12 ms·

Recently quite a few articles appeared on HN about escaping the rat race for a while and taking some time off. As someone who has a little savings and who is a

Recently quite a few articles appeared on HN about escaping the rat race for a while and taking some time off. As someone who has a little savings and who is a bit burnt out I've been toying with the idea myself quite a bit. My biggest fear is that because I have only a vague idea of what I want to do with my time, I will fritter away my sabbatical, not accomplish much and end up pretty much at the same point (but with less money). OTOH maybe my ideas about what I want to do are vague precisely because I don't have much time to flesh them out.

wskinner 8y ago
I was in the same place as you. When I started my sabbatical I had some vague ideas, but mainly just planned to drive around the western US and experience the outdoors. After a few weeks I realized I missed thinking about technology, so I started doing the CryptoPals exercises (https://github.com/wskinner/cryptopals https://github.com/wskinner/cryptopals). I learned a lot, at my own pace, and didn't come back feeling like I wasted my time. Those first few weeks of unstructured time were essential. Not framing the time as having to accomplish something is important - I found that my intrinsic motivation came back on its own anyway.
freedomben 8y ago
It's a serious risk. If I'm ever in this situation again, I think I will have an idea, and possibly even a very bare-bones prototype before I quit my job. Also, if you're going to use this opportunity to learn a new language/framework/etc, I'd dip the toes in the water now.
surfmike 8y ago
I've been in that boat. My situation ended up being similar to what you're worried about— wasn't able to develop any idea or business substantially. My advice from my limited experience is: if you want to go it alone enough, you should be able to create at least a very simple version 0.1 before you strike it out on your own. We often think work is what's holding us back, but lack of disclipine and direction could be just as limiting.
- dorchadas 8y ago
  I've found lack of direction to be my biggest issue. I've got a job that, thankfully, gives me a decent work-life balance (if not a great pay to go along with it), but I just can't bring myself to do anything during my time off because I don't know what to do. Though, that's not to say discipline isn't an issue as well. I've had several ideas, and never really followed through because of lack of discipline/not seeing how it's going to help me earn money, etc.
  - wolco 8y ago
    Do nothing, live. There will come a time when you get passionate just go with it.
shawn 8y ago
I will fritter away my sabbatical, not accomplish much and end up pretty much at the same point (but with less money). The best part of doing this myself was to become comfortable with this. At the end of it, you feel more free than most people. Or at least I did. Becoming ok with not being defined by money or accomplishments is one of the nicer parts of growing older. You can finally relax and shed some of the angst from youth. Everyone needs money, but ultimately if you live a simple life with simple tastes then you can still afford some gadgets to satisfy your hacking spirit. It takes at least a year just to decompress, and then another year to become comfortable with not having anything to show for your time. That is the growth.
paulcole 8y ago
> I have only a vague idea of what I want to do with my time, I will fritter away my sabbatical, not accomplish much and end up pretty much at the same point (but with less money). This is what I did for 2-3 years. I slept in everyday, went to the gym or for a run, rode my bike around, read books, went to movies, watched TV, shopped for groceries, cooked most of my meals, went on dates, and pretty much never left town. Eventually I only had like 6 or so months of expenses in the bank and got another job. Wasn't a waste to me, I loved it.
- thelasthuman 8y ago
  That sounds like a healthy life. To bad things aren't setup for the majority of people to have time to care for themselves.
- nanomonkey 8y ago
  How did you get back into the job world? I'm in a similar situation and wondering how to spin my time off (which I've loved).
  - paulcole 8y ago
    This was back in 2012 that I started working again. I just looked at Craigslist and got lucky when I saw an ad that was the intersection of my previous 2 positions. Applied there, got it, and stayed for a bit more than 3 years. My background is writing/marketing though so it’s not like my skills were particularly out of date.
keeptrying 8y ago
A lot of people confuse the pursuit of entrepreneurship woth just wanting a break. They are two different things. Entrepreneurship means killing yousrefl with more work than in a day job. If you’re looking to take a break, then just do that like the OP. Take a break and do some light coding only if you want to. If you want to do entrepreneurship Then you need to cut down the risk when you are going full time. So have some momentum for an idea - Ie you’ve vetted it, built it and charging at least 5 people for it. Something that lessens your risks. Also make a commitment on a timeframe after which you would quit and start looking for a job. Eg: if I have 0 revenue after 1 year I will quit.
- tonyedgecombe 8y ago
  "Entrepreneurship means killing yousrefl with more work than in a day job." It doesn't have to, a lot of the people I know started their business because they wanted to get away from that culture.
  - Regardsyjc 8y ago
    In my experience as someone who started and ran a small business for a few years now- entrepreneurship carries a lot of risks. Financial, social, and emotional. If you have a business background or previous professional experience with a valid business model - in that you can just execute building a profitable business from the get go and delegate the parts needed - you're set. But if you don't have capital or experience delegating, it can be a very painful process because you are now responsible for everything from hiring/management, operations, finance, product, etc.
txcwpalpha 8y ago
