8 ms·

I've been pulled over maybe 5 times over the years (headlight out, expired license plate sticker) and I have yet to have a bad experience with them. They have a

I've been pulled over maybe 5 times over the years (headlight out, expired license plate sticker) and I have yet to have a bad experience with them. They have always been friendly and I've never actually gotten a ticket, even on a time where I didn't have up to date proof of insurance in my car. People just don't usually write about the 99.9% of occurrences when nothing eventful happens. And many of the people who do have issues with the police provoked them by intentionally being difficult and/or rude.

ndnxhs 8y ago
I'm sure the 99% of interactions are perfectly fine but the number of bad interactions in the US seems way way above any other western country. There are numerous news stories about Australians gettting shot by police while traveling to America but virtually none from within Australia. Last police shooting I remember in Australia was when the person was running at the police with a knife.
- weberc2 8y ago
  I genuinely wonder if the US has more violent criminals or something. Perhaps worse mental health or drug rehab services. Unfortunately it’s such a politicized issue I don’t hope to get good answers in the near term.
  - httpsterio 8y ago
    That would be ironic.
  - gmueckl 8y ago
    The other thing that makes me wonder is the fact that police officers are rarely teamed up in the US. A lone cop is bound to be more nervous and ready to reach for a weapon than when he is covered by a partner standing 5m behind with a hand on his gun holster (which is e.g. German procedure).
    - weberc2 8y ago
      This seems like an interesting prospect. I wish the U.S. kept better data so we could more easily see if there is a correlation.
  - petre 8y ago
    You have guns, which leads to the police having military equipment and being more violent. The Swiss also have guns but I haven't seen a lot of news news about mass shootings or police abuse in Switzerland.
    - tialaramex 8y ago
      Americans love bringing up Switzerland, but the US has way more guns than everywhere else. Way more (per person). Nobody in Switzerland would say "OK, Fred does seem to be a violent nutjob who beats his wife, but we can't very well stop Fred having a gun" but in the US taking away Fred's gun is genuinely considered a contentious idea. Also, as you'd expect given it has all these guns, Switzerland sees a higher rate of gun deaths than most European countries. If your goal is "lets have fewer gun deaths" the lesson is still "have fewer guns" not "copy Swiss culture".
      - weberc2 8y ago
        > Nobody in Switzerland would say "OK, Fred does seem to be a violent nutjob who beats his wife, but we can't very well stop Fred having a gun" but in the US taking away Fred's gun is genuinely considered a contentious idea. This surprises me. I have quite a few family members who are card-carrying NRA members and they all seem to support restrictions for violent offenders and mentally ill. I don't doubt that reduced access to guns would reduce gun deaths, but if there is a cultural element--for example, if inner-city cultures are more violent (this is an example; no idea what percentage of gun deaths are attributable to inner-city violence), perhaps we should tackle that problem instead of taking guns away from responsible gun owners.
  - rectang 8y ago
    > I genuinely wonder if the US has more violent criminals or something. Well, there are many people on this thread who tell you that since they have never had a problem, the problem must not exist.
    - weberc2 8y ago
      Where are these people? I'm only seeing "I've never had a problem", not "...therefore the problem must not exist".
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Part of it may be simply that USA as a country has 20 times more people average country in EU. More people means more policemen, means more occurrences of police misbehaviour. Unfortunately, reporting is not weighed by population.
  - gonvaled 8y ago
    What? We are talking percentages here, so number of people has no impact. Density could be a factor, but then you need to explain, on top, why Europe, being much more dense than the USA, has fewer relative police incidents.
  - Brybry 8y ago
    The Guardian and Washington Post databases do list per million statistics by State. It's also very easy to calculate the number yourself: 3 to 6+ per million in the US (depends on source) and you'll have a hard time finding a Western European country with even 1 per million. Stats from Belgium would be interesting but I couldn't find any. Also consider that England and Wales has a higher number of police per capita (~302) than the US (~284). "In the first 24 days of 2015, police in the US [population 316 million] fatally shot more people than police did in England and Wales [population 56.9 million], combined, over the past 24 years." The whole US justice and law enforcement system has serious issues. Look at the incarceration rate compared to the rest of the world, it's absurd.
- masonic 8y ago
  There are numerous news stories about Australians gettting shot by police while traveling to America Name any three.
songshu 8y ago
I get that it can seem unreasonable that people expect police to behave legally even in the presence of difficult or rude people. After all, very few of us enjoy dealing with difficult or rude people. Maybe very few of us are qualified to be police officers.
perl4ever 8y ago
If someone profiles you as a threat, you cannot generally redeem yourself by your subsequent behavior. Confirmation bias is very powerful. I was stopped once and before I had a chance to say or do anything, the officer decided that I was too quiet and therefore "nervous" and things cascaded from there. But it's not as though I changed my personality in order to avoid being treated badly. What I did do was grow out of being a skinny young male and driving across the country. You can't grow out of some visible categories though.
InclinedPlane 8y ago
Can you point me to the law or the part of the constitution which allows for summary execution without a trial for rudeness to law enforcement officers? I'm not aware of such, and to me it seems to run counter to the principles embodied in the constitution.
- i_cant_speel 8y ago
  I wasn't saying that the rudeness leads to and justifies officers acting illegally. I'm saying the rudeness leads to officers acting in ways that people tend to complain about (and you hear about). I certainly wasn't trying to imply that being rude justifies an officer pulling a gun or anything like that.

