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The Dutch Reach: A No-Tech Way to Save Bicyclists’ Lives

noobermin 8y ago
While I generally think things like this article are great and helpful, I think incentivizing individual behavior changes is a good way to distract from actual changes that will make cities more liveable: actual infrastructure and road and transit changes. That's the real answer to all of this. The unsafe nature of many cities especially in the US is a systemic problem, not just a personal behavior problem.
- btrettel 8y ago
  It's both an infrastructure and driver behavior problem. As a daily transportation cyclist for about 10 years, I know from experience that much bike infrastructure in the US is more safety theater than actual safety improvements. Infrastructure makes cyclists feel safer, but it can amplify certain problems to the point where it might be making the roads less safe. There are two cycletracks near where I work in Austin. I almost never ride on either, mostly because many drivers turn into them at intersections without looking. The city put up many signs to say to yield to cyclists, but these have had no effect best I can tell. I'd much rather take the lane and be seen. This is counterintuitive to many people, particularly non-cyclists, but the evidence I've seen in my daily life is overwhelming. These types of crashes are often called "right hooks" and they are well known to experienced cyclists. Add on top of that the unsafe passes from drivers. Add the distracted driving. Add the speeding. Add the illegal parking in the bike lane (even protected lanes). Add the tailgating. Add the abuse from thankfully a far smaller number of people than any of the mentioned problems. It's clear to me that both infrastructure and behavior changes are needed.
mturmon 8y ago
Same concept, very thoroughly discussed two years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 -- with plenty of tangential bike shedding as HN does with bike articles. Including the observation (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12675829 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12675829) that the "Dutch Reach" is perhaps not universally known in Holland.
dep_b 8y ago
I'm always using the Dutch Mirror which is that shiny reflective thing attached to the driver's door which I cleverly abuse to see if something is coming from behind before I get out of the car. I've been testing it a lot in The Netherlands. Nobody died so far so it must work but YMMV. -- edit: I have a Dutch driver's license and definitely would've known about it.
- k__ 8y ago
  In Germany you have to do a look over your left shoulder, because that mirror isn't enough to see when bikes/vehicles are left of you.
  - dep_b 8y ago
    It doesn't harm but just watching at all really helps. I usually wait a few seconds before opening the door. Actually more concerned about other cars driving off my door, Dutch streets tend to be more narrow to begin with.
  - Kim_Bruning 8y ago
    Was in germany today on the autobahn as a "Nur Links" driver. (ok, and maybe a bit of rechts, but I have to keep up the reputation, right?) ... It definitely pays to keep an eye on the left mirror and shoulder. Even at 200 km/h, it's almost guaranteed that there will be someone lurking there going MUCH faster than you.
- mattlondon 8y ago
  You need to also check the "blind spot" (1) which is big enough to lose a truck in let alone a cyclist. 1 - https://duckduckgo.com/?q=car+blind+spots&t=brave&ia=images&iax=images https://duckduckgo.com/?q=car+blind+spots&t=brave&ia=images&...
  - CharlesW 8y ago
    Years ago I started using this technique to set up my mirrors to minimize that. Highly recommended. [Single-page PDF] https://www.cartalk.com/sites/default/files/features/mirrors/CarTalkMirrors.pdf https://www.cartalk.com/sites/default/files/features/mirrors...
Theodores 8y ago
When the Dutch were rolling out the education programme to get motorists to unlock their seat belts in this special cyclist-conscious way that the American public were getting airbags. The original premise of the airbag was that motorists would not need seat belts, that the airbag would kick into action and save the day: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag#As_a_substitute_to_seat_belts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag#As_a_substitute_to_seat... This is quite indicative of cultural differences, almost comically so. The Dutch are going in the direction of being grown adults, caring and being responsible. Meanwhile, in the land of the mighty dollar, the car dependent consumers are not even expected to look out for themselves.
- dang 8y ago
  Nationalistic swipes will get you banned here, regardless of which nations you favor or disfavor. Please refrain from posting like this in the future. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
BurningFrog 8y ago
Seems like one more sensor on my car could do this far better.
deleted 8y ago
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eecc 8y ago
In Italy you’ll also fail your driving exam if you don’t reach with your right.
stretchwithme 8y ago
Training is great but making it impossible is better. Blind spot detection systems need to evolve the ability to keep the door closed when something is rapidly approaching a door.
- stouset 8y ago
  And then that technology needs more technology to ensure that it doesn’t accidentally disallow egress in an emergency, or misfire due to a bad sensor and keep the door permanently shut.
  - stretchwithme 8y ago
    Yes, that's important too. Such a system shouldn't work at all when there's no power. I imagine that can be accomplished with a mechanism that has to have power to stay in a position that interferes with opening the door. What happens when power fails is pretty important. What happens to an automated vehicle when that happens, for example? If there's no driver, they'll a mechanical brake that isn't used whenever power IS available. When power fails, it would engage. More to your point, I've heard the Tesla Model 3 rear doors can't be opened from inside when power is lost in an accident. That could be a serious problem in an accident. Maybe they've fixed that or will soon. They will definitely fix it before I would purchase one.
  - stretchwithme 8y ago
    Toyota's safety system has some detection of cyclists in front of a vehicle. I just asked them on FB if there are any plans to implement anything to help keep passing cyclists safe.
emptybits 8y ago
The Dutch Reach is a reach to ask for, IMO. I write this as a cyclist living in Vancouver (one city named in the article) who has been doored and nearly doored. IME, shoulder checks while actually driving seem to be a dying art form. So asking for a while-parked check like the Dutch Reach ... seems optimistic. But no harm in trying. The illustration is great. I applaud all efforts to make this technique more known. Fellow cyclists, you already know this, but please watch sideview mirrors of parked vehicles and all other signs of people and passengers and assume the worst. Infrastructure should, IMO, allow an extra foot or two in lane designs especially when they are adjacent to different users (i.e. motorist, cyclist, pedestrian). This allows for swervy cyclists, swervy motorists, bad parkers, and people "not from here" a safety buffer. The latter group is one you're just not going to ever reach with urban education like the article, yet they are a significant vehicular presence in a many popular cities, whether they're driving their own vehicles, an unfamiliar rental, or getting out of a taxi cab. I'll give an example. All infrastructure design decisions have pros and cons. Here's a style of bike lane on the "passenger" side that catches motorists off guard (when they park too far to the right, near the lane) and passengers off guard because neither expect to find a cyclist on their right. https://www.google.ca/maps/@49.2790648,-123.1195244,3a,75y,214.64h,71.34t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7rZLbmXvAV0-H9ApXRwRcg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 https://www.google.ca/maps/@49.2790648,-123.1195244,3a,75y,2... How about some opening-door-tech that alerts you quickly and loudly when an object approaches your door as you begin to swing it open? Good for passing traffic, bicycles, etc. BTW, I appreciate that cycling news shows up on HN from time to time. It's truly a civilized activity and IMO has an important role in the future of cities. Keep pedalling. :-)
- Gibbon1 8y ago
  A similar thing near where I live. They took out a lane, put in a turn median turn lane and a bike lane. And kept the on street parking. When it would have been much safer to just get rid of the on street parking. https://goo.gl/maps/736bR7HMats https://goo.gl/maps/736bR7HMats Edit: When I was in Taipei years ago they had dedicated lanes and over passes for Scooters. My thought is relatively roads for scooters and bicycles are really cheap. Another memory is when they built the highway 85 extension in the 90's bicyclists started using it in large numbers before it was open to traffic. That leaves me with the impression that the biggest impediment to getting people to ride bicycles is having to mix it up with auto traffic.
js2 8y ago
I'm a runner. Out of habit I usually run against traffic even when on the sidewalk. I'd be happy if drivers making a right out of a side street/driveway/parking lot would just come to a full stop behind the crosswalk and check to their right. Many drivers don't check to their right, or for that matter even come to a full stop when turning right. There isn't a single run I go on that I don't encounter at least one car rolling through a right. Running on the opposite sidewalk so that I'm running with traffic is no safer because then I have to look over my left shoulder at every crosswalk to make sure a car making a right off the main street isn't about to run me over as I enter a crosswalk. In summary: many drivers suck, don't follow the law, and self-driving cars can't get here soon enough.
- notacoward 8y ago
