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You (or one of your countrymen) pay for it with taxes, that isn't the same as it costing $0. Now, it likely a) does cost a lot less in Denmark than in the Stat

You (or one of your countrymen) pay for it with taxes, that isn't the same as it costing $0. Now, it likely a) does cost a lot less in Denmark than in the States in real terms and b) paying for it with taxes might absolutely make the most operational sense. But it isn't free.

bryanrasmussen 8y ago
wooo, I hadn't realized we pay for it with taxes! Wow thanks for correcting me, this sure has been a week for me, why yesterday I just barely learned that water was wet - imagine that!?!
- kasey_junk 8y ago
  So how much did it cost you to have a baby in Denmark, just so the conversation is clarified? Also as an aside there are lots of babies born in the US that are paid for via taxes and cost $0 out of pocket for the family. Medicaid, the VA, Tri-care etc. I don't have the numbers in front of me but I'd bet that there were more American babies that were tax paid for than Danish ones in a given year.
  - bryanrasmussen 8y ago
    Given that there's less than 10 million Danes I guess that's a good bet. how much did it cost me to have a baby in Denmark, gee I don't know how much did you pay for the crosswalks on your street? What I do know is that when I went to hospital and the baby was born nobody hit me with a $15000 bill afterwards just like when they installed a new crosswalk where you live nobody came by your house and billed you $15000. Did my taxes pay for all of my baby being born - I guess they probably did I am in the highest bracket and have been for approximately 15 years. However I also know that anyone who has a baby in Denmark has it without getting billed. And I guess that's the way most of us like it. So while there may be more American babies that Danish babies born with taxes paying for their birth I'm just going to have to point out that there is a greater percentage of Danish, or pretty much any European country's, babies worn without the parents paying a relatively large fee for the privilege.
    - kasey_junk 8y ago
      Look, I’m not some anti single payer guy. In fact given the option I’d bet on it being the best of the options. But it’s just untrue that you paid $0 to have a kid. You don’t know how much you paid & that’s ok. But it’s a valid criticism of single payer. Further it is also true that the US system has deep flaws but it’s fundamentally untrue that the many Americans get the full boat costs of a birth. So comparing your $0 cost & a $15k outlier is largely a futile excercise.
      - bryanrasmussen 8y ago
        The article says that people in the U.S are not having children because of prohibitive costs, 15000 dollar bill from a hospital was mentioned somewhere. Various Europeans said they paid 0 in their country, somebody said that even in Europe you pay and the cost is approximately the same (the implication being that you pay a bill, not a tax) which is quite the lie and prompted me to join the people saying hey, we pay 0 (implying not getting a big bill all of a sudden that you might not be able to afford at that particular moment) I'm pretty sure every other person reading my initial comment understood huh, the government pays for it and he pays his taxes. But you seemed to need to make a gotcha argument about it which again, given how human conversation is structured and the literal impossibility of defining everything down to constituent atoms in every communication it is generally assumed that people in good faith take some things as given which is why in response to your taxes comment I was sarcastic because who among us is so lightheaded that they don't understand taxes exist and are used to pay for things the government provides us? I don't think the people who upvoted the comment thought I had made a brilliant refutation of your point about taxes, I think they just thought what is this guy with taxes on about - because that's not what the point under discussion is and you would have to be rather obtuse to think it was. That's ok, I certainly have my own issues that I am thickheaded about, but really people do know taxes pay for the births in European hospitals. As to whether it is fundamentally untrue that many Americans get the full boat costs of a birth, I don't know. I do know the article seemed to think they were getting enough of a boat that they were sinking. Hence all of us Europeans saying, he we're doing swell with the kids and all started up. I don't think that's such a futile exercise.
- tptacek 8y ago
  Please be more civil. And notice that you've contradicted yourself; you said upthread "you pay 0", and now are clarifying the mechanism you use to pay a nonzero amount of dollars for it.
  - bryanrasmussen 8y ago
    I believe I was the appropriate level of civil given the context, so I shan't be more.

bryanrasmussen 8y ago

wooo, I hadn't realized we pay for it with taxes! Wow thanks for correcting me, this sure has been a week for me, why yesterday I just barely learned that water was wet - imagine that!?!

kasey_junk 8y ago
So how much did it cost you to have a baby in Denmark, just so the conversation is clarified? Also as an aside there are lots of babies born in the US that are paid for via taxes and cost $0 out of pocket for the family. Medicaid, the VA, Tri-care etc. I don't have the numbers in front of me but I'd bet that there were more American babies that were tax paid for than Danish ones in a given year.
- bryanrasmussen 8y ago
  Given that there's less than 10 million Danes I guess that's a good bet. how much did it cost me to have a baby in Denmark, gee I don't know how much did you pay for the crosswalks on your street? What I do know is that when I went to hospital and the baby was born nobody hit me with a $15000 bill afterwards just like when they installed a new crosswalk where you live nobody came by your house and billed you $15000. Did my taxes pay for all of my baby being born - I guess they probably did I am in the highest bracket and have been for approximately 15 years. However I also know that anyone who has a baby in Denmark has it without getting billed. And I guess that's the way most of us like it. So while there may be more American babies that Danish babies born with taxes paying for their birth I'm just going to have to point out that there is a greater percentage of Danish, or pretty much any European country's, babies worn without the parents paying a relatively large fee for the privilege.
  - kasey_junk 8y ago
    Look, I’m not some anti single payer guy. In fact given the option I’d bet on it being the best of the options. But it’s just untrue that you paid $0 to have a kid. You don’t know how much you paid & that’s ok. But it’s a valid criticism of single payer. Further it is also true that the US system has deep flaws but it’s fundamentally untrue that the many Americans get the full boat costs of a birth. So comparing your $0 cost & a $15k outlier is largely a futile excercise.
    - bryanrasmussen 8y ago
      The article says that people in the U.S are not having children because of prohibitive costs, 15000 dollar bill from a hospital was mentioned somewhere. Various Europeans said they paid 0 in their country, somebody said that even in Europe you pay and the cost is approximately the same (the implication being that you pay a bill, not a tax) which is quite the lie and prompted me to join the people saying hey, we pay 0 (implying not getting a big bill all of a sudden that you might not be able to afford at that particular moment) I'm pretty sure every other person reading my initial comment understood huh, the government pays for it and he pays his taxes. But you seemed to need to make a gotcha argument about it which again, given how human conversation is structured and the literal impossibility of defining everything down to constituent atoms in every communication it is generally assumed that people in good faith take some things as given which is why in response to your taxes comment I was sarcastic because who among us is so lightheaded that they don't understand taxes exist and are used to pay for things the government provides us? I don't think the people who upvoted the comment thought I had made a brilliant refutation of your point about taxes, I think they just thought what is this guy with taxes on about - because that's not what the point under discussion is and you would have to be rather obtuse to think it was. That's ok, I certainly have my own issues that I am thickheaded about, but really people do know taxes pay for the births in European hospitals. As to whether it is fundamentally untrue that many Americans get the full boat costs of a birth, I don't know. I do know the article seemed to think they were getting enough of a boat that they were sinking. Hence all of us Europeans saying, he we're doing swell with the kids and all started up. I don't think that's such a futile exercise.
tptacek 8y ago
Please be more civil. And notice that you've contradicted yourself; you said upthread "you pay 0", and now are clarifying the mechanism you use to pay a nonzero amount of dollars for it.
- bryanrasmussen 8y ago
  I believe I was the appropriate level of civil given the context, so I shan't be more.