4 ms·

People especially here constantly rail against Europe, specifically their start-up scene, against taxes, against regulations, etc. At the same time, our cities

People especially here constantly rail against Europe, specifically their start-up scene, against taxes, against regulations, etc. At the same time, our cities are unlivable, inaccessible, crowded, our infrastructure is falling apart, a widening gap between the wealthy and the poor causing increases in homelessness in cities and opiod addiction in rural areas. Western Europe isn't utopia, but in many areas, their policies are actually in the public interest and raise most people up[0]. [0] Perhaps not natives, but that's another story.

lewis500 8y ago
Our cities are "crowded" and "unlivable"? If they're so unlivable then why do so many people want to live there that they're crowded? Especially when the country is full of suburbs...suburbs, where, in fact, most people live. Our cities are way less dense than many European cities. In fact they are way less dense than they used to be in many cases.
BonjelaSoup 8y ago
> "People especially here constantly rail against Europe" > "our cities" Where is "here" and "our cities"?
- nojvek 8y ago
  Most likely US
- stephengillie 8y ago
  People love to cherry pick a statistic from one European city, and ask why all of the American empire can't be like that. /s/public transportation/health care/cars/etc.
  - lasc4r 8y ago
    Cherry picking isn't really needed, infrastructure and health care are a disaster here. edit: For some perspective, there are 240,000 water main breaks every year in the US, wasting over 2 trillion gallons of treated drinking water. https://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/cat-item/drinking-water https://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/cat-item/drinking-w...
    - stephengillie 8y ago
      These statistics are only possible in a nation that has over 240,000 water mains (or do some break more than once a year?) A smaller nation can choose a solution that works better at smaller scales, but doesn't scare well - because they don't need it to scale much. A larger empire has fewer options.
      - ric2b 8y ago
        Europe has far more people than the US, I don't know what you're on about.
unit91 8y ago
> our cities are unlivable false by definition
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
tengbretson 8y ago
>a widening gap between the wealthy and the poor causing increases in homelessness in cities For starters, I'd be curious to see a source on whether or not the United States even has a significantly increasing number of homeless per-capita. Secondly, even if that is the case, the causal relationship between the wealth gap and homelessness would be speculative at best.
- crote 8y ago
  Let's see what happens when you hit rock bottom in The Netherlands, so zero wealth and zero income. I'm assuming you're about 30, single, and have no kids. First, there is social housing available at a price between €335 and €710. True, you may have to wait a little for a house, but if it's a critical situation you will get priority. As you have no income, you will also get rent subsidies. After those, you'll pay roughly €250 / month for rent. Second, healthcare. Health insurance is mandatory and covers practically everything, so you'll still have this. No need to worry about healthcare costs. You still have to pay for it. With a €385 / year copay, it costs you €94 / month. With a €885 copay, it'll cost you €75 / month. As you have no income, the government will subsidize your healthcare for €94 / month. Net cost: between €0 and €-20 / month. Yes, you can actually profit on healthcare. Third, welfare. About €930 / month. Let's look at some basic needs: heating is about €75, electricity is €28, water is €10, a 50/5 internet connection is €25, a basic 100 minutes, 100 sms, 1 GB internet mobile phone connection is about €7. There are some municipal taxes, but you don't have to pay any of them because you have no income. This leaves you with about €535 a month for food, clothing, and all your other stuff. Note that I intentionally did not mention any car costs: you don't need it for grocery shopping, and you don't need it for a job, so any use is only incidental. If you even want to keep it, the main cost would be insurance, and that starts at €20 / month. So let's look at the original question: is there a causal relationship between the wealth gap and homelessness? I'd say there is, because when rich people pay slightly higher taxes, literally nobody has to be homeless because the government will pay for their safety net. So how many people depend on this? Roughly 6%. This means that, on average, every working person has to pay €75 / month in taxes for a guaranteed safety net, including housing and healthcare. If you consider the amount of taxes you pay, that's not such a bad deal.
calcifer 8y ago
> Perhaps not natives, but that's another story At the risk of inviting some xenophobic and/or racist commentary, I'll bite. What's your story?
dbuder 8y ago
All while using technology developed somewhere else and produced somewhere else.

lewis500 8y ago

Our cities are "crowded" and "unlivable"? If they're so unlivable then why do so many people want to live there that they're crowded? Especially when the country is full of suburbs...suburbs, where, in fact, most people live. Our cities are way less dense than many European cities. In fact they are way less dense than they used to be in many cases.