  Amen. I'll just add that sometimes part of the blame should also go to the planners who set up intersections with odd angles and obstructed sight lines so that drivers can't see anything until they're already intruding into the roadway. Related phenomenon: pedestrian crossings and cutouts placed twenty feet down a side street. Yeah, it might be further from the busier street, but it makes it much harder for either party to see each other or recognize each others' intentions. Ultimately quite bad for safety, even for regular pedestrians but especially for runners. No thanks. I'll stay out where I can see them and they can see me and there's no ambiguity about which direction I'm going, even if that means hopping on and off curbs.
rgj 8y ago
I'm Dutch. I've never heard of this, nor has anybody I asked about this. I've never even seen someone in the driver's seat use their right hand to open the door. Dooring is not an issue here either since Dutch cyclists tend to anticipate very well. What we do have here in the Netherlands are bike lanes, so in a lot of places the bikes pass the parked/stopping cars on the right hand side.
- themodelplumber 8y ago
  There are a lot of idioms in U.S. English which contain the word "dutch" but which are not recognizable to actual Dutch people. Some of these will come from e.g. stereotyped interactions with the Pennsylvania Dutch, etc.
  - twblalock 8y ago
    This particular "dutch reach" idiom is not related to the Pennsylvania Dutch in any way.
    - Symbiote 8y ago
      None of the "Dutch" idioms will be from Pennsylvania Dutch, they all come from being the neighbour country to England.
      - laurentl 8y ago
        Ireland?
      - NeedMoreTea 8y ago
        Pennsylvanian "Dutch" is a corruption of "Deutsche", and the community German is it not? As I understood it many of American "Dutch" idioms were originally meant to be referencing German. You do get cookie from Dutch though. Cookie comes from the Dutch keokje.
        stevesimmons 8y ago
twblalock 8y ago
This "Dutch reach" thing is an example of a phenomenon I've seen several times before. People who promote a practice seem to think their argument will be more persuasive if the practice came from an admired foreign country, yet the people who live in that country have never heard of it and/or do not commonly do it. In this case it's the Dutch, but I've seen all kinds of similar nonsense about Japan.
- wool_gather 8y ago
  The article explains clearly that it is a thing in the Netherlands; it's a standard part of driver education there. > “It’s just what Dutch people do,” said Fred Wegman, professor emeritus of Traffic Safety at Delft University of Technology and the former managing director of the National Institute for Road Safety Research SWOV in the Netherlands. “All Dutch are taught it. It’s part of regular driver education.”
  - holstvoogd 8y ago
    weird, I wasn't, never heard of anyone who has. i should ask some colleagues if they were taught it.
    - wool_gather 8y ago
      Interesting; perhaps this Traffic Safety professor does not have a realistic view of driving instruction. I.e., it's part of the official curriculum but not actually taught?
      - rocqua 8y ago
        There is a theory test to a drivers license as well. It's never mentioned there. If it is a part of testing, it is probably a generic line 'Be mindful when getting out of the car'. Perhaps some instructors teach the 'dutch reach' as a trick for that. There are many such heuristics that are taught. For example, family of me was advised to wear contacts instead of glasses for the test because the legs of the glasses could block the instructors view of the eyes. Apparently, they want to see you check all angles.
sologoub 8y ago
Relying on an uncomfortable behavior change is one option, but as many have noted - really a “reach”. Why don’t we instead take the experience of cities that instead of trying to integrate cars and cyclists, integrated cyclists and pedestrians? Physics are more on your side here - a lot closer weight and size of objects. Possibly even closer speed differential. On a recent trip to Munich, the clear markings and cyclists on a protected wide sidewalk made a lot more sense. With cars and bikes sharing the narrow city roads, doorings are only one problem. Even side view mirrors can be a hazzard. It’s more costly to have wider side walks, but it’s so much safer!
- mkingston 8y ago
  Many cyclists travel quickly enough they find that having to give way at every side road (like a pedestrian would) is a tremendous hassle. If these routes were unbroken (as they are in a few places) this would be a great solution.
  - sologoub 8y ago
    That’s definitely possible, but in most cities cross-traffic is a reality for cars and pedestrians alike. Cyclists and now electric scooters often run the stop signs, lights, etc. it’s debatable what’s safer for them, but for everyone around it becomes not just a “hassle” but a real hazard.
- toast0 8y ago
  As a bike commuter in a city environment, I'd rather be near cars than mix with pedestrians. Cars are more predictable, and move at closer speeds through downtown. Out of congested areas, where cars are going much faster than me, I like being farther away. At times, I do ride on the sidewalk because of road design or convenience, and it requires a much slower pace if there are pedestrians nearby.
  - sologoub 8y ago
    Look up Munich- dedicated lanes for bikes, but on the side walk, so no mixing.
paulmatthijs 8y ago
Sorry to be a party pooper, but this is a non-existing thing (and a repost, btw). It’s true that we are taught to look over your shoulder when opening a car door, but to label it “the Dutch Reach” is really too much honor. It’s just common sense.
rocqua 8y ago
I'm dutch, and I've only ever heard about this on the internet, never here. Notably, I don't recall this whilst getting my driving license only 2 years ago. To check, I got my theory book. It says the following: > After the part about doing visual checks > When it is visually safe, hold the door handle with the left hand, and open the door using the right hand as far as is necessary and exit the vehicle. So it explicitly states that one should grab the door handle with the left hand, not the right. Moreover, one should check visually (using mirrors and an over the shoulder check) before doing 'the reach') I can't find the year of publishing, but it seems quite old, 2005-ish. The ISBN is: 978-90-72967-03-9 (26th printing) The original dutch: > Als het veilig is houdt u met uw linkerhand aan de handgreep het portier vast en opent u met uw rechterhand het portier zover als u nodig hebt en stapt uit.
- kbenson 8y ago
  > After the part about doing visual checks > When it is visually safe, hold the door handle with the left hand, and open the door using the right hand as far as is necessary and exit the vehicle. That is the Dutch reach, to my understanding. 99% Invisible did a story on it a couple years ago, and that was covered here.[1] 600 comments. 1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533
  - blattimwind 8y ago
    No. The dutch reach is with the right hand, which forces you to turn the upper body to reach the handle. Supposedly this sort-of forces you to do a over the shoulder check. I think if you were taught proper driving technique, then there is no need for such concortions. You will always check the mirror and look over your shoulder before opening the door, even if only subconsciously. Just like you always check lengthwise traffic before making a turn, or checking traffic behind you before switching into another lane. This is an issue of driver's education. Not which hand you use to open the door.
    - Kim_Bruning 8y ago
      I think it also depends on whether you have auto-folding mirrors. (I was taught to check my rear-view mirror before opening the door. That doesn't work in my new car with folding mirrors; so now I sometimes use the dutch reach, even though I was never taught it back in the day)
afarrell 8y ago
The door handle of some models of the Mini Cooper affords doing the Dutch Reach. It is a circle with a shelf that faces forward in a way that makes it awkward to use the hand nearest the door to open. So, you reach across your body with your other hand and in doing so, you turn your body and head and your peripheral vision can catch a moving cyclist.
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moron4hire 8y ago
I don't need to awkwardly reach across my body to remember to check for traffic before exiting my car after parallel parking. Here's what I do. I pop my door open an inch, just crack the seam, to give people behind me a signal that I'm exiting. Once the door is ajar, I do my check to see if the way is clear. As much as you should be worried about dooring a cyclist, you should be worried about getting cracked in the skull by your own door should a bus clip it.
jernfrost 8y ago
I think the key to safety for bikers in the Netherlands is simply the sheer number of them. When you visit the Netherlands. Within 15 minutes you have gotten used to scanning for bikers everywhere. There are so many of them and they come so frequently that you cannot not get into the habit of looking for them. The importance of numbers is something often overlooked. I read an article discussing the different approaches to biking the Netherlands and my native Norway has. Here in Norway we are obsessed with bike helmets. The dutch never use helmets. Yet we have more head injuries in Norway for bikers. So the number of bikers in the Netherlands seem to create a better protection for bikers than the usage of helmets. And here is the kicker: If you don't demand that people use helmets when biking, the number of bikers will rise to a level, where the number of injuries will be lower than if everybody used helmet. That is what the research suggested anyway. I will probably still use a helmet in Norway due to the terrain, but it is still food for thought I think.
- agumonkey 8y ago
  Cultural importance too. When so many people you may know are bikers, including you, you might empathize a lot more with them rather than see them as anonymous frail annoyances to pass.
  - BrandoElFollito 8y ago
    This is a good point. When I turn right I always check my right mirror. This is not something I was specifically taught, this is something I do because I also bike a lot and am often on the bike lane on the right. (yes, the design of the lens is such that this should not be an issue but a lot of cyclists will still stupidly cross the crosding instead of following the U shaped path)
    - ambentzen 8y ago