I did this, and unfortunately your fears became reality for me. Like you said, I only had a vague idea of what I wanted to do (including traveling, starting my own company, continuing education, side projects, etc). Almost 2 years into it I ended up just barely dabbling in each. I traveled for a few months, worked on some side projects, and learned some new things, but didn't really do anything "big" or traditionally "worthwhile" with my sabbatical. I look at my friends and colleagues who in this time period have gotten promotions, new jobs, MBAs, etc and I start feel like my time has been wasted. People keep telling me that once I join the workforce again that I will look back fondly on this time, but right now I definitely don't. The most frustrating thing I have experienced is that society in general is still not accepting of people taking "sabbatical" in their 20s. While about 10% of people think it's cool that I quit my job and am flying by the seat of my pants, the other 90% hear that I'm unemployed and treat me like a pariah. It's been very eye opening to me just how linked your personal identity is to your job. And I don't mean job as in "I am a programmer", but specifically the actual name of the company you are employed by. I've had people be very interested in conversation with me at social events when I talk about work-related things, but when I actually say the words "I don't currently work anywhere and am taking some time off", those same people have literally picked up their drinks and walked away. It's particularly bad with recruiters now that I'm ready to start looking for a new job again. Even though I left my company on extremely good terms (they literally begged me to stay!), recruiters seem to see that I left [insert major well respected company here] and assume that I must been have fired. Most still seem to think Google et al are some extremely coveted workplaces and can't imagine that someone would willingly leave them. It is a very tough hurdle to get over.
- shawn 8y ago
  While about 10% of people think it's cool that I quit my job and am just flying by the seat of my pants, the other 90% hear that I'm unemployed and treat me like a pariah. The trick for getting around this is to form an LLC and say that you were freelancing. No one will ask questions. And, after all, it's true. You would have taken money in exchange for services rendered, had a sufficiently-enticing opportunity presented itself. So it's not even a lie.
- colanderman 8y ago
rb808 8y ago
I think the idea of taking a month-3 month vacation is a better goal, or perhaps a year to do a masters. I've seen people quit to learn and experiment with stuff but its difficult - better to get a job where you can learn stuff.
dougmwne 8y ago
I feel like not being sure what you would do with your time if you weren't working is one of the surest signs you're really truly burnt out. For the intellectually curious, the world has an endless supply of fascinations to explore. For the civic minded, there's countless causes and people who could use your help. For the pleasure seekers, there's a rainbow of experiences left to live. And what better time then when you're young and healthy. Consider broader definitions of "accomplishment" and "wealth" than "job" and "paycheck." I speak from experience on this. A few months into a year-long sabbatical my brain had rewired itself and the burnout healed. I started finding enjoyment in the small quiet moments again. 4 years later, I can say that the sabbatical was the best career move, the best financial decision, and the best personal decision I have ever made. It led me to a new home, a new career, and much new wisdom.
- vegetablepotpie 8y ago
  I'm intrigued by your sign of burnout. I have over 100 hours of vacation time left that I need to use before 2018 ends. I've been indecisive on how to use it. I don't know if it's because I'm a workaholic, unimaginative or burnt out. I feel like not knowing what to do with free time could be a sign of any three, I don't know how you would figure out which though.
  - goldfeld 8y ago
    Just sleep and read books, it simply can't go wrong. Books and bedtime help more ideas come. Do lots of cooking if enjoyable.
  - dougmwne 8y ago
    I only realized in retrospect that it was burnout. I "felt fine" at the time. I remembered being passionate about things in college but it seemed like I was just too busy for that kind of thing anymore. Sometimes I'd sit and think, "hmm, strange that nothing seems to excite me anymore, maybe that's just what getting older feels like." I knew I felt weary, but everyone around me seemed to feel the same. I was honestly surprised when the color came back. I was almost too busy to notice it was missing. Now that I know how my own burnout symptoms manifest, I can keep an eye on my stress and work-life balance to make sure I don't get so far gone again.
adamnemecek 8y ago
I’m in the same boat. However the thing to realize is that you’ll be better off even if you fail, you’ll have a lot of new skills. You’ll also have time to network. I quit my job to work on a project (http://ngrid.io http://ngrid.io). I’m close to being done but in the process I’ve met a lot of people and I have three job offers lined up without interviewing.
jsemrau 8y ago
The trick is always to go TO somewhere not FROM somewhere.
- dunkelheit 8y ago
  Sure, but finding a worthwhile direction in which to go (and not just another soul-sucking job not much different from your current one) takes time and energy and these can be in low supply because of full-time responsibilities and burnout.
neltnerb 8y ago
In my experience having done this a few times, I find that while I'm working I can't come up with new ideas because I'm too mentally exhausted or just don't have time. Usually I take a week or two letting myself experience calm and boredom, and then reading what others are doing inspires some ideas. Usually I then write myself mini proposals like you'd do for your boss or a grant, clarifying what I think I know, what I think might work and why it works be interesting, how the problem I'm considering is done best now, and how I'd go about developing that problem into a project. It takes maybe a day or three per proposal, but saves months of chasing bad ideas like a new electronic device that solve a technical problem in a cool new way (but does it worse than the current solution. It just takes a different amount of time and introspection and recovery for each person. There are so many ways to live a good life, and many are better than what we thought we wanted in high school or college. Don't be afraid to explore things that seem silly, no one is watching and it's the only way to learn. But boredom while alone is critical. Perhaps the most important part to redeveloping curiosity and processing what we think we want is silence.

