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The "winning" scenario for the United States is that China agrees to change its IP policies. IP is America's most valuable product, and the Chinese have been st

The "winning" scenario for the United States is that China agrees to change its IP policies. IP is America's most valuable product, and the Chinese have been stealing it with 0 consequences for decades. A win on this front would see an end (or at least decrease) in cyberattacks and more US friendly IP laws.

kevin_b_er 8y ago
And the "losing" scenario is a WTO ruling like Antigua and Barbuda where China is directly permitted to ignore US copyrights and patents from trade disputes.
- lovich 8y ago
  Aren't they doing that anyway? It was my understanding that most companies didn't send their latest generation products to be built in China due to them bring consistently stolen and china not backing up the IP protections
h8liu 8y ago
Like which IP policy? Any specific policy document that you can point out? China has been having IP laws and protection since around 1980, and China government never said once that stealing IP is okay. It is IP law execution and enforcement in China that is sub-par. Policing is sometimes hard. Also, I believe the US really wants to treat IP as an "asset" rather than a "product".
- ThomPete 8y ago
  They don't enforce it it's a major issue both for the US and EU.
  - h8liu 8y ago
    True, and it is also a major issue for many Chinese companies.. And rather than going to the court for justice, the US place tariffs for a war..
- chelical 8y ago
  China has actively promoted and condoned IP theft as a way of catching up to the US. I'm surprised you're unaware of the widespread coordinated Chinese industrial espionage, especially by Chinese students studying abroad in America. The IP laws and protections in China exist primarily so they can claim they're following the rules.
  - cuboidGoat 8y ago
    Sounds like they are mirroring the behaviour of the US toward Europe in the 18th and 19th centuries. >Last month, Attorney General Eric Holder announced that the United States was charging members of the Chinese military with economic espionage. Stealing trade secrets from American companies, he said, enabled China to “illegally sabotage” foreign competitors and propel its own companies to “success in the international marketplace.” The United States should know. That’s pretty much how we got our start as a manufacturing power, too. >The United States emerged as the world’s industrial leader by illicitly appropriating mechanical and scientific innovations from Europe,” the historian Doron Ben-Atar observes in his book “Trade Secrets.” Throughout the late eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, American industrial spies roamed the British Isles, seeking not just new machines but skilled workers who could run and maintain those machines. One of these artisans was Samuel Slater, often called “the father of the American industrial revolution.” He emigrated here in 1789, posing as a farmhand and bringing with him an intimate knowledge of the Arkwright spinning frames that had transformed textile production in England, and he set up the first water-powered textile mill in the U.S. Two decades later, the American businessman Francis Cabot Lowell talked his way into a number of British mills, and memorized the plans to the Cartwright power loom. When he returned home, he built his own version of the loom, and became the most successful industrialist of his time. >The American government often encouraged such piracy. Alexander Hamilton, in his 1791 “Report on Manufactures,” called on the country to reward those who brought us “improvements and secrets of extraordinary value” from elsewhere. State governments financed the importation of smuggled machines. And although federal patents were supposed to be granted only to people who came up with original inventions, Ben-Atar shows that, in practice, Americans were receiving patents for technology pirated from abroad. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/06/09/spy-vs-spy-3 https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/06/09/spy-vs-spy-3

kevin_b_er 8y ago

And the "losing" scenario is a WTO ruling like Antigua and Barbuda where China is directly permitted to ignore US copyrights and patents from trade disputes.

lovich 8y ago
Aren't they doing that anyway? It was my understanding that most companies didn't send their latest generation products to be built in China due to them bring consistently stolen and china not backing up the IP protections

h8liu 8y ago

Like which IP policy? Any specific policy document that you can point out? China has been having IP laws and protection since around 1980, and China government never said once that stealing IP is okay. It is IP law execution and enforcement in China that is sub-par. Policing is sometimes hard. Also, I believe the US really wants to treat IP as an "asset" rather than a "product".

ThomPete 8y ago
They don't enforce it it's a major issue both for the US and EU.
- h8liu 8y ago
  True, and it is also a major issue for many Chinese companies.. And rather than going to the court for justice, the US place tariffs for a war..
chelical 8y ago
China has actively promoted and condoned IP theft as a way of catching up to the US. I'm surprised you're unaware of the widespread coordinated Chinese industrial espionage, especially by Chinese students studying abroad in America. The IP laws and protections in China exist primarily so they can claim they're following the rules.
- cuboidGoat 8y ago
  Sounds like they are mirroring the behaviour of the US toward Europe in the 18th and 19th centuries. >Last month, Attorney General Eric Holder announced that the United States was charging members of the Chinese military with economic espionage. Stealing trade secrets from American companies, he said, enabled China to “illegally sabotage” foreign competitors and propel its own companies to “success in the international marketplace.” The United States should know. That’s pretty much how we got our start as a manufacturing power, too. >The United States emerged as the world’s industrial leader by illicitly appropriating mechanical and scientific innovations from Europe,” the historian Doron Ben-Atar observes in his book “Trade Secrets.” Throughout the late eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, American industrial spies roamed the British Isles, seeking not just new machines but skilled workers who could run and maintain those machines. One of these artisans was Samuel Slater, often called “the father of the American industrial revolution.” He emigrated here in 1789, posing as a farmhand and bringing with him an intimate knowledge of the Arkwright spinning frames that had transformed textile production in England, and he set up the first water-powered textile mill in the U.S. Two decades later, the American businessman Francis Cabot Lowell talked his way into a number of British mills, and memorized the plans to the Cartwright power loom. When he returned home, he built his own version of the loom, and became the most successful industrialist of his time. >The American government often encouraged such piracy. Alexander Hamilton, in his 1791 “Report on Manufactures,” called on the country to reward those who brought us “improvements and secrets of extraordinary value” from elsewhere. State governments financed the importation of smuggled machines. And although federal patents were supposed to be granted only to people who came up with original inventions, Ben-Atar shows that, in practice, Americans were receiving patents for technology pirated from abroad. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/06/09/spy-vs-spy-3 https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/06/09/spy-vs-spy-3