      You where NOT taught to check that you are not turning into/across some one? WTH? When doing a maneuver you check your mirror AND turn your head. If you are not taught this I shudder to think what else where left out of your so-called drivers education.
huskyr 8y ago
Like many people already mentioned in this thread, it's silly to attribute bike safety in the Netherlands to just this. To get a better view on why bike safety is so much better here, i think this video really explains it very well in five minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2THe_10dYs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2THe_10dYs. The other videos are very much worth the watch as well.
anotherevan 8y ago
I've gone through bouts of trying to adopt this habit. One thing that makes it harder is that the door handle in my car is designed to make it easy to open with the door-side hand. It is forwards on the door (near the hinged end) and opens by pulling the handle back. If the handle was at the back of the door it would promote the habit as it would actually be easier to open the door by reaching across with the opposite hand then try to scrunch your door-side arm back to get at the handle. I wonder where the door handles are located in the majority of cars in Holland.
- jorams 8y ago
  > I wonder where the door handles are located in the majority of cars in Holland. The hinged end, just like yours.
jariz 8y ago
Every time a article like this is posted I'm just flabbergasted at the fact that 'looking behind you before actually opening a door' is such a foreign concept to Americans.
- Kim_Bruning 8y ago
  I don't even care about the cyclists[1]; I'll survive being hit by them }:-)>. It's the other motorized traffic I'm worried about! [1] I actually do. Maybe it'll be me someday. But for the sake of argument let's pretend.
- blattimwind 8y ago
  My impression is that driving education in the US is rather lacking overall, though it's of course not federalized, so there are probably fifty shades of deficiency. (That being said many driving schools here suck as well, though that's mostly a money drain for the driving students; 40 % or so failure rate in the practical exam).
  - ant512 8y ago
    I've got a British driving license and an American driving license. The British driving license was hard work. The American driving license involved little more than proving I could make the car go forwards and that I had a pulse. There's really a 40% failure rate? That's insane given how easy it is to pass the test.
    - blattimwind 8y ago
      I remembered it wrong, it's 36 % for the theoretical and 28 % for the practical exam. https://www.kba.de/DE/Statistik/Kraftfahrer/Fahrerlaubnisse/Fahrerlaubnispruefungen/fe_p_zeitreihe.html?nn=651942 https://www.kba.de/DE/Statistik/Kraftfahrer/Fahrerlaubnisse/...
u801e 8y ago
Another no-tech way would be to repeal the keep as far right as practicable law that specifically applies to bicycles so that they have, by default, the right to the entire lane they're in. Then the general slow vehicle law would apply (meaning that one uses the rightmost lane available for traffic unless passing another vehicle or preparing to make a left turn).
frereubu 8y ago
When riding in London a few years ago I came off my bike when a car driver - who hadn't seen me - turned across the road in front of me. I slammed on my brakes, and went over the handlebars only a few inches before hitting the car. I landed on the road with my hip and my head whiplashed over into the road. If I hadn't been wearing a helmet I would undoubtedly have fractured my skull, and possible worse. Since then I've been a vocal proponent of helmets - in London - because this accident was nothing to do with my riding. I had a front light on, a reflective vest and light-coloured clothing. The real issue for me is cycling infrastructure. London is getting sort-of better. There are cycle "superhighways", but they're quite narrow and have their fair share of idiot cyclists who ride very fast and loose, and make it dangerous for other cyclists. If there was better infrastructure there might be a critical mass of more sedate cyclists who set the tone for cycling in general, so everyone takes account of that new paradigm. Until that happens, I don't think there's a good safe way of cycling in somewhere like London without a helmet.
- bamboozled 8y ago
  Sorry to hear about your accident. May I ask how fast were you going when this happened? I don't wear a helmet when commuting but I also rarely exceed 20km/h to avoid the exact kind of collision you just described. I have to say a helmet will help when going over the bars, but you could've just as easily been critically injured in other ways, such as breaking your neck, rupturing an artery etc. One thing you notice about cyclists and cars in Amsterdam is that everyone goes quite slowly and with a fairly high level of awareness.
  - buschkowitz 8y ago
    You want to wear a helmet. The risk-reward ratio is highly in favor of wearing one. What is the burden of wearing one vs. having some protection in case you fly?
    - Xylakant 8y ago
      Do you wear helmet while driving a car? What’s the burden of wearing one vs. having some protection in case you have an accident? Car drivers are much more likely to die of head injuries than cyclists. Do you also wear a helmet while walking, especially in winter? What’s the burden of wearing one vs. having some protection in case you slip and fall? Why don’t we do that? Because while the burden is low - it’s mostly dragging the helmet around wherever you go and ruining your hardcut - the actual probability it might help is quite low. And with good infrastructure, the same is true for cycling. If you look at this years stats for causes of death for cyclists in Berlin for example, the leading cause is “crushed by a truck”. Note: if you do cycling for sports at high speeds or rough terrain: wear a helmet.
innomatics 8y ago
It would be wonderful if car makers could position the interior door latches to make this the natural way to open the door. E.g. just under the window near the pillar.
rhizome31 8y ago
If you think about it, it's crazy that personal motorized vehicles are allowed in cities. I mean, with the amount of petty legislation that we endure without thinking about it twice, having those huge noisy and smelly masses of metal moving freely in our streets is a bit insane.
dpezely 8y ago
While drivers may remember to "reach across your body" with opposite arm because they're in driving-mode, passengers probably won't-- from personal observation. Specifically, this is from experience involving a passenger door opening into a curb-side bicycle lane. The door opened before the car came to a complete stop and quite a ways back from the intersection. The car was still compressing front springs from braking when passenger door opened. (Enough other posts here today described what happened next.) Since then, I wear bold red striped shirts or jackets when riding and red helmet. When they found "Where's Waldo" (or "Where's Wally" for those from UK), I know that they've seen me, and that's the whole point. I've used this very successfully in my present home of Vancouver, BC. Previously, it also worked well when residing in SF and Seattle. There was a confirmed Waldo sighting near English Bay just yesterday, but now you can call me by my real name.
blunte 8y ago
I've spent time with Dutch drivers in cars in the country, and I have never seen them do this "Dutch reach". I like the idea, but I'm not convinced that it's really a thing here.
mirimir 8y ago
It's not just cyclists that hit opening motor vehicle doors. If nothing else, looking first is just self-preservation.
mcv 8y ago
Does anyone else have the problem that nytimes.com articles remove themselves after loading? I can see the content for about a second, and then it vanishes. Probably related to my browser settings, but this is the only site that does it.
- mclehman 8y ago
  I do as well, but only when using a browser embedded in my HN app (Materialistic). It's persisted during my Chrome -> Brave transition, so I'll be giving Firefox a try to see if that makes a difference.
  - mcv 8y ago
    I've googled a bit and found more people who had this problem with Chrome. Sadly their solution (anonymous mode) doesn't fix the problem for me.
bastijn 8y ago
In NL this is not common either. This is not what keeps us safe. We use the mirror like any other country (but we do not forget). This topic has reached FP before. Original article and comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533
- danieldk 8y ago
  We use the mirror like any other country (but we do not forget). Except that passengers in the back seats do not have mirrors. Although I never learned the Dutch Reach (but I don't have a driver's license), my dad always warned us as a kid that we should check for cyclists before opening the door.
  - rejschaap 8y ago
    The rear doors in my car can't open from the inside for the kid's safety. I always check the mirror on the passenger side and will ask my passenger to wait when necessary. My mother-in-law is notorious for throwing the door open wide without looking (often hitting parked cars). She can't be taught so I just put her on the back seat now. I live in an area where the parking spots are on the left side of the road. I don't know how common it is for Dutch people to check the mirror for the passengers door. Maybe it just depends on your mother-in-law.
  - bastijn 8y ago
    Indeed. They can turn around or the driver signals to wait. Anyway, point is, Dutch reach is despite its name not a common thing in NL.
atoav 8y ago
During my driving test (rural countryside of Austria, after 2000) not doing the "Dutch Reach" could decide about fail or pass. Now I live in a bigger city and cycle every day and I wish this was common practice. As a cyclist you have to treat the typical motorist like an idiot with no perception of their surrounding and no knowledge of traffic rules. Sadly the same is true also for cyclists (especially with sunday-nice-weather-cyclists).
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Doxin 8y ago
Another good trick is to pop the door before swinging it open. Pull the door handle so it pops out of the lock, but wait a second or two before actually opening it. This alerts any cyclists you might have missed that you're about to open the door.