ndnxhs 8y ago

I'm sure the 99% of interactions are perfectly fine but the number of bad interactions in the US seems way way above any other western country. There are numerous news stories about Australians gettting shot by police while traveling to America but virtually none from within Australia. Last police shooting I remember in Australia was when the person was running at the police with a knife.

weberc2 8y ago
I genuinely wonder if the US has more violent criminals or something. Perhaps worse mental health or drug rehab services. Unfortunately it’s such a politicized issue I don’t hope to get good answers in the near term.
- httpsterio 8y ago
  That would be ironic.
- gmueckl 8y ago
  The other thing that makes me wonder is the fact that police officers are rarely teamed up in the US. A lone cop is bound to be more nervous and ready to reach for a weapon than when he is covered by a partner standing 5m behind with a hand on his gun holster (which is e.g. German procedure).
  - weberc2 8y ago
    This seems like an interesting prospect. I wish the U.S. kept better data so we could more easily see if there is a correlation.
- petre 8y ago
  You have guns, which leads to the police having military equipment and being more violent. The Swiss also have guns but I haven't seen a lot of news news about mass shootings or police abuse in Switzerland.
  - tialaramex 8y ago
    Americans love bringing up Switzerland, but the US has way more guns than everywhere else. Way more (per person). Nobody in Switzerland would say "OK, Fred does seem to be a violent nutjob who beats his wife, but we can't very well stop Fred having a gun" but in the US taking away Fred's gun is genuinely considered a contentious idea. Also, as you'd expect given it has all these guns, Switzerland sees a higher rate of gun deaths than most European countries. If your goal is "lets have fewer gun deaths" the lesson is still "have fewer guns" not "copy Swiss culture".
    - weberc2 8y ago
      > Nobody in Switzerland would say "OK, Fred does seem to be a violent nutjob who beats his wife, but we can't very well stop Fred having a gun" but in the US taking away Fred's gun is genuinely considered a contentious idea. This surprises me. I have quite a few family members who are card-carrying NRA members and they all seem to support restrictions for violent offenders and mentally ill. I don't doubt that reduced access to guns would reduce gun deaths, but if there is a cultural element--for example, if inner-city cultures are more violent (this is an example; no idea what percentage of gun deaths are attributable to inner-city violence), perhaps we should tackle that problem instead of taking guns away from responsible gun owners.
- rectang 8y ago
  > I genuinely wonder if the US has more violent criminals or something. Well, there are many people on this thread who tell you that since they have never had a problem, the problem must not exist.
  - weberc2 8y ago
    Where are these people? I'm only seeing "I've never had a problem", not "...therefore the problem must not exist".
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
TeMPOraL 8y ago
Part of it may be simply that USA as a country has 20 times more people average country in EU. More people means more policemen, means more occurrences of police misbehaviour. Unfortunately, reporting is not weighed by population.
- gonvaled 8y ago
  What? We are talking percentages here, so number of people has no impact. Density could be a factor, but then you need to explain, on top, why Europe, being much more dense than the USA, has fewer relative police incidents.
- Brybry 8y ago
  The Guardian and Washington Post databases do list per million statistics by State. It's also very easy to calculate the number yourself: 3 to 6+ per million in the US (depends on source) and you'll have a hard time finding a Western European country with even 1 per million. Stats from Belgium would be interesting but I couldn't find any. Also consider that England and Wales has a higher number of police per capita (~302) than the US (~284). "In the first 24 days of 2015, police in the US [population 316 million] fatally shot more people than police did in England and Wales [population 56.9 million], combined, over the past 24 years." The whole US justice and law enforcement system has serious issues. Look at the incarceration rate compared to the rest of the world, it's absurd.
masonic 8y ago
There are numerous news stories about Australians gettting shot by police while traveling to America Name any three.

songshu 8y ago

I get that it can seem unreasonable that people expect police to behave legally even in the presence of difficult or rude people. After all, very few of us enjoy dealing with difficult or rude people. Maybe very few of us are qualified to be police officers.

perl4ever 8y ago

If someone profiles you as a threat, you cannot generally redeem yourself by your subsequent behavior. Confirmation bias is very powerful. I was stopped once and before I had a chance to say or do anything, the officer decided that I was too quiet and therefore "nervous" and things cascaded from there. But it's not as though I changed my personality in order to avoid being treated badly. What I did do was grow out of being a skinny young male and driving across the country. You can't grow out of some visible categories though.

InclinedPlane 8y ago

Can you point me to the law or the part of the constitution which allows for summary execution without a trial for rudeness to law enforcement officers? I'm not aware of such, and to me it seems to run counter to the principles embodied in the constitution.

i_cant_speel 8y ago
I wasn't saying that the rudeness leads to and justifies officers acting illegally. I'm saying the rudeness leads to officers acting in ways that people tend to complain about (and you hear about). I certainly wasn't trying to imply that being rude justifies an officer pulling a gun or anything like that.