wskinner 8y ago

I was in the same place as you. When I started my sabbatical I had some vague ideas, but mainly just planned to drive around the western US and experience the outdoors. After a few weeks I realized I missed thinking about technology, so I started doing the CryptoPals exercises (https://github.com/wskinner/cryptopals https://github.com/wskinner/cryptopals). I learned a lot, at my own pace, and didn't come back feeling like I wasted my time. Those first few weeks of unstructured time were essential. Not framing the time as having to accomplish something is important - I found that my intrinsic motivation came back on its own anyway.

freedomben 8y ago

It's a serious risk. If I'm ever in this situation again, I think I will have an idea, and possibly even a very bare-bones prototype before I quit my job. Also, if you're going to use this opportunity to learn a new language/framework/etc, I'd dip the toes in the water now.

surfmike 8y ago

I've been in that boat. My situation ended up being similar to what you're worried about— wasn't able to develop any idea or business substantially. My advice from my limited experience is: if you want to go it alone enough, you should be able to create at least a very simple version 0.1 before you strike it out on your own. We often think work is what's holding us back, but lack of disclipine and direction could be just as limiting.

dorchadas 8y ago
I've found lack of direction to be my biggest issue. I've got a job that, thankfully, gives me a decent work-life balance (if not a great pay to go along with it), but I just can't bring myself to do anything during my time off because I don't know what to do. Though, that's not to say discipline isn't an issue as well. I've had several ideas, and never really followed through because of lack of discipline/not seeing how it's going to help me earn money, etc.
- wolco 8y ago
  Do nothing, live. There will come a time when you get passionate just go with it.