While I generally think things like this article are great and helpful, I think incentivizing individual behavior changes is a good way to distract from actual changes that will make cities more liveable: actual infrastructure and road and transit changes. That's the real answer to all of this. The unsafe nature of many cities especially in the US is a systemic problem, not just a personal behavior problem.

btrettel 8y ago
It's both an infrastructure and driver behavior problem. As a daily transportation cyclist for about 10 years, I know from experience that much bike infrastructure in the US is more safety theater than actual safety improvements. Infrastructure makes cyclists feel safer, but it can amplify certain problems to the point where it might be making the roads less safe. There are two cycletracks near where I work in Austin. I almost never ride on either, mostly because many drivers turn into them at intersections without looking. The city put up many signs to say to yield to cyclists, but these have had no effect best I can tell. I'd much rather take the lane and be seen. This is counterintuitive to many people, particularly non-cyclists, but the evidence I've seen in my daily life is overwhelming. These types of crashes are often called "right hooks" and they are well known to experienced cyclists. Add on top of that the unsafe passes from drivers. Add the distracted driving. Add the speeding. Add the illegal parking in the bike lane (even protected lanes). Add the tailgating. Add the abuse from thankfully a far smaller number of people than any of the mentioned problems. It's clear to me that both infrastructure and behavior changes are needed.

