4 ms·

Sure those places are “liberal” unless a working class person is also a gay man who is afraid of being beaten to death in the streets. I associate the housing

by romed 8y ago

Sure those places are “liberal” unless a working class person is also a gay man who is afraid of being beaten to death in the streets. I associate the housing crisis not really with liberal hypocrites but rather with ineffectual old ways of being “green”. Tons of Boomer environmentalists think you can save the planet by recycling, driving a Prius, and not wearing furs. That’s why the hot issue in Berkeley is plastic straws when they are undergoing a severe housing shortage. The fact is that installing a family in an existing dense, walkable city is the greenest thing that can be done. Being a NIMBY and having your Prius serviced by a mechanic who commutes three hours each way from Turlock is not green at all.

bluGill 8y ago
You won't be beaten to death in Red states. They will make you feel unwelcome/uncomfortable, but they are not so violent as to beat you to death. Yes some people are that violent. However such people are everywhere. You are more likely to find them in the blue states just because the population density is higher.
- bobthepanda 8y ago
  Even if homophobes are just as present, blue states have a more accommodating legal framework to prosecute them. LGBT persons are not a protected class at the federal level: look at a map of states that include it as a protected class, and nearly all the states that don't include it are red. http://www.lgbtmap.org/equality-maps/non_discrimination_laws http://www.lgbtmap.org/equality-maps/non_discrimination_laws
- komali2 8y ago
  The FBI seems to disagree. https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-11 https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-11 https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-12 https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-12 Note that the tables seem to differentiate between The state with the most hate crimes was California, at 931. California's population is 40 million. Next up is New York, at 595 incidents over 20 million citizens. Pretty close per person to California. (.000023 vs .000029, someone check my math). Next up... Ohio, 442 incidents to 10 million citizens. .000044. Michigan, 399 to 10 million. Kentucky, oh Kentucky, 206 to 4.4 million.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- romed 8y ago
  I'm sorry but I am from Oklahoma and you are incorrect. Gay people are regularly beaten, threatened, have their houses burned, and are even murdered. It has been less than a year since drive-by shootings at LGBT organizations in both Tulsa and Oklahoma City. "In March, the Tulsa headquarters of Oklahomans for Equality was the victim of a similar incident. Security camera video caught a white truck drive by and fire more than a dozen times at the center early in the morning on March 6."
api 8y ago
That was kind of my "meta" point. Social liberalism and economic liberalism have diverged. "Blue states" are more socially tolerant and liberal but have become strongholds for Plutocrats where everyone below the upper middle or "professional" class is paying >50% of their income to real estate or is priced out entirely. "Red states" tend toward the socially reactionary but offer an economic environment that's overall better for average working middle class people. You can afford a place to live and the general cost of living tends to be a lot lower.
- metalliqaz 8y ago
  This is an over generalization. Red state or blue state, where wealth centralizes, poor people are priced out. Notice that the cities with the highest wealth gaps are not exclusively in blue states.[1] Likewise, expensive blue states like MA and CA have plenty of places to find affordable housing, they just don't happen to be in the middle of Boston or San Francisco. [1] http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/06/21/25-US-Cities-Worst-Income-Inequality http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/06/21/25-US-Cities-Worst-...
- adamwong246 8y ago
  But this has nothing at all to do with social issues or land use policies- the land is cheaper, simply because the demand is lower and the supply is higher.
nostromo 8y ago
> Sure those places are “liberal” unless a working class person is also a gay man who is afraid of being beaten to death in the streets. As a gay man from Idaho I’d love it if you could chill out with the hyperbole.
- romed 8y ago
  "Steven Nelson died after he responded to an online ad promising a sexual encounter. He was instead attacked by Kelly Schneider, who yelled homophobic slurs while kicking him repeatedly with steel-toed boots, then stripped and robbed him in the pre-dawn darkness near Gott’s Point, prosecutors have said."
  - stale2002 8y ago
    And yet here you are responding to a person who said that he was actually gay, and telling you that you are exaggerating. How about you let the people you are talking about speak for themselves?

by romed 8y ago

bluGill 8y ago

You won't be beaten to death in Red states. They will make you feel unwelcome/uncomfortable, but they are not so violent as to beat you to death. Yes some people are that violent. However such people are everywhere. You are more likely to find them in the blue states just because the population density is higher.

bobthepanda 8y ago
Even if homophobes are just as present, blue states have a more accommodating legal framework to prosecute them. LGBT persons are not a protected class at the federal level: look at a map of states that include it as a protected class, and nearly all the states that don't include it are red. http://www.lgbtmap.org/equality-maps/non_discrimination_laws http://www.lgbtmap.org/equality-maps/non_discrimination_laws
komali2 8y ago
The FBI seems to disagree. https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-11 https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-11 https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-12 https://ucr.fbi.gov/hate-crime/2016/tables/table-12 Note that the tables seem to differentiate between The state with the most hate crimes was California, at 931. California's population is 40 million. Next up is New York, at 595 incidents over 20 million citizens. Pretty close per person to California. (.000023 vs .000029, someone check my math). Next up... Ohio, 442 incidents to 10 million citizens. .000044. Michigan, 399 to 10 million. Kentucky, oh Kentucky, 206 to 4.4 million.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
romed 8y ago
I'm sorry but I am from Oklahoma and you are incorrect. Gay people are regularly beaten, threatened, have their houses burned, and are even murdered. It has been less than a year since drive-by shootings at LGBT organizations in both Tulsa and Oklahoma City. "In March, the Tulsa headquarters of Oklahomans for Equality was the victim of a similar incident. Security camera video caught a white truck drive by and fire more than a dozen times at the center early in the morning on March 6."

api 8y ago

That was kind of my "meta" point. Social liberalism and economic liberalism have diverged. "Blue states" are more socially tolerant and liberal but have become strongholds for Plutocrats where everyone below the upper middle or "professional" class is paying >50% of their income to real estate or is priced out entirely. "Red states" tend toward the socially reactionary but offer an economic environment that's overall better for average working middle class people. You can afford a place to live and the general cost of living tends to be a lot lower.

metalliqaz 8y ago
This is an over generalization. Red state or blue state, where wealth centralizes, poor people are priced out. Notice that the cities with the highest wealth gaps are not exclusively in blue states.[1] Likewise, expensive blue states like MA and CA have plenty of places to find affordable housing, they just don't happen to be in the middle of Boston or San Francisco. [1] http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/06/21/25-US-Cities-Worst-Income-Inequality http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/06/21/25-US-Cities-Worst-...
adamwong246 8y ago
But this has nothing at all to do with social issues or land use policies- the land is cheaper, simply because the demand is lower and the supply is higher.

nostromo 8y ago

> Sure those places are “liberal” unless a working class person is also a gay man who is afraid of being beaten to death in the streets. As a gay man from Idaho I’d love it if you could chill out with the hyperbole.

romed 8y ago
"Steven Nelson died after he responded to an online ad promising a sexual encounter. He was instead attacked by Kelly Schneider, who yelled homophobic slurs while kicking him repeatedly with steel-toed boots, then stripped and robbed him in the pre-dawn darkness near Gott’s Point, prosecutors have said."
- stale2002 8y ago
  And yet here you are responding to a person who said that he was actually gay, and telling you that you are exaggerating. How about you let the people you are talking about speak for themselves?