shawn 8y ago

I will fritter away my sabbatical, not accomplish much and end up pretty much at the same point (but with less money). The best part of doing this myself was to become comfortable with this. At the end of it, you feel more free than most people. Or at least I did. Becoming ok with not being defined by money or accomplishments is one of the nicer parts of growing older. You can finally relax and shed some of the angst from youth. Everyone needs money, but ultimately if you live a simple life with simple tastes then you can still afford some gadgets to satisfy your hacking spirit. It takes at least a year just to decompress, and then another year to become comfortable with not having anything to show for your time. That is the growth.

paulcole 8y ago

> I have only a vague idea of what I want to do with my time, I will fritter away my sabbatical, not accomplish much and end up pretty much at the same point (but with less money). This is what I did for 2-3 years. I slept in everyday, went to the gym or for a run, rode my bike around, read books, went to movies, watched TV, shopped for groceries, cooked most of my meals, went on dates, and pretty much never left town. Eventually I only had like 6 or so months of expenses in the bank and got another job. Wasn't a waste to me, I loved it.

thelasthuman 8y ago
That sounds like a healthy life. To bad things aren't setup for the majority of people to have time to care for themselves.
nanomonkey 8y ago
How did you get back into the job world? I'm in a similar situation and wondering how to spin my time off (which I've loved).
- paulcole 8y ago
  This was back in 2012 that I started working again. I just looked at Craigslist and got lucky when I saw an ad that was the intersection of my previous 2 positions. Applied there, got it, and stayed for a bit more than 3 years. My background is writing/marketing though so it’s not like my skills were particularly out of date.

keeptrying 8y ago

A lot of people confuse the pursuit of entrepreneurship woth just wanting a break. They are two different things. Entrepreneurship means killing yousrefl with more work than in a day job. If you’re looking to take a break, then just do that like the OP. Take a break and do some light coding only if you want to. If you want to do entrepreneurship Then you need to cut down the risk when you are going full time. So have some momentum for an idea - Ie you’ve vetted it, built it and charging at least 5 people for it. Something that lessens your risks. Also make a commitment on a timeframe after which you would quit and start looking for a job. Eg: if I have 0 revenue after 1 year I will quit.

tonyedgecombe 8y ago
"Entrepreneurship means killing yousrefl with more work than in a day job." It doesn't have to, a lot of the people I know started their business because they wanted to get away from that culture.
- Regardsyjc 8y ago
  In my experience as someone who started and ran a small business for a few years now- entrepreneurship carries a lot of risks. Financial, social, and emotional. If you have a business background or previous professional experience with a valid business model - in that you can just execute building a profitable business from the get go and delegate the parts needed - you're set. But if you don't have capital or experience delegating, it can be a very painful process because you are now responsible for everything from hiring/management, operations, finance, product, etc.

txcwpalpha 8y ago

I did this, and unfortunately your fears became reality for me. Like you said, I only had a vague idea of what I wanted to do (including traveling, starting my own company, continuing education, side projects, etc). Almost 2 years into it I ended up just barely dabbling in each. I traveled for a few months, worked on some side projects, and learned some new things, but didn't really do anything "big" or traditionally "worthwhile" with my sabbatical. I look at my friends and colleagues who in this time period have gotten promotions, new jobs, MBAs, etc and I start feel like my time has been wasted. People keep telling me that once I join the workforce again that I will look back fondly on this time, but right now I definitely don't. The most frustrating thing I have experienced is that society in general is still not accepting of people taking "sabbatical" in their 20s. While about 10% of people think it's cool that I quit my job and am flying by the seat of my pants, the other 90% hear that I'm unemployed and treat me like a pariah. It's been very eye opening to me just how linked your personal identity is to your job. And I don't mean job as in "I am a programmer", but specifically the actual name of the company you are employed by. I've had people be very interested in conversation with me at social events when I talk about work-related things, but when I actually say the words "I don't currently work anywhere and am taking some time off", those same people have literally picked up their drinks and walked away. It's particularly bad with recruiters now that I'm ready to start looking for a new job again. Even though I left my company on extremely good terms (they literally begged me to stay!), recruiters seem to see that I left [insert major well respected company here] and assume that I must been have fired. Most still seem to think Google et al are some extremely coveted workplaces and can't imagine that someone would willingly leave them. It is a very tough hurdle to get over.