mturmon 8y ago

Same concept, very thoroughly discussed two years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 -- with plenty of tangential bike shedding as HN does with bike articles. Including the observation (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12675829 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12675829) that the "Dutch Reach" is perhaps not universally known in Holland.

dep_b 8y ago

I'm always using the Dutch Mirror which is that shiny reflective thing attached to the driver's door which I cleverly abuse to see if something is coming from behind before I get out of the car. I've been testing it a lot in The Netherlands. Nobody died so far so it must work but YMMV. -- edit: I have a Dutch driver's license and definitely would've known about it.

k__ 8y ago
In Germany you have to do a look over your left shoulder, because that mirror isn't enough to see when bikes/vehicles are left of you.
- dep_b 8y ago
  It doesn't harm but just watching at all really helps. I usually wait a few seconds before opening the door. Actually more concerned about other cars driving off my door, Dutch streets tend to be more narrow to begin with.
- Kim_Bruning 8y ago
  Was in germany today on the autobahn as a "Nur Links" driver. (ok, and maybe a bit of rechts, but I have to keep up the reputation, right?) ... It definitely pays to keep an eye on the left mirror and shoulder. Even at 200 km/h, it's almost guaranteed that there will be someone lurking there going MUCH faster than you.
mattlondon 8y ago
You need to also check the "blind spot" (1) which is big enough to lose a truck in let alone a cyclist. 1 - https://duckduckgo.com/?q=car+blind+spots&t=brave&ia=images&iax=images https://duckduckgo.com/?q=car+blind+spots&t=brave&ia=images&...
- CharlesW 8y ago
  Years ago I started using this technique to set up my mirrors to minimize that. Highly recommended. [Single-page PDF] https://www.cartalk.com/sites/default/files/features/mirrors/CarTalkMirrors.pdf https://www.cartalk.com/sites/default/files/features/mirrors...

Theodores 8y ago

When the Dutch were rolling out the education programme to get motorists to unlock their seat belts in this special cyclist-conscious way that the American public were getting airbags. The original premise of the airbag was that motorists would not need seat belts, that the airbag would kick into action and save the day: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag#As_a_substitute_to_seat_belts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag#As_a_substitute_to_seat... This is quite indicative of cultural differences, almost comically so. The Dutch are going in the direction of being grown adults, caring and being responsible. Meanwhile, in the land of the mighty dollar, the car dependent consumers are not even expected to look out for themselves.

dang 8y ago
Nationalistic swipes will get you banned here, regardless of which nations you favor or disfavor. Please refrain from posting like this in the future. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

BurningFrog 8y ago

Seems like one more sensor on my car could do this far better.

deleted 8y ago

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eecc 8y ago

In Italy you’ll also fail your driving exam if you don’t reach with your right.

stretchwithme 8y ago

Training is great but making it impossible is better. Blind spot detection systems need to evolve the ability to keep the door closed when something is rapidly approaching a door.

stouset 8y ago
And then that technology needs more technology to ensure that it doesn’t accidentally disallow egress in an emergency, or misfire due to a bad sensor and keep the door permanently shut.
- stretchwithme 8y ago
  Yes, that's important too. Such a system shouldn't work at all when there's no power. I imagine that can be accomplished with a mechanism that has to have power to stay in a position that interferes with opening the door. What happens when power fails is pretty important. What happens to an automated vehicle when that happens, for example? If there's no driver, they'll a mechanical brake that isn't used whenever power IS available. When power fails, it would engage. More to your point, I've heard the Tesla Model 3 rear doors can't be opened from inside when power is lost in an accident. That could be a serious problem in an accident. Maybe they've fixed that or will soon. They will definitely fix it before I would purchase one.
- stretchwithme 8y ago
  Toyota's safety system has some detection of cyclists in front of a vehicle. I just asked them on FB if there are any plans to implement anything to help keep passing cyclists safe.

emptybits 8y ago

The Dutch Reach is a reach to ask for, IMO. I write this as a cyclist living in Vancouver (one city named in the article) who has been doored and nearly doored. IME, shoulder checks while actually driving seem to be a dying art form. So asking for a while-parked check like the Dutch Reach ... seems optimistic. But no harm in trying. The illustration is great. I applaud all efforts to make this technique more known. Fellow cyclists, you already know this, but please watch sideview mirrors of parked vehicles and all other signs of people and passengers and assume the worst. Infrastructure should, IMO, allow an extra foot or two in lane designs especially when they are adjacent to different users (i.e. motorist, cyclist, pedestrian). This allows for swervy cyclists, swervy motorists, bad parkers, and people "not from here" a safety buffer. The latter group is one you're just not going to ever reach with urban education like the article, yet they are a significant vehicular presence in a many popular cities, whether they're driving their own vehicles, an unfamiliar rental, or getting out of a taxi cab. I'll give an example. All infrastructure design decisions have pros and cons. Here's a style of bike lane on the "passenger" side that catches motorists off guard (when they park too far to the right, near the lane) and passengers off guard because neither expect to find a cyclist on their right. https://www.google.ca/maps/@49.2790648,-123.1195244,3a,75y,214.64h,71.34t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7rZLbmXvAV0-H9ApXRwRcg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 https://www.google.ca/maps/@49.2790648,-123.1195244,3a,75y,2... How about some opening-door-tech that alerts you quickly and loudly when an object approaches your door as you begin to swing it open? Good for passing traffic, bicycles, etc. BTW, I appreciate that cycling news shows up on HN from time to time. It's truly a civilized activity and IMO has an important role in the future of cities. Keep pedalling. :-)