BonjelaSoup 8y ago

> "People especially here constantly rail against Europe" > "our cities" Where is "here" and "our cities"?

nojvek 8y ago
Most likely US
stephengillie 8y ago
People love to cherry pick a statistic from one European city, and ask why all of the American empire can't be like that. /s/public transportation/health care/cars/etc.
- lasc4r 8y ago
  Cherry picking isn't really needed, infrastructure and health care are a disaster here. edit: For some perspective, there are 240,000 water main breaks every year in the US, wasting over 2 trillion gallons of treated drinking water. https://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/cat-item/drinking-water https://www.infrastructurereportcard.org/cat-item/drinking-w...
  - stephengillie 8y ago
    These statistics are only possible in a nation that has over 240,000 water mains (or do some break more than once a year?) A smaller nation can choose a solution that works better at smaller scales, but doesn't scare well - because they don't need it to scale much. A larger empire has fewer options.
    - ric2b 8y ago
      Europe has far more people than the US, I don't know what you're on about.

unit91 8y ago

> our cities are unlivable false by definition

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

tengbretson 8y ago

>a widening gap between the wealthy and the poor causing increases in homelessness in cities For starters, I'd be curious to see a source on whether or not the United States even has a significantly increasing number of homeless per-capita. Secondly, even if that is the case, the causal relationship between the wealth gap and homelessness would be speculative at best.

crote 8y ago
Let's see what happens when you hit rock bottom in The Netherlands, so zero wealth and zero income. I'm assuming you're about 30, single, and have no kids. First, there is social housing available at a price between €335 and €710. True, you may have to wait a little for a house, but if it's a critical situation you will get priority. As you have no income, you will also get rent subsidies. After those, you'll pay roughly €250 / month for rent. Second, healthcare. Health insurance is mandatory and covers practically everything, so you'll still have this. No need to worry about healthcare costs. You still have to pay for it. With a €385 / year copay, it costs you €94 / month. With a €885 copay, it'll cost you €75 / month. As you have no income, the government will subsidize your healthcare for €94 / month. Net cost: between €0 and €-20 / month. Yes, you can actually profit on healthcare. Third, welfare. About €930 / month. Let's look at some basic needs: heating is about €75, electricity is €28, water is €10, a 50/5 internet connection is €25, a basic 100 minutes, 100 sms, 1 GB internet mobile phone connection is about €7. There are some municipal taxes, but you don't have to pay any of them because you have no income. This leaves you with about €535 a month for food, clothing, and all your other stuff. Note that I intentionally did not mention any car costs: you don't need it for grocery shopping, and you don't need it for a job, so any use is only incidental. If you even want to keep it, the main cost would be insurance, and that starts at €20 / month. So let's look at the original question: is there a causal relationship between the wealth gap and homelessness? I'd say there is, because when rich people pay slightly higher taxes, literally nobody has to be homeless because the government will pay for their safety net. So how many people depend on this? Roughly 6%. This means that, on average, every working person has to pay €75 / month in taxes for a guaranteed safety net, including housing and healthcare. If you consider the amount of taxes you pay, that's not such a bad deal.

calcifer 8y ago

> Perhaps not natives, but that's another story At the risk of inviting some xenophobic and/or racist commentary, I'll bite. What's your story?

dbuder 8y ago

All while using technology developed somewhere else and produced somewhere else.