of people and something I think a civilized nation would immediately outlaw, especially ones that pride themselves on not doing "cruel and unusual punishment". I remember reading that the death penalty in the US doesn't fall under that category merely because of the 'and' clause and the relatively common nature of gruesome murders by the State in the US. [citations]. It seems that states without the death penalty have lower murder rates, suggesting the opposite forces are true compared to your post (edit: i.e, it might even mean that a place with state-sanctioned/performed murder is more likely to have murders). https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death...
- JoeAltmaier 8y agoAgreed. But the death penalty still has the property that it avoids recidivism completely. Which is a deterrent of sorts.
- copperx 8y agoLife imprisonment avoids recidivism completely too. At least on the civilian population.
- TylerE 8y agoYes, it is mindbogglingly barbaric. What's weirdest is that we seemed to have regressed from even historical levels. A simple long drop hanging or guillotining would probably be more humane than most of the methods in use today - and with administration of a strong sedative beforehand even more so.
- Overtonwindow 8y agoI thought question: what a more severe form of execution be a deterrent? Let’s say the guillotine is brought back. Would that act as a deterrent?
- TylerE 8y agoI don't think so. Most crimes that would qualify for the death penalty are the result of psycopaths (serial killers, and such), or wanton criminals - if someone is comitting armed robbery armed an heavy firepower, they're prepared to die - by either the bullet or the government.
- URSpider94 8y agoOpioid overdose is not as reliably deadly as people think. Yes, it CAN kill, but it doesn’t always, and not in a defined time period, and not always cleanly - respiratory arrest vs. cardiac arrest vs. brain death. The goal of the protocol is to have a process that has a very high likelihood of causing death within a fairly short period.
- TylerE 8y agoWhy not just dose continually until death occurs?
- dogma1138 8y ago“Crewel and unusual”
- function_seven 8y agoAssuming no pain is felt, what's the cruel part?