Gibbon1 8y ago
A similar thing near where I live. They took out a lane, put in a turn median turn lane and a bike lane. And kept the on street parking. When it would have been much safer to just get rid of the on street parking. https://goo.gl/maps/736bR7HMats https://goo.gl/maps/736bR7HMats Edit: When I was in Taipei years ago they had dedicated lanes and over passes for Scooters. My thought is relatively roads for scooters and bicycles are really cheap. Another memory is when they built the highway 85 extension in the 90's bicyclists started using it in large numbers before it was open to traffic. That leaves me with the impression that the biggest impediment to getting people to ride bicycles is having to mix it up with auto traffic.

js2 8y ago

I'm a runner. Out of habit I usually run against traffic even when on the sidewalk. I'd be happy if drivers making a right out of a side street/driveway/parking lot would just come to a full stop behind the crosswalk and check to their right. Many drivers don't check to their right, or for that matter even come to a full stop when turning right. There isn't a single run I go on that I don't encounter at least one car rolling through a right. Running on the opposite sidewalk so that I'm running with traffic is no safer because then I have to look over my left shoulder at every crosswalk to make sure a car making a right off the main street isn't about to run me over as I enter a crosswalk. In summary: many drivers suck, don't follow the law, and self-driving cars can't get here soon enough.

notacoward 8y ago
Amen. I'll just add that sometimes part of the blame should also go to the planners who set up intersections with odd angles and obstructed sight lines so that drivers can't see anything until they're already intruding into the roadway. Related phenomenon: pedestrian crossings and cutouts placed twenty feet down a side street. Yeah, it might be further from the busier street, but it makes it much harder for either party to see each other or recognize each others' intentions. Ultimately quite bad for safety, even for regular pedestrians but especially for runners. No thanks. I'll stay out where I can see them and they can see me and there's no ambiguity about which direction I'm going, even if that means hopping on and off curbs.

rgj 8y ago

I'm Dutch. I've never heard of this, nor has anybody I asked about this. I've never even seen someone in the driver's seat use their right hand to open the door. Dooring is not an issue here either since Dutch cyclists tend to anticipate very well. What we do have here in the Netherlands are bike lanes, so in a lot of places the bikes pass the parked/stopping cars on the right hand side.

themodelplumber 8y ago
There are a lot of idioms in U.S. English which contain the word "dutch" but which are not recognizable to actual Dutch people. Some of these will come from e.g. stereotyped interactions with the Pennsylvania Dutch, etc.
- twblalock 8y ago
  This particular "dutch reach" idiom is not related to the Pennsylvania Dutch in any way.
  - Symbiote 8y ago
    None of the "Dutch" idioms will be from Pennsylvania Dutch, they all come from being the neighbour country to England.
    - laurentl 8y ago
      Ireland?
    - NeedMoreTea 8y ago
      Pennsylvanian "Dutch" is a corruption of "Deutsche", and the community German is it not? As I understood it many of American "Dutch" idioms were originally meant to be referencing German. You do get cookie from Dutch though. Cookie comes from the Dutch keokje.
      - stevesimmons 8y ago

twblalock 8y ago

This "Dutch reach" thing is an example of a phenomenon I've seen several times before. People who promote a practice seem to think their argument will be more persuasive if the practice came from an admired foreign country, yet the people who live in that country have never heard of it and/or do not commonly do it. In this case it's the Dutch, but I've seen all kinds of similar nonsense about Japan.

wool_gather 8y ago
The article explains clearly that it is a thing in the Netherlands; it's a standard part of driver education there. > “It’s just what Dutch people do,” said Fred Wegman, professor emeritus of Traffic Safety at Delft University of Technology and the former managing director of the National Institute for Road Safety Research SWOV in the Netherlands. “All Dutch are taught it. It’s part of regular driver education.”
- holstvoogd 8y ago
  weird, I wasn't, never heard of anyone who has. i should ask some colleagues if they were taught it.
  - wool_gather 8y ago
    Interesting; perhaps this Traffic Safety professor does not have a realistic view of driving instruction. I.e., it's part of the official curriculum but not actually taught?
    - rocqua 8y ago
      There is a theory test to a drivers license as well. It's never mentioned there. If it is a part of testing, it is probably a generic line 'Be mindful when getting out of the car'. Perhaps some instructors teach the 'dutch reach' as a trick for that. There are many such heuristics that are taught. For example, family of me was advised to wear contacts instead of glasses for the test because the legs of the glasses could block the instructors view of the eyes. Apparently, they want to see you check all angles.

sologoub 8y ago

Relying on an uncomfortable behavior change is one option, but as many have noted - really a “reach”. Why don’t we instead take the experience of cities that instead of trying to integrate cars and cyclists, integrated cyclists and pedestrians? Physics are more on your side here - a lot closer weight and size of objects. Possibly even closer speed differential. On a recent trip to Munich, the clear markings and cyclists on a protected wide sidewalk made a lot more sense. With cars and bikes sharing the narrow city roads, doorings are only one problem. Even side view mirrors can be a hazzard. It’s more costly to have wider side walks, but it’s so much safer!

mkingston 8y ago
Many cyclists travel quickly enough they find that having to give way at every side road (like a pedestrian would) is a tremendous hassle. If these routes were unbroken (as they are in a few places) this would be a great solution.
- sologoub 8y ago
  That’s definitely possible, but in most cities cross-traffic is a reality for cars and pedestrians alike. Cyclists and now electric scooters often run the stop signs, lights, etc. it’s debatable what’s safer for them, but for everyone around it becomes not just a “hassle” but a real hazard.
toast0 8y ago
As a bike commuter in a city environment, I'd rather be near cars than mix with pedestrians. Cars are more predictable, and move at closer speeds through downtown. Out of congested areas, where cars are going much faster than me, I like being farther away. At times, I do ride on the sidewalk because of road design or convenience, and it requires a much slower pace if there are pedestrians nearby.
- sologoub 8y ago
  Look up Munich- dedicated lanes for bikes, but on the side walk, so no mixing.