shawn 8y ago
While about 10% of people think it's cool that I quit my job and am just flying by the seat of my pants, the other 90% hear that I'm unemployed and treat me like a pariah. The trick for getting around this is to form an LLC and say that you were freelancing. No one will ask questions. And, after all, it's true. You would have taken money in exchange for services rendered, had a sufficiently-enticing opportunity presented itself. So it's not even a lie.
colanderman 8y ago

rb808 8y ago

I think the idea of taking a month-3 month vacation is a better goal, or perhaps a year to do a masters. I've seen people quit to learn and experiment with stuff but its difficult - better to get a job where you can learn stuff.

dougmwne 8y ago

I feel like not being sure what you would do with your time if you weren't working is one of the surest signs you're really truly burnt out. For the intellectually curious, the world has an endless supply of fascinations to explore. For the civic minded, there's countless causes and people who could use your help. For the pleasure seekers, there's a rainbow of experiences left to live. And what better time then when you're young and healthy. Consider broader definitions of "accomplishment" and "wealth" than "job" and "paycheck." I speak from experience on this. A few months into a year-long sabbatical my brain had rewired itself and the burnout healed. I started finding enjoyment in the small quiet moments again. 4 years later, I can say that the sabbatical was the best career move, the best financial decision, and the best personal decision I have ever made. It led me to a new home, a new career, and much new wisdom.

vegetablepotpie 8y ago
I'm intrigued by your sign of burnout. I have over 100 hours of vacation time left that I need to use before 2018 ends. I've been indecisive on how to use it. I don't know if it's because I'm a workaholic, unimaginative or burnt out. I feel like not knowing what to do with free time could be a sign of any three, I don't know how you would figure out which though.
- goldfeld 8y ago
  Just sleep and read books, it simply can't go wrong. Books and bedtime help more ideas come. Do lots of cooking if enjoyable.
- dougmwne 8y ago
  I only realized in retrospect that it was burnout. I "felt fine" at the time. I remembered being passionate about things in college but it seemed like I was just too busy for that kind of thing anymore. Sometimes I'd sit and think, "hmm, strange that nothing seems to excite me anymore, maybe that's just what getting older feels like." I knew I felt weary, but everyone around me seemed to feel the same. I was honestly surprised when the color came back. I was almost too busy to notice it was missing. Now that I know how my own burnout symptoms manifest, I can keep an eye on my stress and work-life balance to make sure I don't get so far gone again.

adamnemecek 8y ago

I’m in the same boat. However the thing to realize is that you’ll be better off even if you fail, you’ll have a lot of new skills. You’ll also have time to network. I quit my job to work on a project (http://ngrid.io http://ngrid.io). I’m close to being done but in the process I’ve met a lot of people and I have three job offers lined up without interviewing.

jsemrau 8y ago

The trick is always to go TO somewhere not FROM somewhere.

dunkelheit 8y ago
Sure, but finding a worthwhile direction in which to go (and not just another soul-sucking job not much different from your current one) takes time and energy and these can be in low supply because of full-time responsibilities and burnout.

neltnerb 8y ago

In my experience having done this a few times, I find that while I'm working I can't come up with new ideas because I'm too mentally exhausted or just don't have time. Usually I take a week or two letting myself experience calm and boredom, and then reading what others are doing inspires some ideas. Usually I then write myself mini proposals like you'd do for your boss or a grant, clarifying what I think I know, what I think might work and why it works be interesting, how the problem I'm considering is done best now, and how I'd go about developing that problem into a project. It takes maybe a day or three per proposal, but saves months of chasing bad ideas like a new electronic device that solve a technical problem in a cool new way (but does it worse than the current solution. It just takes a different amount of time and introspection and recovery for each person. There are so many ways to live a good life, and many are better than what we thought we wanted in high school or college. Don't be afraid to explore things that seem silly, no one is watching and it's the only way to learn. But boredom while alone is critical. Perhaps the most important part to redeveloping curiosity and processing what we think we want is silence.