4 ms·

That ain't true at all, there are tons of options in Europe where you can hide, well anything. UK has their own Channel islands, for various purposes you have L

That ain't true at all, there are tons of options in Europe where you can hide, well anything. UK has their own Channel islands, for various purposes you have Luxembourg, Malta, Switzerland, Monaco and so on. You only need to be resident on paper, never physically set a foot there. Every politician, tax attorney/advisor or tax collector knows this, if they claim they don't they are lying to your face (or are utterly incompetent). Why do you think normal flat in Monaco costs up to 20+ million eur? It is a nice place, but not THAT nice (In MCO case you need only postbox which can be rented cheaply as many professional athletes do... unless you are French citizen, then you are screwed but can go elsewhere)

graeme 8y ago
Hide legally, or hide illegally? Pratchett may have been referring to legal methods only.
- saiya-jin 8y ago
  Of course its legal by laws of the place where it happens. That's why EU has some issue with some of its members like Ireland, or Luxembourg. Hiding usually means just avoiding paying most of the income taxes (ie 5% instead of 40% or even much more in places like Scandinavia). In most countries, tax brackets for really high incomes are just ridiculously high, so everybody seeks to pay less taxes while staying legal. Taxes are a sinkhole from rich payer's perspective - you get back very little and you pay a lot. It's like expecting common Joe not claiming some tax breaks he is entitled to. Why on earth would he not do it?
  - roel_v 8y ago
    No offense, but you don't sound like you know what you're talking about if you don't even seem to understand the difference between 'tax avoidance' and 'tax evasion' (or at least your posts and answers give off the vibe that you're just throwing them all on the same pile of 'paying less taxes, somehow').
    - saiya-jin 8y ago
      I am commenting only on tax avoidance (legal optimization), not tax evasion (illegal, don't know much about that). What exactly is untrue in my posts? Happy to learn more. My posts are quite generic for the topic, since we're on public internet forum but they come from my knowledge on this topic (which might be obviously invalid).
heavenlyblue 8y ago
>> resident on paper Not true for Monaco. They will go to such lengths as watching the CCTV footage that had been recorded of you in order to see if you are actually present in the country.
- saiya-jin 8y ago
  Well, then how come most of olympic athletes from my home country have permanent(=tax) residence there? I can guarantee you they are not living there at all, nor do they rent any real apartment (which is 20k+ eur/month unless you are a Monaco citizen). As I said if you are French citizen all this tax haven sugar isn't valid for you, Monaco banks will report you to French authorities, but for rest of the world it works (unless something dramatically changed in last year or two).
  - heavenlyblue 8y ago
    So it is for the UK. I am actually not sure about the exact details, but the change happened one or two years ago.
s3nnyy 8y ago
> "You only need to be resident on paper, never physically set a foot there." Not true for Switzerland: You have to be 6 months per year here to officially / taxwise "live here". Otherwise, you lose your permit. The same is true for Singapore, I believe.
- saiya-jin 8y ago
  You're right, I've listed various European tax havens and made a blank statement which is true only for some of those. I don't claim to know intricate details of each of those, but even as an relative outsider these things are not exactly top secret. It was and most probably still is true for Monaco for example. If you come as an outsider to Suisse, private banks/tax companies will either refer you to their branch in place where this applies to you, or if your net worth is high enough (can't remember exact threshold but it should be in 5 mil CHF ballpark and above), you can literally buy citizenship and you're covered (ideally in Zug/Luzern as one can witness in local property market there but it always depends on the case).
  - s3nnyy 8y ago
    No, you CAN NOT buy citizenship in Switzerland, not even in Zug. You can however get a permit to stay that is renewed every year, if you're wealthy (defined as: sustain life here without the need of work). The threshold is way lower than 5 million and is decided case-by-case.
- hyperpape 8y ago
  In the case of Puerto Rico, it's apparently the case that you can land your jet there, refuel, step outside, and count that as a day on the island: https://www.gq.com/story/how-puerto-rico-became-tax-haven-for-super-rich https://www.gq.com/story/how-puerto-rico-became-tax-haven-fo....
  - Scoundreller 8y ago
    There must be a lot of demand for flights that leave at 12:30AM for the mainland and return at 11:00PM (just in case there's a delay).

graeme 8y ago

Hide legally, or hide illegally? Pratchett may have been referring to legal methods only.

saiya-jin 8y ago
Of course its legal by laws of the place where it happens. That's why EU has some issue with some of its members like Ireland, or Luxembourg. Hiding usually means just avoiding paying most of the income taxes (ie 5% instead of 40% or even much more in places like Scandinavia). In most countries, tax brackets for really high incomes are just ridiculously high, so everybody seeks to pay less taxes while staying legal. Taxes are a sinkhole from rich payer's perspective - you get back very little and you pay a lot. It's like expecting common Joe not claiming some tax breaks he is entitled to. Why on earth would he not do it?
- roel_v 8y ago
  No offense, but you don't sound like you know what you're talking about if you don't even seem to understand the difference between 'tax avoidance' and 'tax evasion' (or at least your posts and answers give off the vibe that you're just throwing them all on the same pile of 'paying less taxes, somehow').
  - saiya-jin 8y ago
    I am commenting only on tax avoidance (legal optimization), not tax evasion (illegal, don't know much about that). What exactly is untrue in my posts? Happy to learn more. My posts are quite generic for the topic, since we're on public internet forum but they come from my knowledge on this topic (which might be obviously invalid).

heavenlyblue 8y ago

>> resident on paper Not true for Monaco. They will go to such lengths as watching the CCTV footage that had been recorded of you in order to see if you are actually present in the country.

saiya-jin 8y ago
Well, then how come most of olympic athletes from my home country have permanent(=tax) residence there? I can guarantee you they are not living there at all, nor do they rent any real apartment (which is 20k+ eur/month unless you are a Monaco citizen). As I said if you are French citizen all this tax haven sugar isn't valid for you, Monaco banks will report you to French authorities, but for rest of the world it works (unless something dramatically changed in last year or two).
- heavenlyblue 8y ago
  So it is for the UK. I am actually not sure about the exact details, but the change happened one or two years ago.

s3nnyy 8y ago

> "You only need to be resident on paper, never physically set a foot there." Not true for Switzerland: You have to be 6 months per year here to officially / taxwise "live here". Otherwise, you lose your permit. The same is true for Singapore, I believe.

saiya-jin 8y ago
You're right, I've listed various European tax havens and made a blank statement which is true only for some of those. I don't claim to know intricate details of each of those, but even as an relative outsider these things are not exactly top secret. It was and most probably still is true for Monaco for example. If you come as an outsider to Suisse, private banks/tax companies will either refer you to their branch in place where this applies to you, or if your net worth is high enough (can't remember exact threshold but it should be in 5 mil CHF ballpark and above), you can literally buy citizenship and you're covered (ideally in Zug/Luzern as one can witness in local property market there but it always depends on the case).
- s3nnyy 8y ago
  No, you CAN NOT buy citizenship in Switzerland, not even in Zug. You can however get a permit to stay that is renewed every year, if you're wealthy (defined as: sustain life here without the need of work). The threshold is way lower than 5 million and is decided case-by-case.
hyperpape 8y ago
In the case of Puerto Rico, it's apparently the case that you can land your jet there, refuel, step outside, and count that as a day on the island: https://www.gq.com/story/how-puerto-rico-became-tax-haven-for-super-rich https://www.gq.com/story/how-puerto-rico-became-tax-haven-fo....
- Scoundreller 8y ago
  There must be a lot of demand for flights that leave at 12:30AM for the mainland and return at 11:00PM (just in case there's a delay).