paulmatthijs 8y ago

Sorry to be a party pooper, but this is a non-existing thing (and a repost, btw). It’s true that we are taught to look over your shoulder when opening a car door, but to label it “the Dutch Reach” is really too much honor. It’s just common sense.

rocqua 8y ago

I'm dutch, and I've only ever heard about this on the internet, never here. Notably, I don't recall this whilst getting my driving license only 2 years ago. To check, I got my theory book. It says the following: > After the part about doing visual checks > When it is visually safe, hold the door handle with the left hand, and open the door using the right hand as far as is necessary and exit the vehicle. So it explicitly states that one should grab the door handle with the left hand, not the right. Moreover, one should check visually (using mirrors and an over the shoulder check) before doing 'the reach') I can't find the year of publishing, but it seems quite old, 2005-ish. The ISBN is: 978-90-72967-03-9 (26th printing) The original dutch: > Als het veilig is houdt u met uw linkerhand aan de handgreep het portier vast en opent u met uw rechterhand het portier zover als u nodig hebt en stapt uit.

kbenson 8y ago
> After the part about doing visual checks > When it is visually safe, hold the door handle with the left hand, and open the door using the right hand as far as is necessary and exit the vehicle. That is the Dutch reach, to my understanding. 99% Invisible did a story on it a couple years ago, and that was covered here.[1] 600 comments. 1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533
- blattimwind 8y ago
  No. The dutch reach is with the right hand, which forces you to turn the upper body to reach the handle. Supposedly this sort-of forces you to do a over the shoulder check. I think if you were taught proper driving technique, then there is no need for such concortions. You will always check the mirror and look over your shoulder before opening the door, even if only subconsciously. Just like you always check lengthwise traffic before making a turn, or checking traffic behind you before switching into another lane. This is an issue of driver's education. Not which hand you use to open the door.
  - Kim_Bruning 8y ago
    I think it also depends on whether you have auto-folding mirrors. (I was taught to check my rear-view mirror before opening the door. That doesn't work in my new car with folding mirrors; so now I sometimes use the dutch reach, even though I was never taught it back in the day)

afarrell 8y ago

The door handle of some models of the Mini Cooper affords doing the Dutch Reach. It is a circle with a shelf that faces forward in a way that makes it awkward to use the hand nearest the door to open. So, you reach across your body with your other hand and in doing so, you turn your body and head and your peripheral vision can catch a moving cyclist.

deleted 8y ago

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moron4hire 8y ago

I don't need to awkwardly reach across my body to remember to check for traffic before exiting my car after parallel parking. Here's what I do. I pop my door open an inch, just crack the seam, to give people behind me a signal that I'm exiting. Once the door is ajar, I do my check to see if the way is clear. As much as you should be worried about dooring a cyclist, you should be worried about getting cracked in the skull by your own door should a bus clip it.

jernfrost 8y ago

I think the key to safety for bikers in the Netherlands is simply the sheer number of them. When you visit the Netherlands. Within 15 minutes you have gotten used to scanning for bikers everywhere. There are so many of them and they come so frequently that you cannot not get into the habit of looking for them. The importance of numbers is something often overlooked. I read an article discussing the different approaches to biking the Netherlands and my native Norway has. Here in Norway we are obsessed with bike helmets. The dutch never use helmets. Yet we have more head injuries in Norway for bikers. So the number of bikers in the Netherlands seem to create a better protection for bikers than the usage of helmets. And here is the kicker: If you don't demand that people use helmets when biking, the number of bikers will rise to a level, where the number of injuries will be lower than if everybody used helmet. That is what the research suggested anyway. I will probably still use a helmet in Norway due to the terrain, but it is still food for thought I think.

agumonkey 8y ago
Cultural importance too. When so many people you may know are bikers, including you, you might empathize a lot more with them rather than see them as anonymous frail annoyances to pass.
- BrandoElFollito 8y ago
  This is a good point. When I turn right I always check my right mirror. This is not something I was specifically taught, this is something I do because I also bike a lot and am often on the bike lane on the right. (yes, the design of the lens is such that this should not be an issue but a lot of cyclists will still stupidly cross the crosding instead of following the U shaped path)
  - ambentzen 8y ago
    You where NOT taught to check that you are not turning into/across some one? WTH? When doing a maneuver you check your mirror AND turn your head. If you are not taught this I shudder to think what else where left out of your so-called drivers education.

huskyr 8y ago

Like many people already mentioned in this thread, it's silly to attribute bike safety in the Netherlands to just this. To get a better view on why bike safety is so much better here, i think this video really explains it very well in five minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2THe_10dYs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2THe_10dYs. The other videos are very much worth the watch as well.

anotherevan 8y ago

I've gone through bouts of trying to adopt this habit. One thing that makes it harder is that the door handle in my car is designed to make it easy to open with the door-side hand. It is forwards on the door (near the hinged end) and opens by pulling the handle back. If the handle was at the back of the door it would promote the habit as it would actually be easier to open the door by reaching across with the opposite hand then try to scrunch your door-side arm back to get at the handle. I wonder where the door handles are located in the majority of cars in Holland.

jorams 8y ago
> I wonder where the door handles are located in the majority of cars in Holland. The hinged end, just like yours.

jariz 8y ago

Every time a article like this is posted I'm just flabbergasted at the fact that 'looking behind you before actually opening a door' is such a foreign concept to Americans.

Kim_Bruning 8y ago
I don't even care about the cyclists[1]; I'll survive being hit by them }:-)>. It's the other motorized traffic I'm worried about! [1] I actually do. Maybe it'll be me someday. But for the sake of argument let's pretend.
blattimwind 8y ago
My impression is that driving education in the US is rather lacking overall, though it's of course not federalized, so there are probably fifty shades of deficiency. (That being said many driving schools here suck as well, though that's mostly a money drain for the driving students; 40 % or so failure rate in the practical exam).
- ant512 8y ago
  I've got a British driving license and an American driving license. The British driving license was hard work. The American driving license involved little more than proving I could make the car go forwards and that I had a pulse. There's really a 40% failure rate? That's insane given how easy it is to pass the test.
  - blattimwind 8y ago
    I remembered it wrong, it's 36 % for the theoretical and 28 % for the practical exam. https://www.kba.de/DE/Statistik/Kraftfahrer/Fahrerlaubnisse/Fahrerlaubnispruefungen/fe_p_zeitreihe.html?nn=651942 https://www.kba.de/DE/Statistik/Kraftfahrer/Fahrerlaubnisse/...

u801e 8y ago

Another no-tech way would be to repeal the keep as far right as practicable law that specifically applies to bicycles so that they have, by default, the right to the entire lane they're in. Then the general slow vehicle law would apply (meaning that one uses the rightmost lane available for traffic unless passing another vehicle or preparing to make a left turn).

frereubu 8y ago

When riding in London a few years ago I came off my bike when a car driver - who hadn't seen me - turned across the road in front of me. I slammed on my brakes, and went over the handlebars only a few inches before hitting the car. I landed on the road with my hip and my head whiplashed over into the road. If I hadn't been wearing a helmet I would undoubtedly have fractured my skull, and possible worse. Since then I've been a vocal proponent of helmets - in London - because this accident was nothing to do with my riding. I had a front light on, a reflective vest and light-coloured clothing. The real issue for me is cycling infrastructure. London is getting sort-of better. There are cycle "superhighways", but they're quite narrow and have their fair share of idiot cyclists who ride very fast and loose, and make it dangerous for other cyclists. If there was better infrastructure there might be a critical mass of more sedate cyclists who set the tone for cycling in general, so everyone takes account of that new paradigm. Until that happens, I don't think there's a good safe way of cycling in somewhere like London without a helmet.

bamboozled 8y ago
Sorry to hear about your accident. May I ask how fast were you going when this happened? I don't wear a helmet when commuting but I also rarely exceed 20km/h to avoid the exact kind of collision you just described. I have to say a helmet will help when going over the bars, but you could've just as easily been critically injured in other ways, such as breaking your neck, rupturing an artery etc. One thing you notice about cyclists and cars in Amsterdam is that everyone goes quite slowly and with a fairly high level of awareness.
- buschkowitz 8y ago
  You want to wear a helmet. The risk-reward ratio is highly in favor of wearing one. What is the burden of wearing one vs. having some protection in case you fly?
  - Xylakant 8y ago
    Do you wear helmet while driving a car? What’s the burden of wearing one vs. having some protection in case you have an accident? Car drivers are much more likely to die of head injuries than cyclists. Do you also wear a helmet while walking, especially in winter? What’s the burden of wearing one vs. having some protection in case you slip and fall? Why don’t we do that? Because while the burden is low - it’s mostly dragging the helmet around wherever you go and ruining your hardcut - the actual probability it might help is quite low. And with good infrastructure, the same is true for cycling. If you look at this years stats for causes of death for cyclists in Berlin for example, the leading cause is “crushed by a truck”. Note: if you do cycling for sports at high speeds or rough terrain: wear a helmet.

innomatics 8y ago

It would be wonderful if car makers could position the interior door latches to make this the natural way to open the door. E.g. just under the window near the pillar.

rhizome31 8y ago

If you think about it, it's crazy that personal motorized vehicles are allowed in cities. I mean, with the amount of petty legislation that we endure without thinking about it twice, having those huge noisy and smelly masses of metal moving freely in our streets is a bit insane.

dpezely 8y ago

While drivers may remember to "reach across your body" with opposite arm because they're in driving-mode, passengers probably won't-- from personal observation. Specifically, this is from experience involving a passenger door opening into a curb-side bicycle lane. The door opened before the car came to a complete stop and quite a ways back from the intersection. The car was still compressing front springs from braking when passenger door opened. (Enough other posts here today described what happened next.) Since then, I wear bold red striped shirts or jackets when riding and red helmet. When they found "Where's Waldo" (or "Where's Wally" for those from UK), I know that they've seen me, and that's the whole point. I've used this very successfully in my present home of Vancouver, BC. Previously, it also worked well when residing in SF and Seattle. There was a confirmed Waldo sighting near English Bay just yesterday, but now you can call me by my real name.

blunte 8y ago

I've spent time with Dutch drivers in cars in the country, and I have never seen them do this "Dutch reach". I like the idea, but I'm not convinced that it's really a thing here.

mirimir 8y ago

It's not just cyclists that hit opening motor vehicle doors. If nothing else, looking first is just self-preservation.

mcv 8y ago

Does anyone else have the problem that nytimes.com articles remove themselves after loading? I can see the content for about a second, and then it vanishes. Probably related to my browser settings, but this is the only site that does it.

mclehman 8y ago
I do as well, but only when using a browser embedded in my HN app (Materialistic). It's persisted during my Chrome -> Brave transition, so I'll be giving Firefox a try to see if that makes a difference.
- mcv 8y ago
  I've googled a bit and found more people who had this problem with Chrome. Sadly their solution (anonymous mode) doesn't fix the problem for me.

bastijn 8y ago

In NL this is not common either. This is not what keeps us safe. We use the mirror like any other country (but we do not forget). This topic has reached FP before. Original article and comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12674533

danieldk 8y ago
We use the mirror like any other country (but we do not forget). Except that passengers in the back seats do not have mirrors. Although I never learned the Dutch Reach (but I don't have a driver's license), my dad always warned us as a kid that we should check for cyclists before opening the door.
- rejschaap 8y ago
  The rear doors in my car can't open from the inside for the kid's safety. I always check the mirror on the passenger side and will ask my passenger to wait when necessary. My mother-in-law is notorious for throwing the door open wide without looking (often hitting parked cars). She can't be taught so I just put her on the back seat now. I live in an area where the parking spots are on the left side of the road. I don't know how common it is for Dutch people to check the mirror for the passengers door. Maybe it just depends on your mother-in-law.
- bastijn 8y ago
  Indeed. They can turn around or the driver signals to wait. Anyway, point is, Dutch reach is despite its name not a common thing in NL.

atoav 8y ago

During my driving test (rural countryside of Austria, after 2000) not doing the "Dutch Reach" could decide about fail or pass. Now I live in a bigger city and cycle every day and I wish this was common practice. As a cyclist you have to treat the typical motorist like an idiot with no perception of their surrounding and no knowledge of traffic rules. Sadly the same is true also for cyclists (especially with sunday-nice-weather-cyclists).

deleted 8y ago

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Doxin 8y ago

Another good trick is to pop the door before swinging it open. Pull the door handle so it pops out of the lock, but wait a second or two before actually opening it. This alerts any cyclists you might have missed that you're about to open the door.